BigAndy

Hmmm. I've had this issue with Precision paints as well recently. I think everyone is stating that they're mixing thoroughly and shaking/agitating the tins for several minutes prior to use. I have got a Matt Black, supposedly, in both small and large sizes - they both finish extremely glossy, even without adding any thinners - not impressed either. Railmatch enamels seem to be far superior but it used to be the other way round. Wondering if Precision have altered the ingredients at some point, to maybe comply better with sending enamels through the post.......don't know. Cheers Andy

Well that's where I and quite a lot of others differ from your good self then! You could put a lump of coal on a chassis, put it on the front of a train and it would pull it - if you don't mind glaring inaccuracies my friend, then good luck to you...........but for my mind, this is the situation that Heljan are taking advantage of. They're kind of relying on the fact that "it'll do, most wont even notice", but it's the rest of us modellers who then suffer from that. Now I know nothing about Continental HO, but I'm wondering if Fleischmann et al have the same blase attitude towards their customers? Would anyone who happens to model HO on here, comment on that? I would be very interested to see the answers. Do Rapido flog a new Loco or coach or box car, or whatever they produce and it's dimensionally wrong, with curves in the wrong places or not there at all? As I said, I don't want to sit here and bash Heljan, but they have repeatedly turned out Locos and coaches that are just plain wrong......can't say it simpler than that. Class 158 Productions, I don't know who Ben Jones is - never met the guy, but if he is the chap signing stuff off, he needs to go and have a little chat with himself somewhere, then give his head a wobble........maybe he or even Heljan themselves could comment on here, then tell me and the others who have also raised concerns, where we are wrong and they are right. cheers Andy

I really do not like to bash manufacturers, as without them we would all be stuffed. However, and its a big however, when a 21st century state of the art model is produced, how on Earth can it be cocked up so badly? It's not just Heljan ( although they do have more form for it than some of the others ), but who approves the CADS before going to toolmaking? Surely, there should be someone at these companies who actually KNOW what they're talking about! Noone on here wants to just sit and be keyboard warriors, it's pretty easy and simple really, if you want our cash then get it right!! All we want is a product without errors! that's all..........You wouldn't buy a car and then accept it because there were a 'few faults' on it......or a kettle than doesn't boil water......or a microwave that will only heat certain foods up but not others..... Well it's the same here I'm afraid Heljan - you need to look long and flippin' hard internally as to who is approving your CADS for tooling, coz they aint getting it right and it's costing you sales. Disapointment reigns when everyone has been looking so forward to a new model and it falls flat on its face, all for the sake of getting some expert advice on whether the CADs look like the real thing. Can't be THAT hard for you surely? Don't you want to get it so right, that every single modeller out here is clamoring for your new 45? I mean, we're not bickering over a £50 Loco are we - substantial amounts of modellers wonga will be shelled out here..... Phil Sutton has proved that it can be done, with his 24 - it's beautiful........so is it just a case of you can't be bothered to spend the time and effort in getting it right? Or is it more a case of maximizing your profit and stuff the customer?, with repeated models trotting out under your name, that all have glaring inaccuracies, it certainly feels like the latter. Will you PLEASE, PLEASE, just take a bit of time to get it spot on - ask on here..... or ask someone who is in the know, for their expert opinion BEFORE you sign the CADS off. It would save a lot of disappointment and heartache. cheers Andy

Personally, I've never seen anything from MGR Hooper that evenly remotely smacks of being nasty or insidious. She's only ever posted what most of us are thinking! It could well be indicative of the times, that people are offended by other peoples point of view. The whole point of this forum, is to debate in a free society - as has been pointed out, there is always the 'off' button or simply skip to another thread. I think that's enough of the slangging match to be honest and I'm sure a mod will be along in the not to distant future to curtail such activities. As for 7mm models and as in any scale, if you're happy with what's being dished up, great.........let the rest of us debate the finer points of whatever is being produced! If this 7mm 47 isn't right, it isn't right, simple as. I for one am not an expert on the real things, so i'm happy that someone can point out the errors to me. I don't want my models to be that wrong, fellow modellers in the know will point them out to me after I've spent an inordinate amount of time on detailing them and respraying them. I want it to be as right as my limited talents allow. I'm currently butchering a Heljan 37 into submission, although its fighting all the way - blimey, there's some serious faults with those things! cheers Andy

I've sort of sat here looking at all the comments and taking it in......then thought should I comment or shouldn't I? Sometimes it seems like a waste of 5 minutes modelling time, as everyone has differing opinions and there never seems to be any resolution to an argument. If you think this 47 from Heljan is really nice, looks like a 47 to you and you're happy - great, knock yerselves out, that's great. However, there are a significant amount of Modellers who, lets face it for an outlay of £600.00, want their models to be correct in virtually every aspect. I don't think it's unreasonable to be honest. If I went to say.......a dog breeder who supplies German Shepherd pups, kennel club registered etc etc - the pups come from two champion parents, and I pay something like £2,000 for it - I want to be sure that pup is healthy and there's nowt wrong with it. So imagine on getting said pup home and you're admiring this super wonderful specimen..........but then it Miaows like a cat...... What do you do? How do you feel? Apart from being embarrassed, you would probably feel pretty cheated........... To most dog owners, the DNA of their pet is unimportant.......it's the dog itself that matters, doesn't matter if it's a mongrel, a Heinz 57 or a crossbreed.........its a dog and a member of the family. See the analogy? To the organisers of Crufts and the entrants thereof, the supreme champion has to have certain attributes.......it has to be right........it can't have knock knees, a bent tail, have crossed eyes or Miaows......it's got to be perfect for it to be considered a contender for overall Champion...... And that's where a lot of 7mm Modellers are. Vast majority are experts. They've come through years of ground training, building kits or scratchbuilding - they're USED to getting things right. So along come a major manufacturer and start producing RTR locos and stock. Great. But there's a downside to all this isn't there? 7mm is, or was, considered the 'Senior Scale'.....because it was mainly patronised by the elder and more mature modeller - as I said, someone who had spent their formative years learning their trade to the point that they could quite rightly class themselves as experts. Then Heljan start knocking out models that aren't right.......in fact some glaring errors. Are these time served modellers not allowed to feel slightly aggrieved? There are Kit manufacturers out there, seriously struggling now in the 7mm market, because Heljan are tapping into an hitherto untapped market - Diesel and electric Modellers, who are say 45 years old and upwards, who have a few quid to spend - they're at the time of life where they're still earning but kids have grown up........they have money to spend. Problem is, all these RTR models are pushing the modelling skills out of the way ( but that's another argument }, however that doesn't bother Heljan, who are a business and therefore out to make as much profit as possible. Where does this all leave the enthusiast and modeller then? The modeller who is happy to have a 7mm 47 that somewhat looks like a 47, fall out of a box and run round, then happy days............as I said, knock yerselves out. For everyone else, it would seem that we have a 47 that Miaows............... cheers Andy

Having now managed to take a breath from last weekend, I would just personally like to extend an enormous 'Thanks' to every single exhibitor and trader who attended the Macclesfield exhibition last Saturday and Sunday. We all know the extreme situation that the country ( indeed most of the World ) finds itself in, so for us to continue and produce the exhibition in the face of those challenges, was hugely important for the club and attendees - which of course includes all the enthusiastic public paying to get in. Without the support of all the exhibitors/traders, we could not have continued and would have had to have cancelled at the last minute. Of those that did attend, we and an awful lot of positive comments and It would seem that everyone enjoyed themselves. I am aiming to reintroduce some silverware for our exhibition, hopefully for next year, but as of this time there was not a competition available. However, had there been a cup for the best layout, then 'Whithorn' would have walked away with it. Comments from members of the public, and also from Macclesfield club members, were all extremely effusive about the layout and it is a tribute to Alasdair and his team. I can only say it so many times, but from myself and the rest of the Macclesfiled Group, Thank you one and all for a great weekend. cheers Andy

Ben, say what mate??

*Bump*

Many thanks for those lovely photos from Argos and Arrdbealach. Just about a week to go now for the Maclesfield exhibition and is the last one presented by our current exhibition manager, Shaun Horrocks. After this next show, he will be handing over to yours truly to have a bash at it.........just hope I can keep up the high standards Shaun has set over the years! Anyway, this time next week we shall be in full full show build up mode. Shaun has put on a really high quality show for his last one in charge, so if you had any doubts about coming to Macclesfield to have a look, think again and come on down. If you see me - I'll be the huge ugly one. walking around in a Stewards high Vis jacket - please say hello, I generally don't bite......especially if I've been fed recently....... cheers Andy

Attached is an exhibition taster for the forthcoming Macclesfield Exhibition. In this view, resprayed and detailed ViTrains 47 No 47 467 hauls a dead 91 plus full rake of Mk4's and DVT during a practice running session at Hazel Grove clubrooms. None of the layout furniture was fitted for this sessio, or the backscene, all of which will be in evidence at the show.

With the Macclesfield Exhibition some 8 weeks or so away now, I have made the final updates of attendees. We will be at Stafford show in a couple of weeks with our Club Stand, you can also follow us on Facebook and you will find more information generally about the MMRG at our Website: https://www.macclesfieldmrg.org.uk/ cheers Andy

Very sadly, Iris who founded the business some 30 years ago, recently passed away. Which as ianmacc says, is why the shop had to close. I don't know what happened to all the stock, but doubt very much that it will open again. cheers Andy

The above list of Exhibitors and Traders has now been finalised and is correct as of this update. cheers Andy

Finescale 4mm as far as I am aware. Testament to the constructor of all things sleeper and rail that its not instantly recogniseable as 16.5mm. cheers Andy PS Thoroughly looking forward to attending Wigan by kind invitation again this year, with our plastic abuse roadshow and the boards for 'Glasgow Queen St EM'

I shall be there again this year, by kind invitation. I'll be demoing how I go about in my limited skills way, how to detail/build/modify Diesels and be showing locos plus stock ( inc latest completed stuff ) for Glasgow Queen St in EM gauge. If you've not been to this show before, it is WELL worth the effort in going - there is plenty to see and do and reflects the Herculean effort put in by the organising team ( not me! ) cheers Andy

MACCLESFIELD MODEL RAILWAY GROUP 2020 EXHIBITION VENUE: Tytherington High School, Manchester Road, Macclesfield, SK10 2EE. PRICES HELD FROM LAST YEAR - Adults £6.00 - accompanied children FREE (under 16) Free onsite parking with Level access DATES: 14th and 15th March 2020 Opening times: Saturday 10am - 5pm, Sunday 10am - 4.30pm. Full details can be found at: www.macclesfieldmrg.org.uk FREE VINTAGE BUS SERVICE AT REGULAR INTERVALS ON BOTH DAYS, FROM OPPOSITE MACCLESFIELD RAILWAY STATION, ALSO BUS STATION, THEN VIA MILL ST, WATERS GREEN, PARK ST, CHURCHILL WAY, HIBEL RD, BEECH LANE AND MANCHESTER RD. ** The bus will pick up passengers on request, at any recognised bus stop along the route** ** Service will also set down by request, at any recognised bus stop on return from the venue** LAYOUTS BOOKED TO ATTEND SO FAR: Cheadle Ridge Lane - 4mm/OO by Steve Lindley, Blue Diesel TMD Gresten - HOe by Malcolm Rochford, Austrian circa 1985-1990 Hadley, Stoneybroke and Swale - 7mm Narrow gauge by Arline Wilson Hakuho - By Kev Smith, Japanese Z gauge. Megantic - by Bob Harper, USA practice in On2 Sutton St Annes - 2mm N gauge by Anthony Sutton, BR Sectorisation, 1st and 2nd Generation DMU's etc. Tuemyll Junction - by Simon Cullen, 2mm N gauge, BR Blue Diesels. Bastonge Rue De Clervaux - HO Belgian SNCB (1990 -2010) by Phil Colton Angelbank - by Chris Hewitt in 4mm EM gauge Barton Hall - 7mm O Guage Hazel Valley - by Hazel Grove Model Railway Group, 4mm OO ** This layout will be running as BR Diesel period and will have a selection of former 'Runswick Leamside' stock ** Whithorn - 4mm OO gauge, Galloway (Scotland), 1960's to 70's by Alasdair McDonald Hironocho - by Peter Dibben, 2mm N gauge Japanese Winziges Industriegebiet - HO German by Rex Ashton Happy Valley - Thomas and friends in OO for the younger visitors, who will be able to operate this layout under supervision. Culthwaite - N Gauge by Phil Mason, First exhibition, Settle and Carlisle inspired practice. Clayton End Signalman - North of England 1950's/70's + !990's/2000's in OO by David George. RNAS Glencruitten - 2mm Finescale by Angus Higgins ( Argos of this parish )- Caledonian practice, Rail served Airship base. **** To accompany the Thomas and Friends Happy Valley layout, there will be the usual 'Brio' wooden toys over in kids Korner - right next to the restaurant, so you can keep an eye on them whilst relaxing with a meal or a brew. **** TRADE SUPPORT: ABC Model Railways Book Law Publications Country Park Models Direct Train Spares Edwins 3D Models High Lane Model Railways MMRG Members Sales North Western Models Powerbond Glue S.M.T.F - Dave Denton from Brookside Squires Model And Craft Tools Sweets of Yesteryear The Bespoke Sign And Print Shop The Junction Box

Before we get into a long and drawn out discussion, everyone should read Andy Y's post above............. So long as the host club state to their Insurers that setting up will be on the Friday - as most two day show's do - then there WON'T be a problem! I've exhibited at shows up and down the country, and all of them, as far as I know, start their Insurance cover on the Friday of setting up - as you are then covered from leaving your house on the Friday, to getting home again Sunday evening. Personally, I think it's more to do with the host club not wanting to pay for an additional days cover - doesn't make sense otherwise. cheers Andy

Nobody knows yet Will, as it isn't out to buy. With it being a new tooling, you would like to think that Heljan will have that covered, but then again........... cheers Andy

It's this coming weekend folks. March 9th and 10th Macclesfield - with possibly the best canteen food on the exhibition circuit! Dates + times: Saturday 9th March 2019 10:00 – 17:00 *Myself (BigAndy) and the rest of the 'Glasgow Queen St (EM)' team will also be there with a demo stand and exhibiting stock to date for the layout* Sunday 10th March 2019 10:00 – 16:30 Venue: Tytherington High School Manchester Road Macclesfield SK10 2EE Prices: £6:00 Accompanied Children (under 16) Free Excellent Refreshments Level Access Free Classic Bus service running from Macclesfield Railway Station to the venue Free Parking “Thomas” Layout for Children to Drive Member’s Sales Stand LAYOUTS ATTENDING: Amalgamated Wagon Works O Bellwether Works OO Blueish 3mm TT Bodger Creek and Northern ON30 Camel Quay OO Canalside Ironworks 1:50 Freshwater EM Gravelly Oak N Happy Valley OO Melrose End OO Outwell Village OO Pevel Depot OO Porth Wenn OO Tunley Marsh N Weaver’s Hill OO Westbrook N Wolfe Lowe O TRADE SUPPORT: ABC Model Railways Axminster Tools Bespoke Signs & Print Booklaw Publications Country Park Models Country Scenes & Trees Direct Train Spares Highlane Models MMRG Members’ Sales North Western Models Powerbond S.M.T.F. Sweets of Yesteryear The Junction Box

If that's what they've done, all they're going to achieve by that is making the actual glazing look smaller than it should do..................... Not knowing anything about production practices, but that smacks of taking the easy way out. Cheaper and easier than trying to line half of the actual frame........... If anyones going to DeFine tomorrow, I'll be there and would love to see one of the OR ScoRail versions for myself, if you want to bring one along. I'll also have my OR 3a that has had the Extreme Etchings and respray done to it, for comparrison. Cheers Andy

Pete gave this a bump last week, but I'm going to do another one for DeFine! It's tomorrow folks. Going to be a good day with lots to look at and discuss with all the great and good in D&E modelling.......oh, and I'll be there as well once you've talked to the real experts. Planning to having a few of my coaches on show for everyone to point at and talk behind my back about ( Flood )....or in his case right in front of me! I'll also have one of the Bachmann DBSO's in ScotRail flavour that I've taken apart, and strarted to do some work on, so please come and say hello and then tell me what I'm doing wrong! See you at DeFine. cheers Andy

Out of all the manufacturers out there who could consider one, I reckon Horby would be in a prime position to announce an all singing, all dancing 37...... They've currently only got the old Lima moulding on the go, so would you bet against them announcing one? Or even a pukka 47 at that. Both types of Loco are ripe for the pickings if someone's brave enough to have a go. It would have to be a 'definitive' version though, bit like Accurascales Deltic....... cheers Andy

I think there's various urban myths going around as to why the DBSO's were at the Glasgow end generally ( some sets did get turned round unavoidably ) and all of them are plausable, but the one I heard for the 47 being at the front for the assault up Cowlairs, was that the Driver could get immediate feedback from the Loco, should wheelslip occur. Yes, there's an antiwheelslip indicator in the DBSO, but there's nothing quite like being on the footplate with the Lump behind you and feeling the Loco with the soles of yer feet, plus it could take vital seconds for the electrical pulse to travel the length of the set - seconds in which the power handle could be shut and save some damage to the track and Loco. Could just be another one of the myths though! cheers Andy

Rolling back to 1980's/90's there with that admission price Colin!!!

Hi Jonathan, I've just found this thread and will be following it closely from now on! Your work is top drawer and I'm very pleased to see someone else modelling the 1988 era, as that's my chosen period too. Myself and 4 others are currently building Glasgow Queen St (1988) in EM, so your photos and info are very interesting to read. I've got a photo album here on RmWeb, under 'Detailed Diesels', so feel free to have a gander at your leisure. I'm going to be demoing at the DeFine one day show in January and also at Stafford show after that, so if you attend either of those shows, PLEASE bring some of your stock along so I can have a look in the plastic so to speak and also have a chat! Interesting that you've chosen the Joueff 3a's.........myself and Bill ( who's also building GQS but in P4 ) spent a lonnnnnng time agonising over whether to use them or the Oxford Rail ones. Bill, I think, is still a bit undecided but I have plumped for the Oxford Rail coaches - purely based on the pro's and cons of stripping both manufacturers versions. As you have highlighted, the Jouff 3a's require an awful lot of scraping and filing - with that 'orrid brittle plastic, so the OR won the day for me. Under the Oxford Rail thread at the top of RmWeb, and in the Oxford Rail 3a section, I have put a couple of photos of the one I have done to date. Myself and Bob Reid also highlighted the shortcomings of the OR model and what needs to be done in order to get it up to standard. Page 49 ( post #1203 onwards ) and page 50 of that thread refers. As for Extreme Etchings window frames, they are superb arent they? My own personal favoured method of attaching to the body of the coach, is to use gloss varnish. I draw a thin pencil line above and below the appertures, then fix them using thinned gloss, letting the surface tension draw it down onto the bodyside. This way, I can manouvre the etching for quite a whille, to ensure it is perfectly straight and level - it's also easy to wash away any surplus varnish from the bodyside, prior to it drying and therefore completely nullifying any escaped residue - something hard to do with superglue. That's just my personal preference though and it's down to individual likes as to what method you use. Btw, Very kind comments from Natalie, you are too kind m'dear. We've just had a website constructed for our version of GQS and as soon as I've completed writing up some bits and bobs for it, I'll give you the URL. Keep up the excellent work and I hope to be able to chat face to face fairly soon. cheers Andy PS I've still got the two articles I wrote for Rail Express, on Word Docs without the photos though. If it helps in any way, PM me with your email address and I'd be most happy to flick them across to you. It kind of explains the sad lengths I go to on MK2 coaches in order to get the tumblehome right.