Craftsman kits seems to be forsale

[dave_long]

Just seen it posted on s4 forum about a kit and etching company for sale on eBay. £15,000 for what appears to be Craftsman models. Nothing on their site though.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/190894035208?ru=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fsch%2Fi.html%3F_from%3DR40%26_sacat%3D0%26_nkw%3D190894035208%26_rdc%3D1

[Horsetan]

Those kits could do with a bit of an update......

[Kenton]

Certainly has some interest but I don't think ebay is exactly the way to sell a business.

 

The asking price may well be quite reasonable or at least "ball park" but such a business purchase decision is not to be taken on a whim of a x day listing on ebay. Further investigations should be taken up into how the business is operating and exactly what do you get for the money.

 

I was quite intrigued but more put off by the listing on ebay.

 

The few photos do nothing to really identify the business and there is no mention of the business name or link to the website. Unfortunately that makes me a little suspicious (not the best way to get a sale)

 

IF it is Craftsman then the range is quite good and although some updates might be required they are not that bad.

 

As I approach retirement this is just the sort of thing I would be interested in. But not a snap decision made on ebay.

 

This just isn't the way to sell a business - and if gauging the market an ebay BIN would have been better presented as a nearest offer.

[10800]

But you get 5000 Nectar Points!

[dave_long]

Yes I thought it a little strange, with nothing noted in the traditional press or website, and the photos listed are displayed on the limited website homepage.

 

I know that with the likes of shawplan and specialist kit makers and others that some of the craftsman range might be a little dated now, but could easily be brought up to date with a little work!

[alfsboy]

I think it is a brilliant way of selling a business or at least advertising the fact your are up to sell it .We are discussing it already ..Sometimes you can use Ebay in other ways than actually selling an item there and then .smart move .Looks a bit pricey to me .

[Kenton]

 

I think it is a brilliant way of selling a business or at least advertising the fact your are up to sell it .We are discussing it already ..Sometimes you can use Ebay in other ways than actually selling an item there and then .smart move .Looks a bit pricey to me .

For advertising yes, maybe - but for buying I can assure you that there is much more to evaluating the worth of a business purchase than a one click BIN price which is proposed by the seller. This is not a serious way to obtain a suitable buyer or for a buyer to evaluate the content of the business as a proposition.

 

I cannot see how anyone, in all seriousness, can say it is a "bit pricey" or indeed "cheap" there is simply too little information in the advert to make that assessment.

[Clive Mortimore]

I agree with what Kenton is saying.

 

Before buying a business you need to know what their turnover, profit. expenses etc. for the past few years has been, it gives some idea if you can make a living from it. It also gives some idea if the asking price is one that reflects the true value of the business. 

 

I can just see the bank managers face when you turn up with the E-bay advert as part of your business plan for the loan.

[Brinkly]

But you get 5000 Nectar Points!

 

Shame really as I shop at Co-Op! Wonder if I could transfer them!?

[alfsboy]

  For advertising yes, maybe - but for buying I can assure you that there is much more to evaluating the worth of a business purchase than a one click BIN price which is proposed by the seller. This is not a serious way to obtain a suitable buyer or for a buyer to evaluate the content of the business as a proposition.

 

I cannot see how anyone, in all seriousness, can say it is a "bit pricey" or indeed "cheap" there is simply too little information in the advert to make that assessment.

If they have an Ebay shop account they can keep the listing going for nothing for months .I do .I doubt they intend to sell it on ebay but its a very cheap way of informing everyone including prospective buyers .Ebay is often dismissed by the ignorant as a flea market but  its a very powerful business model .I wouldnt pay 15 grand for so to me its overpriced.

[Kenton]

 

If they have an Ebay shop account they can keep the listing going for nothing for months .I do .I doubt they intend to sell it on ebay but its a very cheap way of informing everyone including prospective buyers .Ebay is often dismissed by the ignorant as a flea market but  its a very powerful business model .I wouldnt pay 15 grand for so to me its overpriced.

I do see the point of advertising.

 

I do have considerable experience in buying and selling (and running) a business - I know how to cost a business and as an accountant have done so for several business.

 

If I clicked the BIN button that would end the sale and advertising element and I would be the new owner (at that price).

 

The fact that you wouldn't pay £15K is very much a personal point of view (I respect that) but it is based on poor and inadequate information. If you were looking for such a business opportunity (as I am/have been) then surely you would examine the business in detail it may actually be worth more or you may actually offer less and still be sold the business. The value of any business is only based on the assets and prospective profits. Most assets here could well be worn out or of little value, stock items will be dwindling and only at marginal cost anyway, goodwill is in the brand but very debatable and the assistance that can be obtained from the current owner, cash will be £0 - so you are left with profits and return on your investment, and potentially an unknown level of debt/creditors.

 

It is that reason more than anything that I am suspicious of such an offer.

 

I return to the point that the information is actually very vague and is also poor as a simple advert. It fails in the most crucial element of stating what the business is called. We are still all assuming it is Craftsman Kits there is nothing to confirm this.

[dave_long]

But what happens if someone decides to bid the 15K expecting to have a business, that must be seen as a sale though. I would want to see what the mouldings were like for most of their kits before parting with a substantial sum of money as the kits are getting on a bit now. Plus a stock check is a must too.

[dave_long]

The ebay seller steamatone was the seller selling craftsman kits before this listing. You are right Kenton that it should state the business in question. I've never found communicating with Craftsman easy, I've enquired about kits by email and phone and very rarely did i get an answer or reply from them, so maybe this isnt unusual for them.

[Kenton]

having just worked my way through a somewhat disorganised pdf catalogue (great room for improvement there) and only raises more questions than answers.

 

The range of items produced is quite extensive - I had not realised just how many. Though there are relatively few kits there are many castings.

 

Of course the castings will depend of the quality of the masters and a lesser extent on the molds as these can be reworked with relative ease. Unfortunately the castings are also low value items with very low profit and potentially high cost, especially in labour, metal, fuel.

Assuming no outstanding creditors I would be quite happy to start at £5000, but I would expect long hard negotiations for anything else and a great deal of persuasive supporting information.

 

Dave's comment above does not hold good prospect for contact or (if not countered) give much value to any goodwill. The value of a website is very low if the traffic through it and orders placed and filled cannot be demonstrated.

[Horsetan]

There are some businesses out there that do their level best to avoid communication, although that's sometimes because they don't know how to handle it.

 

The worst thing is to have a really good product, but only available from a recluse.

[Grovenor]

He does appear to expect communication!

For further information please initially mail through ebay with contact number and we will respond.

Keith

[muddys-blues]

  For advertising yes, maybe - but for buying I can assure you that there is much more to evaluating the worth of a business purchase than a one click BIN price which is proposed by the seller. This is not a serious way to obtain a suitable buyer or for a buyer to evaluate the content of the business as a proposition.

 

I cannot see how anyone, in all seriousness, can say it is a "bit pricey" or indeed "cheap" there is simply too little information in the advert to make that assessment.

It is a great idea advertising it on ebay, it opens up the opportunity too a very wide Model making market "who may not otherwise know that Craftsman Kits is up for sale", it is more than likely free for them too advertise, and as it says in their sale description, mail them via ebay, and a contact number for discussions will be forwarded.

 

I don't think for one minute Daryl or Ian wish to sell the business via ebay, but it beats selling it via an Estate gent or Business Seller.

[alfsboy]

No-one going to press the button .They will contact them to take it further if they fancy a punt ..Investigation ,haggle and negotiation ,due diligence (just like RBS did  :-) )  etc  would be expected ,not a press the buy it now button but it does give a price  indication to start at and no middle man if you count on the fact EBay wont be getting its 1500 quid unless someone is very daft or perhaps amazingly clever .Who knows.?

I had already given thought to selling my motorsport figure range via Ebay initially if I ever went down that road  .Simpler  as its mainly masters  but ebay is good place to start .its world wide and in my case reaches a specialised international market that no other method would .

[dave_long]

"who may not otherwise know that Craftsman Kits is up for sale",

 

I don't think for one minute Daryl or Ian wish to sell the business via ebay, but it beats selling it via an Estate gent or Business Seller.

To be fair we've had to guess that its Craftsman up for sale, those who may not know them would still not know its Craftsman up for sale.

[Kenton]

 

To be fair we've had to guess that its Craftsman up for sale, those who may not know them would still not know its Craftsman up for sale.

It would also help greatly if the business structure was clearly identified (sole trader, partnership, LLP or Ltd company) all of which impart particular and very critical aspects on business purchase.

 

Anyone thinking about this should not forsake some serious consultation with their accountant - who will almost certainly insist on speaking to the seller's accountant.

 

Caveat Emptor are the wisest words in all transactions.

 

To add: I would hate this sale to go to the unsuspecting and unprepared and later either fall through or cease trading. We have lost other kit manufacturer's this way and Craftsman is not one I would like to see lost.

[Enterprisingwestern]

A good time to sell now the RTR manufacturers are homing in on the less common/popular end of the market, in a few years time Craftsman perhaps won't have a range to sell?

 

Mike.

[Horsetan]

Are they still for sale?

[Kenton]

 

Are they still for sale?

Why? Have you suddenly come into a load of dosh? Feeling generous or benevolent?

 

I haven't seen the advert reappear so either they received an off-ebay offer, had second thoughts, or have simply given up in the face of realism. I must say I would have shown some interest IF there had been some realism.

 

Some of it deserves saving but not at that price.

[Horsetan]

 Why? Have you suddenly come into a load of dosh? Feeling generous or benevolent? .....

No, no particular reason.....