Jol Wilkinson

Tony, the "finescale" OO layout as it was described and to the one to which I think you refer had no pointwork in the scenic section, just four long plain tracks. Once you get a train rolling out of the fiddle yard, it should keep going, with nothing to impede it and momentum to aid its progress. Frankly, if you can't make that work in any scale/gauge, then what hope is there? The hall was very hot and humid on Friday evening when I was there setting up a trade stand and although a little cooler during exhibition days, still hot enough to cause at least one of the Pf layouts you which allude, to suffer from heat related problems. I saw some poor running on at least one 7mm layout although the 2mm FS Fencehouses seemed to be running well on the couple of occasions I saw it. Once again, I don't understand why you feel the need to "have a go" at P4 layouts. It is, after all just 4mm modelling and except for the wheels and track is no different to any other model railway of the same scale. If OO is so good, why don't we see more exceptional OO layouts at shows, rather than the "defective" P4 ones you like to highlight. Jol p.s. I didn't see you at Railex. Why didn't you call by and say hello?

I am 6' and thought that a number of the layouts were too low to view comfortably. Regrettably, what suits one viewer won't always suit another.

Facebook has become, like other social media sites, increasingly possible to ignore. I can communicate satisfactorily with those I want or need to using speech, the telephone, a mobile phone, emails, letters and several internet forums. Increasingly however, it is becoming impossible to do certain things because people are using Facebook, etc. to the exclusion of what has been the normal means of providing information or communication. For example, restaurants who only use Facebook and don't have a "traditional" website. The options, enroll on all these sites or don't use that business. Currently, I lean towards the latter.

The great irony here is, that those who proclaim our hobby shouldn't be taken seriously are probably those who expect the manufacturers, suppliers, show organisers, etc. to do just that so they can have their bit of fun. What would they say if 247 produced only "one size fits all" plates, if show guides had inaccurate plans and layout details, if Hornmann produced an A3 numbered as an A1 because it's got the same number of wheels, if layout operators decided all to go for lunch at the same time leaving a lifeless display, and so on. Don't decry those that take their hobby and activities seriously just because you don't want to. They have probably done more to move this hobby forward with new products and ideas than those who make glib comments about others efforts. Dave is right, that this is Brian's thread about his business and products. Another supplier who takes things seriously!

Rather more that Hatfield's detractors had six pages to offer. New towns often have something to offer, but in Hatfield's case I don't know what. Stevenage still has Old Stevenage to provide some character and is, importantly, the home of The Wine Society, whose warehouse stores and distributes rather nice bottled behavior modifying fluids.

Mike, unfortunately family orientated shows do little to support the trade that many of us rely upon for our model making needs. Numbers through the door is one thing but peoples buying/spending interests are another. While Thomas and similar family orientated exhibits provide children with some fun and give families something to do, it does little to sustain the strength of the hobby at present. Equally, families often don't appreciate the work that goes into the more "serious" type of model making (I don't like using that word but in context it fits). How many families will buy 247's products, or even know what they are? Railex and shows like it provide an opportunity for specialist traders to present and sell their products, for top level model making to be seen and appreciated for what it is, etc. Local club shows cater more to families and what might be called the mainstream modeller who is more reliant on RTR products. There is room for both but don't decry the likes of Railex because it doesn't try to cater for everyone. As for P4 layout operators looking serious, I have noticed that some operators of OO layouts at local shows have a smug look, perhaps that's being mistaken for having fun. Jol

In my experience it is usually dogs that have the emission problems, not cats.

If it is that obvious, then how can it be a fiddle? It's just part of the emission control system, presumably operating when a cold engine needs a richer fuel mixture to run smoothly. What VW did in the US of A was to incorporate software that provided different performance under specific conditions and which gave an inaccurate set of figures to comply with the regulations under test conditions only. Other manufacturers may not have had to do this if their vehicles complied. Some European manufacturers who don't sell in the States were investigated but found to comply with European regulations. Despite this, there seems to be a belief that all car manufacturers are up to no good.

Chaz, it is your reference to the P4/EM/OO "war" I object to. I've made 4mm scale 18.83 mm gauge models and been a member of the S4 Society for over thirty years and don't understand these references to a war. Is their a war between Windows and Mac users? No, just people expressing a preference for one system or another. Jol

A letter gives the recipient to deal with it in his own time and to research the answer. I've always found Danny most helpful and a letter always gets a polite and proper answer. I know several small suppliers who don't give out their telephone numbers because of the interruption it creates. Many of our Small Suppliers are exactly that, small operations dealing with manufacturing, ordering materials, packing, printing instructions, going to the Post Office, etc. etc. etc. It takes about twenty minutes to pack a 4mm etched loco kit so a friendly chat on the phone can be a significant interruption and often a waste of time from business point of view. Likewise people expect instant answers to emails which sometimes develop into a series of trivial discussions.

I've finished building the double slip, just need to work out how to assemble some Ambis tie rods I've got in stock. I may have to give upon that, based on past experience and order some Masokits ones. So no, I can't send you my MRJ 255, but if you phone me I could offer to read you a bedtime story from it.

Which probably explains why, when visiting a major London dealership for the the European manufacturer I worked for, I was invited to cast my eye over the under bonnet installation on an Australian spec car they had in the workshop. It resembled nothing like anything we were used to in the UK, with what seemed like a myriad of relays and other odd bits clicking away to control the engine systems. Normal UK/European spec had Bosch FI but we didn't know what this was! Being London, they got all sorts of odd spec. vehicles from various Embassies and "dodgy" importers dumped on them if they had a problem.

My subscription copy arrived today, but still unopened as I have been building a double slip to a deadline.

John, a valid point, also covered by John Isherwood. However there is something of a difference between a business like Dapol and Airfix (now part of Hornby) and a much smaller, usually one man, supplier to the specialist end of the hobby. One obvious difference is the distribution network they have, their lower cost products, their appeal to the less skilled, beginners end of the market and their marketing "clout". The first kits most of us made were probably Airfix (or Keil Kraft for the outdoor types). Hornby and Bachmann continue to introduce new products, usually followed by enthusiastic buying and much "frothing" here on RMweb, which surely confirms the benefits new additions to a manufacturers range. Other examples are iPhones, most brands of new German cars, etc. So I stand by my view that new products are important to any business in today's consumer driven age. Had Paul Dunn been able to produce the items he had taken over, then his business would continue, but not as strongly as if he were able to manufacture new items to meet peoples want's. As it is, that's all a pipe dream anyway and the only things we are likely to see available are the etched items, which are sourced outside. Jol

John, I don't think you can separate them, please look back at my post #900. I have assisted one 4mm kit producer for many years and my views are based on that experience. He knew the ranges he absorbed into his business as well as knowing the previous owners very well. Some products have been obtained through "exchange" deals with other suppliers, so that an ongoing business relationship exists. Further, he also seems to know what he is doing. A range that is just maintained will slowly wither. A range that is developed will continue to attract new sales and new customers. Overall sales volume may not increase significantly, but will provide cash flow and the ability to continue marketing the whole range. As we are seeing, just taking over a range is also no guarantee you can readily re-introduce it - which is more accurate than saying "keep it going". In theory, anything that Paul Dunn, PPP or ABS took over, Craftsman, Falcon Brass, the PC range of pre-printed side carriages, and probably quite a few other product ranges should still be available, but sadly aren't. Some still are available but haven't been developed, such as Stevenson Carriages (effectively still selling the 1980's Brian Badger range of LNWR carriage kits). Jol

What war? Oh yes,one of the ones carried on because some people think their views are more important than another person's. I suppose it was only a matter of time before someone had to drag up that piece of history on this forum.

Colin makes a very good point. It can also be very difficult to "pick up" someone else's work, especially when trying to understand how/why they developed a design in a particular way. I have tried - and failed - to sort out another persons etch CAD artwork. So getting a range of products back into production isn't always that easy. So taking over a range where the "corporate knowledge" is no longer available is difficult. In the case of PPP, much of the Sharman Wheels range tooling is rather past it, but why the DMR and Churchward ranges are taking so long to be reintroduced is a mystery. Personally I think they have totally underestimated the work involved.

I think the NNK range wasn't well documented/organised when they took it over. That isn't uncommon and without the former owners knowledge it is often difficult to get these ranges up and running again. I believe the same could be said for the ex Jidenco/Falcon Brass range that Dart Castings took over. It has taken Brassmasters some time to get the Finney 4mm range up and running again, so it isn't always as straightforward as it might seem.

One proven way to keep a range alive is to continually introduce new products. That maintains customer awareness, keeps the cash flow going and keeps older products viable. Examples include Brassmasters, Judith Edge, London Road Models. Absorbing other ranges also can keep existing products in production when the owner retires, E.g. Brassmasters & Finney kits. Provided that is that the new owner has the experience and infrastructure to produce and market stuff in the first place. Part of Paul Dunn's problems are his inability to produce existing products, never mind introduce anything new. Other aspects of this sad tale have already been discussed at length.

It would be interesting to see a Waitrose and a M&S Food Store open opposite each other. The indecision in the car park would be fun to see.

LNWR engine number plates are available from London Road Models and 247 Developments. The LRM list includes 1076, 588, 2461, 3736 and 848. The 247 Developments range on their website is much larger, possibly because the former proprietor produced the plates for the Bachmann model and saw further sales opportunities. You will have to contact either supplier to see what they have in stock.

I have heard that the Avenue is going downhill a bit, possibly through absentee owners who have bought properties as investments.

Colin, I think the cost of producing the mould for the track bases might be prohibitively expensive. It still leaves the issue of making the pointwork. Producing plain track can be done quite quickly using readily available rail, ply sleepers, plastic chairs and solvent. A sleeper positioning jig, laser cut from thin ply and stuck onto a thicker piece or chipboard for stability, would enable you to make track panels quite quickly, usingtrack gauges to ensure accuracy.. That's how I did the plain track seen here. Straight sections can be made in the jig, curved panels have one rail fitted and then finished of in situ. The jig I designed for LNWR 60' track panels was cut by Timber Tracks for me and has now also been used by several other modellers. I aligned two jigs and produced two connected panels at a time. You could also use the jig with pcb sleepers.

Shouldn't the title of this thread be "Are the Planning Regulations, Authorities and Officers fit for purpose?". I saw an episode of Homes under the Hammer recently where it took three years for a builder/developer to get permission to convert two high street retail properties back to housing. During that time there were three arson attacks and other mindless damage caused. Then you have Cafe Nero who like to open coffee shops without change of use applications, only to be let off the hook when it is discovered. There are too many examples where the regs. are not adequately applied, not done so in a timely way and so on.

Which may mean that it meets Bachmann's requirements if they perceive that Peco Streamline and Setrack constitutes "normal" 00 trackwork. Looking at the photos of track on the Bachmann website shows generous flangeways compared to "finescale" track, which is where I think problems could arise.