Junctionmad

then thats even a more unfortunate situation were products to disappear

firstly ply and rivet was a option because at the time there was nothing else, except copper clad, but in reality it was merely a form of copper clad on a slightly better looking sleeper. chaired track is " where its at " today ( as PECO recently discovered ) and nothing beats it for realism, If 4mm modelling isnt to decend into a process of opening RTR boxes, we need to do more to endure continuity of specialist parts. There is no reason in this world a society like Scalefour cant stock and supply specialist parts to any modeller that wishes to join it . Equally the addition stock items in track to support either EM / 00 ( in c&Ls case , this amounts to a few tracks gauges and a longer slide chair ) would be of no consequence to the Society given this amounts to a handful of different parts ( 2-3 ) , a fail to see this as an issue . what I am talking about is Exactoscale chairs , the vast majority are 00EMP4 ( or simply not available for 00) a few track gauges , all the rest is gauge independant , much of which the Society already supplies ( sleepers, rail etc )

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i see no reason , why someone building finescale track should not have to join , it they need access to certain components.

are you seriously suggesting that a business of whatever calibre, would have no online presence .........???. seriously , business is about sales , end of

no I meant the various societies should ensure that such components are sourced from the original suppliers, I doubt C&L were drawing track or moulding chairs. but the societies have the buying power and the financials to order in larger quantities

I wish the staff , the best of fortunes , its sad to see them get the short end of the stick, always had a great service from them and Pete, its very sad to see this business revert to a " cottage industry " whatever that means The supply of track components needs to taken in hand by the relevant gauge societies in my view, it shouldn't be solely dependant on a single supplier ( we have been here before )

Don't think countries of the size of the U.K., need much of a navy these days. Small highly trained specialist forces trained for asymmetric warfare , anti-Terrorism duties etc. Sea based assets would be limited to material deployment duties and a few missile carriers , etc. The question of an aircraft carrier is a balance as its really not an naval asset in reality, rather a mobile airfield, That happens to be on a boat. Money best spent elsewhere rather then nostalgic power projection

Batteries are smooth , but not particularly well regulated Good modern power supplies come close , with low ripple current and good regulation ( better then a battery ) The issue as far as I can see is the voltage reg circuitry in the sgnal is too tightly spec'd and fails on voltage spikes or slightly higher voltages then originally Dapol suggested people use , ie 16VAC. . A little dedicated AC to DC regulator just for the signal would most likely cure the issue. It wouldn't be the first Chinese etc, product that has poor power supply design

I bought one to test , I power it from 12vdc regulated ( switched mode power supply ) , it's still working , but the momentary interface is rubbish for automation , so I'm not using it in anger. I suspect the issue stems from the control circuit for the motor must have components that are too closely specified and fail on an excessive voltage spike Dapol , its worth noting originally advised against 12vdc , now they are advising against AC. The issue I suspect is the internal voltage reg, or its components fail on a input voltage spike. Some AC outputs especially older " auxiliary " outputs from controllers were very poorly specified and often n excess of 16vac. Bad design and too expensive for me

Jeepers , nothing natural where I live can kill me , thank goodness the only poisonous animal that stings here , has to stand for election from time to time

The amp rating of the power supply is irrelevant, you could use a 9V 100A power supply and its the same as a 9V 500 mA as far as the signal is concerned a 12V transformer is NOT smoothed and regulated , equally I would not recommend AC . Has anyone put a oscilloscope on these, I suspect there is ringing ( voltage overshoot ) on the supply lines that is killing them Dapols latest instruction sheet strongly recommends 12VDC smoothed and regulated , I would recommend you do not use AC output supplies equally they ( the signals ) are designed for momentary action switches and definitely not CDUs, in fact no voltage or power of any kind should be applied to the switch inputs PS: 12AC /500MA AC supplies are typically NOT regulated , the output voltage especially under the low loads of these signals, could be well above 12VAC 9VAC, again NOT regulated Typically for various reasons, only DC power supplies will be regulated

The load solely determines the current drawn. hence " 1 amp is way too much " does not apply. A 1 amp power supply is a rating that says the power supply is " capable " of supplying 1amp is the load resistance is such that that is necessary If the power draw is too great, its the voltage thats the problem Dapol now recommend 12VDC smoothed and regulated

I just finished fibreglassing some baseboards ( modular glue and tape design ) , styrene monomer isnt supposed to be released indoors !!!. I find it best in these things to beg for forgiveness then ask for permission !!!!

Hey , leave Gordon alone !!

I know , some have mentioned PECO in the same sentence as P4 !

I have all three C&L exactoscale , DCC concepts and PECO. ( I did a review of DCC a while back) . The Peco compares well and in fact is now my ready made bullhead of choice. Its a bit cheaper then the other ( though not by much , although its likely to be discounted ) . The chair detail is nice and unlike the exactoscale , the base webbing makes it easier to lay in nice curves , I find I have to cut the exactoscale fast track webs. Its robustness is similar as all the others, The DCC concepts is by far the lest robust and its now not my rail of choice as Im bamboozled as to why they went for stainless track ( everything is just more difficult. ) Inow now trying to building matching point work and Im in a quandary as to whether to go all plastic or ply and chair

The whiff of heresy about this thread is increasing . Its not safe I tell you. foul deeds are afoot

While I wish any project well . I shudder to think of the business outcomes that could result. Oh and when the lawyers tell you shareholders agreements are neccessary , I shudder again. I've successfully been involved in two startups and when you have to bang a shareholders agreement on the table and or enforce it in the courts, the business will be long dead. Private people , especially in a hobby business will quite happily shout " sue me " and continue to be difficult I personally think there is too much emphasis on the acquiring of moulds , the talk about injection moulding machines. The world is full of contract manufactures , people who , like , actually know how to run these things. It really matter not that it's produced in Bombay or Bognor in reality. The issue isn't Brexit or anything else , the U.K. Along with the developed world , simply isn't the place to make cheap stuff in a lockup , it's a place to make high quality dear stuff. If people can source capital within their group, surely the key is to commission new CAD , commission tooling and simply reissue some of these designs to modern standards . An example is what happened in recent years in Irish outline 00 modelling , where a whole host of small suppliers now exist , both new rtr locos , new finescale rtr wagons , along side etched kits , resin etc, all serving a very niche market indeed all at the premium end of the market ( there's not a 15 quid wagon to be seen ) Hence my view that the idea of buying life expired moulds , and loading them into , life expired 2nd hand machines, seems utterly daft to me. It's in effect repeating exactly what CC tried ( what did Einstein say about insanity ) Money men should stick to providing money , use it to fund the creation and production of new detailed kits , if it doesn't stack up , it doesn't stack up. Distribution into bricks and mortar establishments is old hat. The world has gone online, nor can you easily have both distributions strategies , as Hornby found out. Today a kit business should have a good website , modern payment. Processes , auto email updates, shipping updates etc. Etc. , all doable for reasonable money. Keep the retail margin in the production unit. Forget about retailer distribution. ( because you will give away 30-50'% of your margin and you will generate horrible channel conflict ) The issue is to prevent the disappearance of kits , not neccessaryily the maintenance of old moulds and machine run by some lad that will work in a lockup for tuppemce. Do it right, sell them at the expensive end of the market , the evidence is there are plenty that will pay.

Railway modelling is now a preserve of relatively affluent older people with time on their hands. The cheap end of the hobby is rapidly disappearing , so while many of us can sympathise with your perspective , the hobby is changing , even RTR is getting increasing expensive as locos head for the 150-200 pound mark , then you can add DCC sound etc ( theres another 100 quid an all ). Hence as I commented recently , were not far off the £1000 model goods train to suggest that anyone in this say and age , will start a business selling wagon kits to " hobbyists" for £10-12 a pop is just nonsense, rules, regulations , the need to make a living, insurance etc etc etc are all reasons why young people start software businesses not injection moulding ones. My problem is we are faced with a perfect storm, scratch building /kit building 4mm modelling is witnessing a serious decline , since I started in the 70s and left the hobby in 85 , and rejoined in 2008, its noticeable how many suppliers of wheels , castings , bits and pieces etc have disappeared. ( while paradoxically , the internet , email, paypal etc , make it easier then ever before for cottage industries to reach their , often world-wide, audience ) Now we have places like cambrian, PD , C&L Exactoscale etc , all looking to sell ( or failing to sell ) and in essence potential disappearing with their owners ( not wishing ill will on anyone ) all of whom , like ian kirk are getting older ( like the rest of us ) . Those of us for example that hand build track would be severely discombobulated if for example C&L ended up being sold and going the way of Coppercraft. ( which is in the lineage of Sudiolith -> ExactoScale etc ) we will need to face facts, There is a danger that the 4mm non rtr hobby will die out with the generation that mainly introduced its popularity The hobby will then be in the hands of limited commission based RTR , and specialist suppliers of a limited number that are very expensive ( and I dont begrudge them their pricing ) . It staggers me what some 0 gauge RTR stuff is going for and people are actually paying it. Our only hope is that those that are capable , will access the new world of " instant manufacturing : , like commissioned etches, 3D , or crowd funding However we have a ways to go , many hardly can drive a computer , never mind high end CAD. 3D and 2D CNC milling and cutting will be increasingly better, but instant manufacturing technology is never going to cheap . high end machines will always be expensive I think we can safely say that in the meantime , we are heading for the £30-40 wagon , the £80 coach and $150-200 loco pricing range , the old days are one , never to return BTW those of you lamenting the young etc , need to seriously wise up as to the issues in starting a business today. The recent global crash has removed a generation of entrepreneurs , and only those that receive significant startup support are making a go of it ( and large numbers are failing ) . I dont see any upside to this

Gordon , All modern PCBs are now glass fibre , typically FR4, its ruinous to cut and the fibres not good for your health. I suspect the issue with C&L etc , is that phenolic base copperclad is now very hard to source and I think the remaining sources are in china. ( if you search Aliexpress.com you can get 5 sheets for a few quid , free postage etc ( search on aliexpress.com , for phenolic or bakelite single sided pcb ) , 1.6mm is easily available , 1 mm is very difficult to find I wouldn't attempt to saw FRP4 in a proxxon quite frankly Your idea would work fine with Phenolic paper ( bakelite ) Id suggest you order a bit from aliexpress.com and try it

This is an unfortunate attitude, and one that bedevils a certain "00" mentality . The fact remains OO can be made as detailed as anyone requires, the narrow track is an accident of history. 00 can be as fine scale as your want

theres no requirement to have a joggle in BH turnout construction and no need to mill any stock rail

I hope it's a solid blade like the sample I saw at Warley. , a folded blade is all wrong for bullhead. I personally would look elsewhere rather then accept that compromise . Loose heeled , I'm not too worried about

H&M point motors = damaged turnouts , in my experience, far too aggressive a unit , I had a few ....