Waverley47708

After a bit of thought I am going to send the Blue Grey power cars back and swap them for the GWR set which is the same price.  I had wanted the Blue Grey power cars primarily for the new motor for my Lima HSTs, the livery was a bonus.  Having looked on line the costs for a new motor, chassis, front bogie, lighting etc would come to around £50 (none of which are currently available). For around the same price again I had hoped to get two HST power cars that matched my rake of blue grey Hornby Mk3 coaches.  The poor application of the livery and then the realisation that the logo was too low was enough to get my looking again at the Lima body shells I already have.  They actually have lettering the new Hornby bodies don't have at the guards compartment.  The Lima blue and grey doesn't match the coaches as well as the Hornby power cars did and I think the grey at the rear of the power car is slightly too wide on the Lima bodies.  However with a bit of weathering and possibly even new Intercity 125 lettering they come up well.

Looking on line and at other photos on RMWEB it looks like the poor livery application was not restricted to my power cars.  As a resut there was little point in swapping them and hoping for a better pair.

As a result I've decided to go for the GWR set.  I'll just swap the bodies with two of my dozen Lima power cars and try to sell the GWR coach and power car bodies if anyone is interested.

I am disappointed with the livery application, something has gone wrong with them.  If a second batch or future release come out I may look again.  In the meantime I'll go with plan B.

On 27/12/2019 at 10:49, miles73128 said:

Additional pics

 

 

 

Now heard of three others who have the same livery issue as I do.  Looking at the photos uploaded by Miles I can see the same thick yellow line round the top of the yellow section as on my own.

Have been in touch with Hornby Customer Care and had an initial response asking for the R number but no explanation yet.

Top photo the left side is worse on both power cars with the slight dip.

Bottom Lima on left Hornby (Lima body) on right.

5 hours ago, Richard E said:

 

First mistake is running them on 12v. Dapol recommend no more than 9v these days and I run mine on 7.5v without any issues at all.

 

Mind you conversion to servo control sounds like a good plan especially as the new junction signals they have produced use servo control or so I am led to believe.

 

No my first mistake was buying them!

I can confirm they recommend 12v DC.  They say you can use a 9v DC battery, and pretty sure it still refers to 14v AC.

As I say I even bought a 12v DC smoothed regulated transformer specifically for them and still 2 have failed.

I bought three Dapol signals recently, two home and one distant.

The first one stopped working after less than 5 minutes!

As a result I put them away for a while.

I took the advice on RMWEB  and bought a 12v DC smoothed and regulated transformer.  I also bought a couple of Heathcote Electronics automatic controllers for them.

3 signals, a new transformer and the Heathcote units and we are well over £100.

Sadly within 5 minutes of getting the two remaining signals out and connecting them to the new power supply, the second one went pop aswell despite using the recommended power supply after.

Two down one to go.

This has to be the worst model railway product I have ever had the misfortune of buying.

I know what I'd vote for if the British Railway Modelling awards had a category for worst product of the year.

My advice if you are contemplating buying them is simple - don't.

Seems the best solution may be to convert them to servo control.  Based on the failure rate I've experienced Dapol must have a skip or two full of them from returns.  Maybe they could do us a favour and sell them at a knock down price so we can add servos and have a working signal that last more than 5 minutes.

Oh dear, just got one and the yellow paintwork as awful on power and dummy car.  Think I'll be returning it.  Hope it is a one of and not an issue for the whole batch.  Very disappointed.

The yellow on the nose is a different shade to the side, there is a thin line of thick yellow along the top edge along the side and the interface between the blue and yellow on the front is neither straight nor clear

Quite a line up.  Well done Hornby.

It looks like war has been declared with the release of more 66s.  I wondered when the list would end as I scrolled down.

The 91 will frustrate some, my first thought was it was a bit cynical they've been flogging the "toy"91 for years then Cavelex announce one and Hornby announce an updated one of their own.  Is that what it takes to get Hornby to update some older models they were happy to produce for years.  Can't help but think of what Simon said to Rails or Hattons on the James May documentary re the Terrier or the 66s, it's just business or words to that effect.   However maybe I'm being too cynical as the same arguement couldn't be made for the APT  not aware of anyone else developing one at the moment.

The retooled 47 may mean I can remotor some old detailed Lima 47s I have if the bodies fit.

15 hours ago, Waverley West said:

 

I've seen footage on one of my DVDs of a Coal Sector-liveried 56 crossing the Forth Bridge with an MGR service. Can't remember which DVD unfortunately, but I distinctly remember it as it gave me licence to run a Coal Sector 56 on WW. Don't know just how rare they were, but they certainly weren't common.

I am sure I have the DVD, whether it is the Railfreight Today one or a general Rails Around Scotland I cant recall at the moment.

Up to the late 80s all I remember seeing was pairs of 20s on the MGRs through Dunfermline going to and from Longannet. I do remember seeing sub sector 37s (single Class 37 on an MGR) possibly around 1990.  I am not sure if I saw 56s myself or have only seen video or photos.  I think I did see them but this was after the 37s had a go.  I had always considered 56s as an English loco and found it unusual to see them on the line to Longannet.  If my memory serves me correctly and if the video info is correct,  it was something to do with coal coming up from England.

14 hours ago, Western Aviator said:

These pictures were taken on my first visit to Scotland after acquiring a camera in 1987. Although not a DMU fan at all, I somehow had the presence of mind to snap these two examples. Perhaps it was because I'd never seen these types before. With the second picture I excelled myself and even made a note of the vehicle numbers. 

 

Class 104 DMU Set 457 Edinburgh 26/5/87

 

Class 120 DMU 53654+59264+53700 Edinburgh 26/5/87

 

This is the only picture I have ever had published (rarity value perhaps, rather than image quality). It appeared in a spotters book published by (I think) Platform 5; there was a loco book, a DMU/EMU book and a coach book listing all the vehicles in existence for underlining purposes. It earned me £7. As you can imagine, my life was never the same again...

Remember both classes if DMU at Waverley in the mid 80s.  For the last decade I have been hoping Hornby or Bachmann would do them, especially a 3 car blue 104.  Maybe this decade they will be announced and maybe they'll arrive somtime next decade.

The all blue was like the Strathclyde livery 107s and 101s a wee change from the more common blue grey on 101s which made up the bulk of the DMU services at that time.

14 minutes ago, bourneagain said:

It would have been useful to have the exhibition name - Perth Model Railway Exhibition, included in the topic title.

Couldn't agree more!.

Sorted.

We are delighted to have been shortlisted for fourth time in a row for the British Railway Modelling Awards.  If you enjoyed our 2019 exhibition we hope you will join is again for our 2020 exhibition and vote for our 2019 exhibition.

50 minutes ago, young37215 said:

 

 

Whilst I share tour view on the holding road, I thought the Dundee's had gone over to Sprinter by 1988? I think 37356 was waiting to take out the Royal Scotsman because there is a picture of it hauling said train in Scottish Class 37's Vol 2 on page 53. Oh for someone to produce the Scotsman coaches, I would love to be able to run it on my layout.

 

You may well be right, it was the arrival of Sprinters that hastened my departure.  I lost interest in going to Waverley once 158s had replaced the 477s.

10 hours ago, Smallwonder said:

Waverley 1988 again, but including something highly unexpected.  

 

 

An unexpected visitor, 37356 Grainflow on 20 August 88 at noon before heading LE west....

10 hours ago, Smallwonder said:

 

 

Happy New Year when it comes.

 

Happy New Year and thanks for  posting your photos they are really appreciated.

I spent many happy Saturdays at Waverley in the mid 80s, 85 to 87 or even 88.  Never saw anything as exotic as a green Peak though.

The Red Stripe 37 is sitting in the loco holding siding between Plt 16 and 17.  When I was there that was used by locos about to take the next Dundee service North from Waverley.  

Glad to see this topic has been resurrected again.

On 27/12/2019 at 16:03, mdvle said:

 

All companies do this, basing age around the first company that started the lineage.

 

But, having just checked Wikipedia, I would also point out despite some of the comments this is not the centenary of Hornby the company, but rather the centenary of the introduction of Hornby Trains brand which is a different thing.

 

The first Hornby train was released by Meccano in 1920, but Meccano itself dates back to 1901.

 

But as you posted, the Hornby "brand" continued for 100 years even though the company underneath changed multiple times.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hornby_Railways

 

If anyone coming to Model Rail in Glasgow this February fancies a quiet pint in a local pub, probably best not to start a discussion about when Rangers were formed!

Back to trains.

Mk2b or c that is the question.

Surely that's not too much to ask.

Seems the answers to all my questions can be found on this Boxing Day special video!  From around 5 min 20 sec mark.

How do these Railroad 125s get on with a full rake of 8 mk3s and a dummy power car?  Hornby and Lima mk3s as the latter appear to be a bit heavier and my Lima 125s struggle at times to pull a full rake at times.

Thanks

Quick update, the original Lima chassis does have the wee plastic lugs along the side, despite what I assumed in an earlier post. As such and going by the internal photos of the Railroad 125 I am pretty sure the Lima body will fit directly onto a Hornby Railroad chassis.

Good news as a result of a bit of trawling the internet I have tracked down the part numbers.  Chassis X9968, Motor bogie X9870, and front bogie X9881.

Bad news i haven't found anyone who has them in stock.

5 hours ago, miles73128 said:

Hi Mike

I think the reviewer got himself (somewhat) confused between the three models! So, I re-checked. Look at the following pics. To be sure, I put a blob of orange paint of the screw tower and re-assembled, you can clearly see that it mates and holds firmly in place. The glazing has no structural role within the Hornby assembly. I think it's role within the Lima unit is to hold the weight in place, not required with Hornby as the weight is glued down. 

Thanks Miles for the photos, much appreciated.

The You Tube video was good and has inspired me to go for a Blue Grey set, this was not my plan initially when it was announced last year especially with the black cab roof in the publicity photos.  From the outset I did think it would be a chance to get a better motor though for at least one of my Lima sets.  I have a 6 x Lima Blue Grey power cars already (3 powered three dummies) and I think the same number of Intercity livery power cars.  I really liked Intercity Swallow but it is (just) out with my time period.

I use to love being at Waverly standing next to a departing HST.  The sight and sound of the front power car opening up next to you, the screaming Valenta, then as it picked up speed you would start to hear the rear power car as it approached you – happy happy days.

I always preferred the shape of the Lima over the old Hornby.  There was something about the shape of the nose in particular which I think was better.  The Lima HSTs run on my layout with a full rake of 8 x Hornby Mk3s.  The blue and the light grey are a little different but is barely noticeable but it is not as crisp as the Railroad livery application.  It is the motor that lets them down a bit.  The wheels have to be kept spotless for it to run with a full rake at a convincing speed. 

Having seen the video and the photos I think I will go for a Railroad Blue Grey set, on the assumption the motor and wheels are an improvement and the fact the livery shades between the Hornby Mk3s and the power cars will be a closer match.

The Intercity ones are a bit more problematic, Hornby are not doing an Railroad InterCity livery at this time and secondly the shade Hornby used previously  is noticeably different to my rake of (flushglazed) Lima Mks3s in Intercity livery.

I did try a replacement CD motor before but it did not end well.  It was a 3v version and it is maybe not a surprise.  I will try one of the 12v versions from Strathpeffer Jn for the Intercity liveried power cars and see how I get on.  Once I get my hands on a Railroad Blue Grey one, one of the first things I’ll do is see if the old Lima bodies fit on it.   The body and connections looks the same but the chassis is definitely not.   If I do decide to marry a Lima Intercity body with the Railroad motor it looks like I’d need a  chassis, motor bogie and a front bogie as I suspect the old Lima front bogie with the pin will not fit.  Any chance of a photo of the front bogie with the speaker moved out the way??

In the meantime would still appreciate it if someone can let me know if their old Lima body fits directly onto the new Hornby Railroad chassis.

8 hours ago, GWR-fan said:

Keep in mind that the reviewer is comparing an old 1970's Hornby tooled model to a Limby (ex-Lima) model as presented as the latest Hornby Rairoad model.  The two models are totally different so any chassis comparison is irrelevant.

Thanks, it is all a bit confusing, original Hornby, full fat Hornby, Ex Lima Hornby and Lima!  I've only looked at bits of the video so far.   I had realised at times he was comparing his new Limby to an old Hornby whilst he was also comparing it to the full fat Hornby as well.

I was comparing his Limby with my Lima at home and am pretty sure its chassis does not have the same lugs along the side.  That said the brief view I got if the inside looked to have the same tubes into which the chassis screw attach on my many Lima HSTs.

I've only seen them run as 4 x TSO with a 47/7 and DBSO all in ScotRail.  This was for a particular diagram Mon to Fri, or 3 x TSO with a blue grey Brake Second and a non 47/7 in charge.  These were on Edinburgh Dundee services.

I have only seen both described formations on video circa 1986.

There is one such formation near the start of this video.

And am pretty sure there is one in this video too.

There has been progress and some ballasting is not far away.  I rebuilt the frames of the main scenic boards after noting a slight rise and fall over the cross beams.  Now I know where the points, colour lights etc go I rebuilt it with full length supports.  This has improved the view at track level.

I have installed modified Eckon signals, (IMHO) they are the most realistic and fitted them to the brilliant Heathcote Electronics.  They are inter locked to points etc.

Any, some photos a trackside crew installing point motors with a 37 ballast train in the engineers siding.

A class 20 waits to be called upon at one end of the 40ft layout.

11 hours ago, MrTea said:

Garry (Cheekytek on YouTube) has posted a review which includes installing a decoder:

The installation starts at 7m 2s. 

Thanks, that is interesting.  Will have a look at my Lima chassis as I don't think it has all the lugs on this one.  The body may not have the recesses for them.

Farewell To Thy Greatness.

That was the age of the train. 

4 hours ago, GWR-fan said:

 

Given that as yet there is no service sheet for the 2008 Railroad release R2707 then I would not be holding my breath awaiting a sheet for the latest Railroad HST.  The Limby HST was basically a remotored Lima class 43 with the powered chassis modified to accept a five pole bogie drive.  Apart from wheels it appears that the unpowered version is unchanged from the old Lima unit.

Does seem a little odd, but as you say there does not appear to be any service sheet available for the previous Railroad 125.  They do exist for other Railroad locos.

If anyone gets a Railroad 125 , can you post the a photo of he service sheet if there is one.

Thanks.

26 minutes ago, miles73128 said:

Far easier to buy this new HST pack or R2707 (Virgin) and swap the bodies over? 

Thanks, had not realised these ones were potential donors.

Unfortunately a quick look on the web and (annoyingly) even places with them listed with a price are "Out of Stock".

Will keep my eye out.

Are you able to confirm the old Lima body will fit onto these Railroad chassis.

Even using that R number still can't find a Hornby service sheet.

Of course all this assumes the railroad motor is better than a serviced, wheels kept clean Lima motor in the first place!

Just to add to the confusion there is an old Hornby version of the Virgin HST aswell.