DRS Crewe On A Mission

I'm in exactly the same position. I keep telling myself that I don't need GBRF locos. But with these well captured fantastic liveries that keep appearing they are too good to say no. Completely agree. Well done to Kernow and Bachmann.

Thank you very much for posting this. I really appreciate it. This is another one of those models where even though I didn't intend to buy it before it was announced and released it just seems like a must have. I can't afford it at the moment but I am hoping that their will be some left soon. The livery, graphics and printing looks amazing. I just think that I need to buy this model soon before they sell out otherwise I will be left paying higher prices or buying a respray. Hopefully I will have the money soon to support Kernow with their Limited Editions. There looking amazing. Well done Kernow!

I agree. Regardless if their are tooling upgrades/modifications to be made to produce locos their certainly should be some sort of order. I think the issue that Bachmann have at the moment is that their are just so many newly tooled or retooled models that have been announced that their just clearly isn't the time or the factory space to produce all of these models in a reasonable time scale. Hopefully we will see more progress with these models over the coming months.

Yes thinking about it it would make sense to release more liveries on the 158 over the coming years. That would mean that the 158s could be part of the main range within the catalogue over the coming years. For example the 66s have been very dominant both within the main range and as Limited and Exclusive Editions over the last couple of years especially. Now that so many have been released over such a short period of time I think Bachmann need to produce more of different classes of locos to fill the gaps. It would also mean that Bachmann could receive the profit of the 158s over a much longer period alike what they have with the 66s. This option seems worthwhile because it would keep people interested and buying the 158s for several years and it would be more of an ongoing project rather than a short and sweet project that only lasts a couple of years if four models were to be released in the first batch. Starting the project slowly releasing two liveries at a time also gives the operators in reality more time to have the 158s repainted/re-vinyled. This in turn means that we would most likely see these new liveries appear on the models in future too. I do hope that this what I suspect is a project by upgrading and modifying the tooling for the 158 is a success for Bachmann. I'm sure if the models have new/upgraded tooling, hopefully more lighting and detailing, more liveries, the ability to fit DCC Decoders and DCC Sound Decoders and if the price is right this will attract many customers, meaning that the project is a huge success. As many have said a waiting time of five years for these two models since the original announcement and a possible land grab isn't ideal but I am willing to give Bachmann a chance here. I would like to think that their are some fantastic models in the making.

Very true. As Bachmann haven't produced 158s for many years now they could see that as a gap/opportunity in the market. I agree with this. The old models were produced several years ago and wear the older liveries which are now no longer worn by the some or if not all of the 158s in reality. With many livery changes this would seem a good justification to upgrade/modify the tooling to produce better models, with DCC sockets to allow DCC Decoders to be fitted. It would also allow Bachmann to produce some of the more up to date/latest liveries worn by the class. This seems very worthwhile but I personally, alike you and no doubt many others agree that they need to produce more/different liveries. Maybe this is going to happen in further batches but it might be a better idea to try and capture more of the target market within the first batch produced. This would increase sales and profits within the first batch and no doubt justify the tooling upgrades/modifications. For example I won't be buying the Regional Railways 158 or the EMT 158 because I don't model the era or area. However if a Northern Rail Blue and Purple or the new Northern Rail white livery were produced if I could afford them I would buy both. So it just shows how much the liveries produced can attract the market. The first two liveries aren't for me but if the Northern Rail liveries were produced I would be very interested. I would think that if the first two models sell well Bachmann will make the 158s a more common, ongoing project throughout their announcements and product range. I am sure we will see more liveries produced in the future, after the first batch as this would provide more models to be released in further years/announcements.

I completely agree here. The RRP prices on the Bachmann website still say TBA. Even by the RRP prices five years ago when these two models were announced it must have been in the region of £150 for a two car unit without sound and £250 for a two car unit fitted with sound. I agree that the sound unit will now no doubt be £300+ and no doubt the none sound unit will be £200+. I wonder just out of interest how many people will buy these units at no doubt such high prices? It's such a shame because if these models had been available in 2014 or 2015 just one or two years after they had been announced the prices may not have been as high as what they are going to be now. I know that Bachmann can't predict what's going to happen in the economy in the five year period from 2012 to present but I'm sure it goes without saying or seeing the price tags that they will be expensive because of the current costs in producing/manufacturing, shipping, increases in pay abroad and the fall in the pound. The five year time span so far from announcement until present could be the difference between a large amount of sales and an increase in profit and now people not been able to afford to buy the locos which means a reduction/decrease in profit and sales. If Bachmann did announce these 158 models as a land grab I do have to wonder at this moment in time if it will have been worth it by the time the models arrive with retailers and people have seen the price tags. I'm sure the models will be great when they are produced and hopefully the prices will be affordable.

Thank you very much for the reply. I really appreciate it. I am running on DCC. I haven't speed matched them as I don't know how to do that at the moment. I bought a new controller a couple of months ago and I am still getting used to the basic features but this could be something to look at. I will have to have a look in the instruction manual. I may have managed to solve the problem. I have changed the couplings from the Dapol ones which come fitted to Hornby ones. These work a lot better despite them looking practically the same. I am assuming that the bar on the coupling is more rigid and sturdier. I have ran two locos together and they seem to run fine provided that they don't go any higher than speed setting twelve. Hopefully this will continue. Thank you very much for all of your help. I really appreciate it. I will report more about how it's going on my thread.

True, that is making an assumption that younger people entering the hobby buy new. But if you are wanting the latest liveries and releases you have to buy brand new models. For example take Class 66s. If you want the modern/new liveries eg Freightliner Powerhaul and DRS Revised you have to buy brand new which in that case costs around £130 per model. However if you want original EWS liveried 66s or the original GBRF livery these can be bought on Ebay and off of other sites, second hand for around £70/£80. It largely depends on the era that you want to model and if you are happy buying the older liveries. I might be in a minority but I do prefer some of the more modern liveries as opposed to the earlier liveries on diesel locos. In this case you have to buy brand new models. It's good however that their is a cheaper market out their for people who want to buy earlier locos and earlier liveries which have been produced several years ago. That's the good thing about this hobby, their is something for everyone. Although if you do want to buy the latest releases you do have to buy brand new locos and pay higher prices. Again I'm not complaining about price increases. I'm just commenting for discussion purposes.

I have been in the hobby a good decade now and I have seen the most noticeable price increases. Back in 2010 a brand new tooled Freightliner Class 70 was £79.50. The latest batch due to arrive in August/September with the new air intakes fitted to the sides are £145 each. That just shows how much things can change in seven years. I suppose if you want to buy highly detailed, ready to run models with working directional and cab lighting that can have standard DCC Decoders and Sound Decoders fitted then you have to overcome the increase in prices. If you want the more basic models without any of the above then you can continue to buy Lima models for very cheap, reasonable prices. It just shows the massive difference in both directions that we now have. One end of the scale < Lima The other end of the scale > Bachmann, Hornby, Dapol etc.

Very true. Several years ago I bought a DRS 37611 which was a Lima model. It looked quite good for the time but when I got it home it made such a racket. This was back still when I had an analogue controller and layout so it suited at the time as these locos can't be fitted with DCC Decoders. A few days later though I decided to return it to the shop due to the loud noise that it was making. It just wasn't a good runner at all. That was the turning point for me. I had already bought several Bachmann locos and wanted to buy a Lima loco to see what it was like. I then decided to continue buying Bachmann locos due to their high level of detailing and smooth running. Of course Bachmann locos have always cost more money but that's the price I am willing to pay, even though they are significantly higher. About the number of locos my point is that even if you was just to buy one of each loco in each livery it's still very costly. Also a standard Hornby diesel loco tends to be more than a Bachmann diesel loco with Class 60s and 67s now £140/£150. Personally I want to run multiple locos at once, I want them to have working lights (directional and cab) and to have the ability to fit DCC Decoders to allow more than once loco to run on the layout at once. So yes DCC is for me. This does mean buying Bachmann, Hornby, Dapol locos etc which have DCC sockets and that are more expensive. I suppose this is the price that you have to pay to run multiple locos at once or have more than one loco on the layout. Also very true. At least Lima diesels are still available to buy from some model shops and off of Ebay. That's good for people entering the hobby but for me creating a modern image layout which includes locos with new liveries it just has to be DCC. Also very true. The mix in models available is very good because it meets everyone's needs, whether that's just entering the hobby, continuing in the hobby or returning to the hobby. It's good that their is something for everyone. The sad thing about the Lima locos is that because of when they were produced before DCC, they don't have DCC sockets which means that they can't be fitted with DCC Decoders, unless in some cases some people have hard wired them, but for most like me this isn't practical and wouldn't know where to start. DCC is very good and it's something that I am glad that I invested in. The cost of DCC Controllers, DCC Decoders and locos with DCC sockets in is well worth the money to create the layout with the locos on it that I want. But it is costly. I suppose it's all about supply and demand at the time. What is it that people want? What features do people want? And when do people want it? That influences the prices, affordability and target market.

Couldn't agree more. Luckily I was entering the hobby with modern image locos and rolling stock a few years ago. By this point I have had the opportunity to acquire several Bachmann diesel locos for just £70 or £80 brand new. This is now a distant memory and I feel sorry for those just starting out now trying to buy locos and stock. Personally if that was me now trying to afford some of these locos and wagons I would barely be able to buy anything. Standard diesel locos are now nearly £130. I agree that this is a massive barrier for younger people to enter the hobby because they most likely have not got the money to spend £130 on one standard loco. Really it's a sad sign of the times because if things keep going the way they are with regards to increased prices, which I know has to happen in order for manufacturers to make profit, it will most likely mean that younger people have to either stop purchasing model railway goods or can't even consider entering the hobby in the first place. I'm not complaining about the increase in prices because I know why the prices have increased. I simply feel sorry for and sympathise with people my age and younger about the costs of this hobby.

Thank you very much for letting me know. I really appreciate it. I have just entered the email address that I have been receiving the emails on and that has worked. I have now changed my password because I couldn't remember it and I have updated my address and phone number. On my order status it's saying that I haven't ordered anything yet which I thought was correct. It looks like I am ready to order something as and when I have the money and by the looks of it I should get the 10% off with it been my first order. Thank you very much for all of the help.

Looking good Jim. I knew that you would buy the Hornby Colas 60. Now that I have seen some photos of the model it looks really tempting.

Thanks for the info Mick. I wasn't aware of this. Really LTM took a big risk then commissioning Bachmann to produce the S Stock. With it been a brand new model with new tooling the cost to pay Bachmann to produce so many of them must have been significant. I really hope that the S Stock is selling well for LTM because prior to the first batch been available to buy they had no idea how well or not they were going to sell. Considering that the first batch was for sale at £280 it was quite a high price that LTM were relying on customers paying. Please could anyone tell me how you sign up to the LTM newsletter to get the 10% off of your first order? I have looked on the website and I can't see anything. I get emails from LTM. Is this the newsletter that I have already signed up for or does the newsletter come as a paper copy to the house? Considering the risk that LTM have took by commissioning Bachman to produce such fantastic models I am more than willing to support them as and when I can. Especially when they are a charity as well. It's all the more worthwhile. Thank you very much in advance.

This is just an idea but could LTM be selling the latest two four car sets for £340 in the hope that tourists will buy them? After all this would fit in with what 159220 said in the original comment regearding the release of these models on the previous page. Perhaps they are priced significantly higher in the hope that tourists will buy them at whatever the cost. After all tourists that visit London have undoubtedly got money to spend and what better idea to spend it on than a collectors item/memrobellia. After all they are very nice sets and no doubt anyone that was to see them in the flesh on display at the LTM shop would agree. Also the tourists are classed as passing trade as they are visiting the capital/area. They therefore probably wouldn't know about the LTM website in which models can also be purchased through. My guess is the target market for these models in the latest batch are tourists. It is July now and the start of summer time. No doubt July and August are very busy and popular months for tourists to visit the capital. It seems more than a coincidence that these have just been released and are today supposed to be announced. I would think that after the summer and closer to the end of the year and maybe after Christmas their will be a significant reduction in price, if their are any of these sets left. That gives a big second opportunity to sell the models after the summer because people would most likely buy them as Christmas presents. Again just my own thoughts and opinions. I could be wrong.

I just can't help myself

I could be completley wrong but did the first people to pre-order or buy the first four car set released in 2015 get a Limited Edition certificate with their model? I think these were the same people that got to actually travel on one of the S Stock sets. However to my knowledge it wasn't stated anywhere that the first batch in 2015 would be the first, last and one and only batch. If this was the case surely it wouldn't have been financailly viable for Bachmann to produce them in the first place considering that the whole set is brand new tooling for both the driving cars and the immediate cars. I personally welcome these two new sets, even though I may not buy either of them because I can't afford them. It gives others a chance if they are willing to pay the increased price to acquire a set or two. To my knowledge a couple of teething issues have been reported which have been to do with the slow power up inclines or gradients on layouts and the fact that the height of the driving cars and immediate cars is different. However, apart from these minor niggles I would say they are fantastic models, with superb new tooling and the livery and finish is excellent. Despite the couple of minor niggles I would say another excellent release by Bachmann.

Thank you very much for letting me know. I really appreciate it. I will look forward to reading the announcement tomorrow. As I am in no rush to acquire a second four car set I am definitely going to wait until later on this year/after Christmas to see if the price is reduced further than 10%. That's if their are any left. If not I am very happy with the set that I have.

Thank you very much for posting this and for letting me know. I really appreciate it. Maybe then, just maybe if their are still some left over after Christmas they will be reduced by 20%. That would make these latest four car sets £272. That would be much more appealing. It could be worth holding off then and seeing what happens later on in the year. Once again thank you very much for posting this information. It's very good to know.

I'm not sure that LTM do any clearance prices as such. They do the 10% discount when you sign up to their newsletter and on certain days, weekends and bank holidays they also offer 10% off. I know this because I get the emails through. I have had a few recently but their wasn't anything that I wanted to buy. I don't recall any clearance prices on the last batch of tube sets in 2015, although I could be wrong. After the latest tube sets have had their 10% discount knocked off of the original price of £340 which takes the price down to £306 I would be very surprised if their was anymore discount on these models. I could be wrong but as has been mentioned above LTM are a charity and no doubt they want to sell the models for as much as what they can. We will have to wait and see.

A couple of years ago I posted similar comments regarding price increases. Whilst us as customers don't want price increases we have to accept them and be prepared to pay them if we want to see such fantastic models produced with a wealth of attention and detail. Some of the reasons for increased prices are: significant increases in production costs, increases in staff wages in China where the models are produced and increased costs in transport and shipping. Adding all of these costs together I'm not surprised that Bachmann have had to increase their prices. If not they would be producing models at a loss, which in the long term means a financially unstable and unsustainable business. This is not to mention the fall in the pound in the last year or so and another factor that should be considered is that this second batch of two four car sets have been produced two years after the first batch in 2015. In two years their are bound to be some price increases. But the models that Bachmann and many other manufacturers are producing now are of a very high quality. Personally I think it's worth paying the higher prices for a better model which without a price increase wouldn't be able to be produced in the first place.

Thank you very much for letting me know. I really appreciate it. So just to clarify that you can only get the 10% off once when you sign up for the newsletter? I completely agree with you. No disrespect to LTM or any other deserving charity but for me personally £340 without any discount is too much to pay. With the discount however this would make the model £306 which is more appealing but still quite a high price. The 10% off may tempt me if and when I have some more money. Just out of interest does anyone know the running numbers of the two new four car sets? There is only one picture on the LTM website of each set and you can't zoom in. Also does anyone know what the destination boards say? Thank you very much in advance.

Have to say well done to Bachmann. Very impressive stuff. Lots of fantastic models in the making here.

Sorry I wasn't aware that the LTM was a charity. Well you learn something new every day. In that case 10% off for a charity is very generous. I'm still glad that I bought a four car set from the first batch for £250. As much as I love these tube sets I could not have afforded £340 without the discount from a set from batch two. If you don't mind me asking can anyone sign up to the newsletter? Does this give you 10% off all or selected models? Are their specific times when the 10% discount is on? Or is it on all the time? Thank you very much in advance.

Thank you Andy. I will have a read. I wasn't aware of this. Thank you very much for letting me know.