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My little one is 13, when she was 11 she was using slam door stock, without my help. weve got very short memories… 25th April 2021…3 years ago today I took this… even in 2019 5 London Termini had regular cdl slam door services everyday… If I goto Paddington tonight, I still can, six nights a week. its not that long ago… mk3 cdl slam doors only retired during covid, even in 2021 thousands of passengers a day were using slam doors.

Set up an election leaflet printing & media company.

In which case Q1 should be good. Black 5’s all round.

Given the mass waste and premature scrapping of stock, together with the long term storage of nearly new to mid life stock… I can’t imagine any leasing company being prepared to cut any one any favours on new build.

Looking at a 700.. the doors are blue, the ends are yellow, but in the main body it appears undecided. if you look inside, invariably its a rotten borough, but if you do get a seat you hold onto it for dear life. Like politics getting on the ride is easy enough, you just don't know where your going or when your going to get off. Just imagine Abba arriving in London today and writing a song about Thameslink, instead of Waterloo… My, my At Farringdon, Desiro did surrender Oh, yeah And I have met my destiny in quite a similar way Thameslink times on the shelf Is always repeating itself Thameslink I was defeated, you won the war Thameslink Promise to dump me on the floor. Thameslink Couldn't escape if I wanted to Thameslink Knowing my fate is to be with you Thaaaaaaameslinkkkk Finally facing my journeys end My, my I tried to hold you back, but you were stronger Oh, yeah And now it seems my only chance is giving up the fight And how could I ever refuse I feel like I lose when I win Thameslink … if were being apolitical… I guess Black is the best paint job… I like this myself.. new BR.. (Flickr url ). Rush Rail… even the name works.

Anything that puts a new livery onto Thameslinks 700’s is good by me.

Back in the early days of the TT thread I suggested Hornby would be better to stick to a theme, grow it and be good at it, instead of throwing seeds in the air and see what grows. That thread got quite hostile to that idea, as everyone wanted their own preference over anyone elses. That said, a year in, the LNER/ER theme seems to be gaining ground, as does the 1980’s theme. The problem for launching a new mass market scale, is the subject matter is just way too big for anyone manufacturer. Everyone else was scared away. So its a long hard decade for Hornby to grow it. Trouble is on Hornbys current financial trajectory will they run out of runway before hand ? The other risk is Hornby could do all the hard work, but pay the price of being first, if the others do to TT what they did to OO… because again, it could become too big for one to handle alone, and new comers will target upgrades of mass market prototypes, not the left over dregs. it was never truly clear to me whom the TT target was, as what they said and what they did, didn't seem to match. A few years in, it feels like the TT customer is the same as a potential N or OO customer, thus cannibalising an existing market, rather than growing it. To me growth in the hobby is by stretching the eras… post Privatisation and pre1923, as these are less catered for… Geographically the UK is covered, as is 1923-1994 saturated with not much room to grow. Beyond that, start knocking on doors and convince Airplane enthusiasts, Military modellers and computer gamers to switch hobby…. Thats a hard ask imo… would you switch from Railways to Military modelling ?.. Steampunk gave us an idea how hard that is. My personal feeling is Hornby needs to use its IP assets more, and its capex on tooling less… its strength isnt in super detail, but its name, yet it doesnt seem to play it as strongly as it could… whats more a big gap in that market has just been created and I dont even think theyve seen it.

On the tender I do know the led board for the lamp is jst’d into the circuit board in the tender. just unplug it, or remove it completely. The tender lamp is like the smokebox lamp.. a light track out of the back, not underneath..so a good push from inside the tender should move it. (sorry never thought to mention this earlier but I handled one of these at Warley looking at that). My plan was to use an expo nut spinner to push it with as it locks the light track inside the tube and reduces chance of it breaking sideways as I push it. I did suggest to Hornby that removing them from inside/underneath would be less risky than pulling them (ive learned that the hard way with such things in the past), no idea if that sunk in, but Sams videos he was trying to pull it, which I wouldn't do myself.

It wasnt confirmed. agreed if it is, its unfortunate. I do know at Warley they suggested to me they might be. But we need confirmation on that… Its not neccessarily a killer blow, but a lesson learned if it is. it wont stop me having a go, Chinese glue isnt always what its cracked up to be. But conceptually that doesnt mean the product should be dead and buried in the future.

Exactly… ive repeatedly said… the lamps are removable…you can set them up however you want, including all or none at all. The rest and irons, are in the parts bag, along side the vac hose, shank, brakegear, snowplough…. if you don't like it, just remove them all and put lamp-irons in. were supposed to be railway modellers, is fitting a lamp/iron into a hole designed for it suddenly beyond us ? i used to make lamp irons out of matchstick shavings 30 years ago when lamp irons werent even available, let alone lamps.

i Think those models could be interpreted as anything !

Was that in expectation of a Germanic conquest of the UK being successful ? That LNER pacific looks more like a Polish Pm36, the Streamlined LMS one like an SNCB Type 12. odd observeration, but those R numbers never aged well.. R742 became a white ferry van R749 is a yellow crane but the rest… R765 became the red Triang hall, with number 25555 R842 is a red black 5… R849 became a Thomas set R865 stayed as a freight set, becoming a GWR freight set.

Truth be known, you and me both, and probably a whole lot more of us on this forum are in the same boat there.

I might be wrong, but I reckon Hornby are munching extra popcorn and having a good laugh at this thread, a Friday lunchtime sweepstakes up for grabs betting on which of us makes the most outlandish statement. For me, this initial model has the bling thing not right. I’m hoping coupling and warping isnt a wider issue. The rest of it looks bob on. My concern holding me back is the trend of the initial 10% off becoming a 25% off in 6-8 weeks… a £229 model being £210 suddenly being £170.. and then me painting another £50 off its resale some day means I be a £90 mug loser today, but waiting 6-8 weeks and losing only £50 isnt so bad, considering It maybe years before I ever get bored of it and consolidate that loss… I still have my 5241 from 1993… paid £30 for that and bought a £30 loco drive chassis for it 10 years ago… and fitted my own lamp irons to it, made from match stick shavings… if I ever sold it I bet I might get my original £30 back.

Whats aprototypical….? A Black 5 probably carried every possible configuration possible of [choose word of choice] (lamp/light/lantern/candle/flame/inflammable device). No one would ever agree which one it should come out of the factory with, and until today the choice was none anyway. I guess the real question is… should they have made the model with no lamps fitted, and left the modeller to do it themselves… We all know the majority would never open the parts bag, so most models with lamps would be wasted. But will it hurt sales ? Its possible lamp objections might hurt retailer sales, but equally this polarising gizmo might be attracting customers into shops to look at it… But Hornbys customer is the retailer, and I bet right now they probably want a few to show those drawn in… if the model has other issues, being suggested, thats a different story.

So remove the lights… they are supposedly configurable with lamp irons in the bag. No doubt a good shop like TMC could probably do it for you. This is the evolution the W1 and 6202 didnt have, and presumably done with people with flexible requirements like yourself in mind. it shouldnt be any different to choosing whether or not to add a snowplough or coupling shank.

Dapols A4 seemed to have been the catalyst for Hornbys upscaling in the recent modelling era… thats December 2015.., in peoples hands December 2016. it had sound, lights and smoke, oh and a metal body…. (Dublo appeared with 6231 in 2020). The W1 followed, with non working lights..in Jan 2022 then the Turbo with working lights in September 2023 Err… this is the point people started seeing red about lights… literally. the Black 5 seems the next evolution with posable lights. Hornby smoke and the metal body dublo has followed a similar trajectory and timeline. its worth pointing out Dapol A4’s £400 price tag was seen as high then, roll on to 44726 with lights and steam is £292, and its plastic, and the dublo ones are over £300 in metal without sound and lights its actually inflation friendly. Dapol did state the A4 was first in a series of Black label locomotives, but no more followed, not even a re-run of the A4, and there has been a few grumblings about the features there too. I do think the Dapol A4 set a standard that has still to be beaten, rainstrips and spare “traction tyred” options havent been copied, though the big box size has been adopted by nearly everyone… But in features terms it had it all… If Dapol had followed the Black label A4 with an A3 in 2017, a Duchess in 2018, Princess in 2019 etc Hornby could have been in trouble with all the other duplication wars they were fighting.

how much does 3x 0204 leds, a bit of wire cost, and cutting a few 3x4mm pieces of plastic off a sprue. If the model didnt have it, the price would still be the same. Indeed if lamps are abandoned, the next run of Black 5’s could simply not include it, have the lamp irons fitted and still be priced higher due to inflation. moaning about lamps is just an excuse, unlike the W1, Turbomotive these lamps are adjustable… indeed theres absolutely nothing stopping a modeller doing exactly that today… remove the lamps, fit the lamp iron, buy some 1980’s springside lamps and hey presto your happily back in your 2008 Black 5 quality bubble. sell the lamps as spares on ebay, you’ll find a ton of takers. My issue with 5200 isnt the lamps, I like it. I think the whole Black 5 is a magnitude improvement. I dont like repainting a £200 model to make it closer match, and watching its value fall quite steeply as a result… if 45157 has the wheels right, like the EP, i’m probably in. Now whats to moan about next ?

I thought it was supposed to be lamps ? according to your earlier post…. indeed here even the MOT agrees.. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/mot-inspection-manual-for-private-passenger-and-light-commercial-vehicles/4-lamps-reflectors-and-electrical-equipment#:~:text=Front and rear position lamps,function as front position lamps. Language Inconsistency is a tolerated fact of life, you can mince words all day, but everyone knows what you mean. Doesnt stop money being made, I was once paid £1500 a day to meet with banks and discuss if the bottom most position of a server rack (known as an RU) was 0 or 1… I did that session more than 30 times, so theres money to be made in mincing words (and numbers)… some heated conversations between very senior IT directors about labelling a 1.75” x 19” wide piece of space.. Twenty years later there still isnt an agreed standard, its a company and vendor specific issue that causes expensive headaches with planners…it can cause outages, over heating, unplanned capex, delays. No doubt ERTMS will face similar debates if theres multiple vendors of hardware for the racks in rolling stock… I can forsee the day a fleet cannot be upgraded because the hardware is incorrectly mounted or shuts down overheated all because of a trivial label taken for granted.

its no different in 00… if you want to model passenger stock as maybe seen running today from Fenchurch st, Charing cross, Cannon st, liverpool st, London Bridge, waterloo, victoria, Blackfriars or Marylebone… you just have 1 choice… a class 159. After that its a second hand class 171/455… at a stretch you could repaint a class 165... all of them are Bachmann. What makes it even more bizarre is 1 class of unit could be seen at 7 of the above 9 stations…. And at 2 of the other four London termini (but the mainlines of 3 within the zone too !) with at least 9 liveries. And so instead Hornby picked an obscure unit that only runs in Anglia in 1 livery. Its ok blaming the sales guy for sales, but he can only sell the product in front of him… if the product choices are restricted its no surprise that sales will be too.

Sutton to Epsom downs was once considered as a preserved railway, Sutton council even bought a loco for it. the line didnt close in the end. I always thought the Grassington branch could be a preserved railway, from Skipton. The ELR from Bolton to Castleton may have been a bit more commercially attractive too, with some fascinating viaducts. Then of course Dinting Railway Centre running to Penistone :-)

these arent that big. neither are these..as you can see its all glass, the bulbs fairly normal. Size isnt everything. They are fixed position though, thats the real translation issue. So now translate that to Chinese, and expect them to get it right first time. I want a light, that doesnt light up, but does actually work, but might never be fitted at all. Why, its because its not for seeing your way in the dark. Oh and actually its a lamp because a light is a window. Reminds me of a conversation I had at the Portola railroad museum once, the guy asked if I had a light, I said ive got a torch… He replied if your still using torches in Britain ive got a business proposition for you. Frank Carson would be right for this job… its the way you tell em.

Class 101’s ran until 2001. class 205 until 2004. CIGs ran until 2010. any advance on that for something without cdl ? Class 121 for Chiltern until 2017 any advance on that for slam door, but these had cdl since 2004. iirc the 121 was also the end of scheduled vac brake passenger stock too.

I thought I read elsewhere Chiltern ditched the mk5 idea and are going to refurb the mk3’s to save money ? (Admittedly ive no idea if its true or not).

Fair enough, next time a factory makes a model in China, ensure they get a copy of the BR Rulebook in Chinese. LED…its now a Lamp Emitting Diode.