Hornby Class 71

[DaveClass47]

I'm not sure what relevance this has to Hornby's - or anyone's - Class 71. The 71 was a 750 v dc loco, whether on conductor rail or OLE, and ran in SE London and Kent. The market for such a model is quite different from that for 25kv ac locos running north of London. I will not be pleading with Hornby for anything, thanks.

Hi,

 

WDP4D is spot on with his response to your initial post....

 

I am aware of the differences between the 71 and 91 (and not just that one has a 7 and the other a 9 in its number).   The point I was making is that Hornby have now shown a willingness to model Electrics with a pantograph (also whether they run on AC or DC).   Why am I surprised by this? Well speaking to Simon Kohler at a show last year he said that Hornby had tended to shy away from detailed pantograph locos as they didn't tend to have much success with them. So to find that they are now tackling a model with a pantograph is encouraging and possibly shows a change in direction for Hornby?...only time will tell.

 

I hope Hornby have masses of success with the 71, they deserve to having seen the initial rapid prototype model.   Maybe this will give them the confidence to model more 'electrics', whether that is the 81,86,87 or 91.

 

Dont feel you have to plead with Hornby....again, you're taking what I said a tad too literally.

Edited July 27, 2015 by DaveClass47

[WDP4D]

Abiding by Mod4's post....

 

I am still shocked that Hornby did the Class 71. It's understandable in DJM's approach as it was funded, however I've also been told numerous times by Hornby and I quote Dave "Hornby had tended to shy away from detailed pantograph locos as they didn't tend to have much success with them." The Class 71 is a niche model and yes had it's pros and cons during operational years, limited to one small region, limited in terms of livery, not that good in terms of looks. I still don't understand if electrics don't sell then why do the Hornby versions of the Class 86, 87, 90, 91 and 92 feature almost every year in their ranges? And they still issue them as main range models too.

 

So it is a bit of news that Hornby did this!

[big jim]

The 71 was a 750 v dc loco, whether on conductor rail or OLE, and ran in SE London and Kent.

Showing my ignorance now, how common was (or is) 750v DC overheads around the london area?

[The Stationmaster]

Showing my ignorance now, how common was (or is) 750v DC overheads around the london area?

Most of the freight yards where the electric locos worked had the overhead installed.  But we are talking basically South Eastern Division which in the London area really meant Hither Green (definitely) and possibly some in the vicinity of Stewarts Lane.  basically it was done in order to avoid having the 3rd rail where Shunters were heavily engaged in their work on sidings etc.

[Gwiwer]

Most of the freight yards where the electric locos worked had the overhead installed.  But we are talking basically South Eastern Division which in the London area really meant Hither Green (definitely) and possibly some in the vicinity of Stewarts Lane.  basically it was done in order to avoid having the 3rd rail where Shunters were heavily engaged in their work on sidings etc.

 

And Balcombe siding on the Brighton line.  Though that might have gone by the time the 71s arrived and was in any case well off their normal territory.

 

In short answer - very uncommon.  In a little more detail - it was anticipated in some quarters when the 71s were designed that Kent Coast electrification, which had then only just got under way, might need more yards to be overhead-wired for staff safety but that did not prove to be the case.  There was significant domestic traffic (including some from the Kent coal fields at one time) and international services via the Dover train ferry.  Most sidings actually stayed non-electrified other than perhaps a reception road and with shunt moves performed by class 08, 09 or 12 locos and sometimes by the main line loco.  Often that was a 33 but 24s were not unknown at one stage on cross-London transfer freights.

[Dogmatix]

Showing my ignorance now, how common was (or is) 750v DC overheads around the london area?

 

And the corresponding question -  how many other locomotives (apart from the 71's) could use them?

[jjb1970]

One part of me say's that if there is sufficient demand for a class 71 (and it is being done by two manufacturers) then there must be demand for the much longer lived 25KV AC electrics, however on the other hand it requires much less of a leap of the imagination to run third rail electrics on a layout with no third rail than it does overhead electrics with no overhead wires. So maybe one reason there seems to be more interest in third rail models is as simple as that? I must admit, the flurry of third rail electric models over recent years has been one of the real highlights of the hobby for me and it has been a real pleasure to see an area of operations ignored for so long getting some attention. The third rail network is the most intensively worked area of the UK rail network yet for many years it was all but ignored, for many years even Southern steam was the poor relation of the big four despite being the home of some lovely looking and very interesting types.

[DavidH]

And the corresponding question -  how many other locomotives (apart from the 71's) could use them?

 

Three: 20001, 20002, 20003

[bigherb]

And the corresponding question -  how many other locomotives (apart from the 71's) could use them?

The other three Hornbys the proper class 70.

[The Stationmaster]

The Southern Electric site has what appears to be a complete list of the yards etc provided with overhead wiring, as follows -

 

Hither Green yard, Sittingbourne, Bricklayers Arms, Plumstead sidings, Angerstein Wharf, Hoo Jcn, Faversham, Shepherds Well, Dover Town, Snowdown Colliery, Maidstone West, and Deal - reportedly all had fallen out of use by 1975.

 

The wiring at Hither Green - the only place where I saw it - was quite extensive in the yards on both sides of the running lines.

[Dogmatix]

The wiring at Hither Green - the only place where I saw it - was quite extensive in the yards on both sides of the running lines.

I remember that. The masts were still standing many years after the wires were removed.

[Lyddrail]

To the Stationmasters list I would add Ashford, but not sure if it was the hump yard, definately posts up the Canterbury branch for access to the PAD.

 

 

 

Cheers.

[phil gollin]

.

 

This week's Hornby Engine Shed is mainly about their 2016 original streamlined Merchant Navy class, but has a bit about the Class 71, in particular showing the operating pantograph, which looks reasonable, but for most will mean the removal of over-scale spings and possibly the connecting wire depending on what the final arrangement is ;

 

http://www.Hornby.com/uk-en/news/the-engine-shed/merchant-navy-class-71-collett/

 

.

[dibber25]

Clearing out my old scrapbox today - into the dustbin - I came across these. LMS EMU end and the end and side for a Class 71 to be made as a cast metal kit. All date from the early 1970s and have been in the scrapbox ever since. Never got any further with it and eventually bought a Golden Arrow rtr Class 71. Looking forward to the Hornby version.

CHRIS LEIGH

Edited September 17, 2015 by dibber25

[Strathyre]

They look like MTK,...

 

Paul

[Joseph_Pestell]

The Southern Electric site has what appears to be a complete list of the yards etc provided with overhead wiring, as follows -

 

Hither Green yard, Sittingbourne, Bricklayers Arms, Plumstead sidings, Angerstein Wharf, Hoo Jcn, Faversham, Shepherds Well, Dover Town, Snowdown Colliery, Maidstone West, and Deal - reportedly all had fallen out of use by 1975.

 

The wiring at Hither Green - the only place where I saw it - was quite extensive in the yards on both sides of the running lines.

 

I recall some at Rochester as well.

[dibber25]

They look like MTK,...

 

Paul

I hope they would have been better than MTK. I was a novice pattern-maker but I'd hate to think I was that bad!

[Ceptic]

Just shows ya. If you keep something long enough, hoping to work on it / improve it,   eventually,     some b*gg*r will come along and pull the rug from beneath yer feet !

[ruggedpeak]

I prefer to see it as if you prevaricate long enough someone else will do it for you

[MGR Hooper!]

Featured in today's "The Engine Shed" blog....

 

 

I'm surely buying one of these!

[griffgriff]

You think they would have sorted the handrail knobs before taking the photos

[MGR Hooper!]

You think they would have sorted the handrail knobs before taking the photos

Ummmm I think that's a handrail...not a handrail knob.

[miles73128]

Featured in today's "The Engine Shed" blog....

 

 

I'm surely buying one of these!

Looks superb!

[griffgriff]

Ummmm I think that's a handrail...not a handrail knob.

You're assuming I was referring to locomotive hardware

[BR(S)]

And the one without small yellow panel:

 

Warley Model Railway Show @ NEC by Steven Hughes, on Flickr

 

Warley Model Railway Show @ NEC by Steven Hughes, on Flickr