MrWhippyO Posted April 23, 2012 Share Posted April 23, 2012 Hi everyone, I am looking into laying some static grass on my layout, having seen these applicators on eBay I had wondered if anyone had any experience with them and if so, are they any good. They look like electrified sieves, and I never thought they were very convincing. Also, does anyone have any tips or hints for doing static grass? Thanks, James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 24, 2012 Share Posted April 24, 2012 The cheap ones that you see on ebay are modified electronic fly swats that originally looked like a small tennis racket. They operate on 1.5 - 3 volts and because of the low voltage are only effective at a short distance. Never tried one, just repeating what I've read elsewhere. I would guess that someone on this site has already posted a, ' How to make a Grassinator '. Also search google with ' flyswatter static grass applicator ' , Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipbadger Posted April 24, 2012 Share Posted April 24, 2012 James, That looks like a version of the home made one I use. There are several descriptions available on the web, mine came from the County Gate (L&B 009) site but I've just looked for it and the page is no longer there; try Googling. I previously used the plastic bottles that you shake to generate the static charge but for the money it cost (about £7.50) this does a much better job as when needed you can produce a much more uniform finish. One of the things not often mentioned, for some effects passing the nozzle of a vacuum cleaner a couple of inches above the newly deposited fibres will help them 'sit up' on the glue surface - good for that bowling green effect. My opinion, bearing in mind I've not used the Noch product - now my weapon of choice for landscaping. Tony Comber Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipbadger Posted April 24, 2012 Share Posted April 24, 2012 Snitzl said 'They operate on 1.5 - 3 volts and because of the low voltage are only effective at a short distance'. The electronic components in the handle produce a very much higher voltage, which can be higher than the original fly swat with minor modification. Noch's machine has a similar initial voltage from the batteries. As to distance from the substrate, most applications are with the sieve/tea strainer just above the substrate anyway as you are aiming for a degree of precision in placing the fibres, otherwise you've got to clear up all the wayward fibres. Tony Comber Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted April 24, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 24, 2012 James, there are many ways that 'static grass' can be achieved. I have the original Noch Grasmaster which I now wouldn't be without. Although expensive (being the first one available) at about £130 it has proved excellent. The part that I find most useful actually is the cone accessory which is so useful for precise applications in small areas. I am also using the Green Scene 'Grass Tech' which is around half the Noch price and works very well indeed although there is no useful cone accessory. There is a third type available, a cheaper small applicator at around £25. http://www.buffersmo...prod_25440.html I haven't tried this one yet but it comes in highly recommended to me by Chris Nevard when he used it on his lovely new small layout 'Polbrock' as a useful additional tool to the bigger grassmasters. I would think that the small 'tea-strainer' would only work with short fibres as the sieve would have too finer mesh. The current trend of firms producing ever longer fibres (up to 12mm, currently the longest are 6mm) a larger mesh would seem to be neccessary for satisfactory results. When researching static grass applicators when the Noch one was first available, I looked on sites in the USA where this method has been used for some time for details to home build one. I found one comprehensive site where the guy had made his own fly-swat one which worked OK according to him but didn't rate comparison with the Noch variety for the best results. I've found the 'Grass Tech' one seems to be a good mid-range priced product that works very well. I'm sure that there are many more on here who would recommend them. This was done with the 'Grass Tech'. It still needs vacuuming to make the grass strands more vertical. This was done using the handy cone accessory on the Noch version. Effect after vacuuming up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Nevard Posted April 24, 2012 Share Posted April 24, 2012 The makers of the small £25 budget one (9 volts btw) are also making a bigger one now for £35, based on what looks like a flour sieve. The small one is fine for 6mm grasses, much to my surprise... Here is 6.5 static grass through the 25 smacker special... Obviously with these kitchenware specials you can get a shock if you touch the sieve, not sure it that could be a problem if you have a dickie ticker or pacemaker! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marc smith Posted April 24, 2012 Share Posted April 24, 2012 I bought an ebay fly swatter type applicator, some time back Having also borrowed a grassmaster in the past I have to say the grassmaster performs better.... However, as a cheap alternative, the fly swatter isn't bad... You do indeed need to be close to the surface, to get the fibres to stand up more... This is OK, but you must be careful of where you are flocking, and where you place the ground / earth wire... I found with both the Noch, and the fly swat attaching the ground-wire to rails doesn't work well - perhaps because the rail is insulated...? I usually use a brass screw, placed into the landscape But using the fly swat, I accidentally touched the strainer onto the ground screw... Bang! Flash! - quite a spark, considering the "low voltage" I can tell you My fears had not been realised though... Phew! Still works well I've seen another static grass tool on the market, and I forget the manufacturer it was available on ebay, looked a lot like the Noch and claimed to be the most powerful tool available... anyone used one of these? Here is an example of grassy embankment on my small O gauge "Clarbeston North" Cheers Marc Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWhippyO Posted April 24, 2012 Author Share Posted April 24, 2012 Thanks guys for the replies, I think since I've never done any static grass application before I will have a bash at the "fly swat", do you have any tips or hints when using this? The placement of the earth or ground seems to be a bit odd, presumably it works off the small magnetic field that this generates? Thanks, James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWhippyO Posted April 24, 2012 Author Share Posted April 24, 2012 Ah right, I had assumed since a wire was involved there would be a current involved, and a current through a wire produces a magnetic field James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazmanjack Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 The cheap ones that you see on ebay are modified electronic fly swats that originally looked like a small tennis racket. They operate on 1.5 - 3 volts and because of the low voltage are only effective at a short distance. Never tried one, just repeating what I've read elsewhere. I would guess that someone on this site has already posted a, ' How to make a Grassinator '. Also search google with ' flyswatter static grass applicator ' , G'day all, I have put together a home made 'Grassinator', to which I had great results. Total cost of this project came to about $28.00 (AU), which compared to Nochs model is a massive saving. My Grassinator was made of some 50mm PVC down pipe, a PVC reducer 100mm-50mm, 2 end caps (1 x 50mm & 1 x 100mm), a small piece of fly wire, some electrical wire, a 9 volt battery clip with battery, a nail, and 1 x Negative Ion Generator (available from Oatley Electronics in Sydney Australia for $14.00). Following some simple instructions from another google search, I had this up and running in about 20 mins. Cheers, Gary. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterbournecm Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 These effects look fab. Can you apply direct onto hanging basket liner and still get the desired effect? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazmanjack Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Hi James, A word of warning when using a static grass dispensor. Disconnect all controllers/power supplies and do not have any locos on the layout when applying grass. I have heard about disastrous things happening to controllers and locos (including DCC) in the past. Cheers, Gary. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted April 30, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 30, 2012 These effects look fab. Can you apply direct onto hanging basket liner and still get the desired effect? Yes you can Craig. I first brush up and trim the 'pulled off' liner with a small cat brush (wire bristles one side) and then spray with firm hold hairspray and apply the static grass. (see second snap in post #5 above) What you can't now do is vacuum upright the static fibres otherwise they will all get vacuumed away. Although the hanging basket liner available today is not a patch on the old brown 'hairy' carpet underlay because it has a lot of very long tough fibres that have to be trimmed off (a pain), it is all that there is nowadays (unless you know a carpet fitter who may come across some of the old stuff in their line of work). I've found that if you chop up the 'pullings-off' bits and glue with PVA those next time round it does save a lot of work. The 'grass' underneath the arches is 6.5mm fibres on top of 'pulled off' hanging basket liner and then covered with a little Woodlands Scenics Fine Turf 'green grass' T45. You can also waft over a very fine amount of a lighter colour to highlight it and give it some more depth. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterbournecm Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Thanks John. Have a mag hopefully coming down in Aug and want to get it looking good for then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWhippyO Posted May 5, 2012 Author Share Posted May 5, 2012 Thanks for all the advice guys, pay day is soon so I should be able to make a start to static grass on my layout James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwrman Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Hi, here's the details of the Static Grass Applicator you make from a flyswat Hope this helps Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Ava_Hay Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 I agree that this idea seems really useful but if you watch the videos you will see that the tea strainer needs to be literally almost touching the scenery to be effective. This limits the area you are working on to a microscopic level whereas the GrassMaster is capable of handling much larger areas. There are also alternatives to the Noch at a cheaper price now one of which is owned ( and permanently lent out I hear ) by our esteemed leader. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterbournecm Posted May 20, 2012 Share Posted May 20, 2012 Many thanks for the help so far guys. I have been dabbling with some small areas on the layout with my £25 EBAY "special" applicator and excellent International Models 6mm winter & Autumn grass products. Here are some areas treated and the pictures so far. The extisting grass clump has PVA liberally applied and the grass sieved on whilst attached to a brass screw nearby. It pays to sweep the area after you have applied it. This area was a scrub area with amainly ballast finish. The PVA was spread to give a patchy look and the area treated Here is a close up after the area has dried and gently hoovered. The grass can be teased up once hoovered. A train in the wilderness! There are more details on my layout thread. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghisere andy Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Just a point to note: The Buffers' website referred to by Re6/6 is in the process of being updated and wont be available till the beginning of August. Is there another source out there? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
meil Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 You can achieve the same effect using a balloon rubbed on some wool (arm of your jumper) and applied near to the grass. Quite effective actually considering the price. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackRat Posted July 10, 2012 Share Posted July 10, 2012 Made one, and having got zapped a few times I splashed out and bought a Grassmaster. Superb, worlds apart and far, far safer for a ham fister like me! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted July 10, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 10, 2012 Made one, and having got zapped a few times I splashed out and bought a Grassmaster. Superb, worlds apart and far, far safer for a ham fister like me! You won't regret it! The GrasMaster type machines have been the greatest leap forward in creating half decent scenics IMHO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 57xx Posted July 20, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 20, 2012 One of the things not often mentioned, for some effects passing the nozzle of a vacuum cleaner a couple of inches above the newly deposited fibres will help them 'sit up' on the glue surface - good for that bowling green effect. If you have to use a vacuum cleaner to get the grass to stand up, then I would say the static applicator you're using is not doing it's job effectively. The whole point of them is they make the grass stand up. On my very first time using the Grassmaster, I got "bowling green" grass without even trying. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted July 21, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 21, 2012 On re-reading the instuctions for the 'Grass Tech II' (now/same as? the 'Flockit' machine from Green Scene) it states that a power adapter (12V) is/was available giving (22000v) for increased coverage. On the Green Scene website for their 'Flockit' machine it's stated that if a 12v supply is used this will give 18000v and up to 25% thicker coverage. The Noch 'GrasMaster' instructions make no mention of this alternative. Has anybody tried using their machine at 12v? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWhippyO Posted January 26, 2013 Author Share Posted January 26, 2013 Thanks guys for the continued advice, as I have had so much on for the past few months only now I am getting back into this modelling business. From the posts here it seems that the £25 sieve is best used for shorter static grass fibres but this picture shows the sort of look I want to achieve on my layout, it shows the fence swamped by tall grasses and weeds. Many thanks for all your help James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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