Bob Reid

They would appear to have continued in service Brian - they certainly kept issuing amendments to the specific drawings for them, and it would have been easy enough to bring them up to spec - being that close to the final design (not that there really was a final design anyway)!

The B4s used were I believe the B4 MkII version (Mk II Bogie version not MkII coach)! - Parkin shows these in the photo marked "a pre-production B4 bogie....." these had a totally different brake arrangement of bogie brakegear however the most obvious feature was the lack of the bonded rubber/steel friction damper assembly you see either side of the primary springs attached to the axlebox castings and bogie frame on all bar the hydraulic damper fitted B4s. They were otherwise outwardly similar to the production B4s. As far as the Parkin "early trial" photo is concerned we've yet to determine what vehicle that bogie was fitted to as any photo's or concrete info is yet to surface (though a pair according to Parkin completed 140,000 miles)!

They were all made of 3M pressure sensitive adhesive film (as were the numbers & letters etc in various thicknesses)..... Designed that the longer they were on the harder they were to get off (guaranteed to rip when torn off by errant spotters)

Good montage there Jim. It wasn't Scottish Region policy - quite the opposite. All the work of one Haymarket Supervisor needless to say!

More fitting at this time - The Ugly Sisters

Mind post your progress on here! Merry Christmas

Watching this layout develop has been the highlight of my modelling year (yes I know it's predominantly coaching stock - quite sad really some would say) however it spurred me on to at least make a start on something for myself. That and the rolling stock conversion threads have been of great interest and I'm keen to see how you develop it in 2011. Best wishes for the season to all of the Clayhills Kirkhill Team

Couldn't resist and paid for it. It certainly isn't as straight as I thought on looking at it last night fresh out the box! Nice gap at the back of the firebox..... and alongside it's neighbour I'll certainly be interested to see what mods get done to correct this. It would appear the back ends getting pulled down somehow.

No probs but it'll be tomorrow at some point now - still too many pressies to wrap!

300 or 3000 (which it is) it doesn't matter - as long as it's limited quantity in issue to that spec (which of course could include the box as well). The NRM Deltic is perhaps a case in point of changing quantities!

It was 1000 but because of expressions of interest? it was increased to 3000 (and is stated on the LE Certificate) mines is 2113.....

The only way for that footplate edge to be any thinner john is if it was made of etched n/s or the like - 3/8" plate scaled and rounded up to 0.13mm and it's finger cutting thin. I don't actually think they've done too bad - is it the depth of the angle supporting the footplate that you think's wrong or the shape of the curve? To be honest if you are going to modify it anyway, that little step shouldn't be any bother to add. I seem to have struck lucky this time, the cab isn't drooped and everything remains firmly on. Certainly the marginally shinier finish gives it a far better appearance!

Can't say for certain Alan without digging deeper however it was minus the railtour special paint accoutrements in July of that year, still with it's nameplates and without the cab side builders plates - Barking Bill has some lovely shots of it here. The 61B plate remained on it even when it returned to Ferryhill. I guess it all depends on what photographs they based the model on.

Guess it depends on in what year your model of 60532 represents however the Bachmann version is correct for it's last couple of years at Ferryhill then (more specific to the model) Dundee, by which time it had lost both of it's cab side works plates - see this pic as just one example so they did well in that respect. Pity though they left off the OHL flashees it wore at the but of course it's easier to fit them than to remove them for an earlier version.

To Pennine MC for myth busting

Arty farty maybe Mike, but I'm not sure they qualify for a "how realistic are your models" thread - I can't see your models

Everyone, his neighbour and his dog are expecting it next week now - me, forget the box just the loco would be fine (grand tool box all the same) from Kernow....... and I don't care how long it's taken.

I'll give you a part answer just now Brian - bed beckons! The fabricated shell vents had similar central ventilator tube which formed part of the base to which 5? mild steel leaves were rivetted at the ends to. One on the top as a cover, and two down each side, each with a 1/8" gap between each other at the side - the difference basically was that the whole body formed the dome, and the air rushing past the 1/8" gaps created a depression inside and drew the air out of the vehicle! - These are based on the Classic Ash's patent Ventilator which I believe the GWR made good use of. Must finish that drawing and it'll maybe be more self explanatory to see all three. More on the GM /Roevac Vents later...... Maybe you should re-title the post "The Search for a Better BR Ventilator"

(for Mark 1s at least) Craig, I've a fair collection of the BR Standard series Drawings on Aperture Cards (though sadly no way of printing them cheaply) - hence the use of Autocad and Inventor, from when I worked for the CM&EE. As far as the Vee Hangers, I've can knock up whatever your after (PM or email me if you need to) having done a fair bit on the drawings for etched replacement parts for them already. The CSSC Minutes in the Parkin supplement are without a doubt good however they are a very shorthand version of each minute - the originals (Keith used the copies held in the NRM) are much longer (as were all the meetings we went to)! and contain the full minute and more importantly the referencing of previous minutes to place them all in context with each other. Fortunately I've copies of the post 56 minutes on Microfilm. Apologies Brian for butting in on your thread!

Hi Brian - Torpedo is just the generic name for that design of roof ventilator where the action of the air passing around the two cones of the ventilator creates a depression in air pressure inside the hollow body drawing stale air out of the coach via a tube connected to the coach interior. All were variations on this design by William Laycock from 1901 (though he doesn't claim to have invented the name); The only difference with the BR (ex-LNWR/LMS) versions, is that the hollow cones have been replaced with hollow spheres. The operation however is exactly the same - this is the original version in cross section; The change dates come from a combination of the CSSC minutes and the three production drawings. There are more specific dates for the changes being authorised however these can only ever be approximate as the works were alway instructed to change the types from one to the other with the qualifier "on exhaustion of existing stocks". Eventually I will get round to trying to check each lots fitment! As far as the GWR design Larry. The two cast versions were the design responsibility of Eastleigh (though clearly they received input from the LM) however the shell ventilator was to a design by Swindon, so I've no doubt it was a hangover from the GWR days a few years earlier! p.s. Brian I just noticed I titled those links to the MJT/Dart ventilators in the wrong order, placing the ridged dome after the scalloped dome - since corrected.....

Okay Larry, here's the Gen on Mark 1 RoofVentilators Three basic types of carriage roof ventilator (for compartments and saloons) ;were commonly used on BR StandardMark 1 stock. - Cast Iron Torpedo Ventilator. - Fabricated Mild Steel Shell Ventilator. - Cast Iron or Aluminium Torpedo Ventilator (with Modified Hood) From the first vehicles built in 1951 to around mid 1952, new vehicles were fitted with Cast Iron “torpedo†style roof ventilators (These are the ones Brian refers to as ridge dome), they were also identical to those used previously by the LMS on some stock. From mid 1952 to 1959, shell ventilators, fabricated using off-cuts from the body panels, were fitted to all new build vehicles. There were however issues with corrosion of this type. Progressively from mid 1958 onwards on all new build vehicles, the original cast iron “torpedo†style roof ventilator was re-introduced. From around 1960, the “torpedo†ventilators were redesigned with a larger hood, to overcome problems of ash and dirt entering the vehicles, and these became the final standard roof ventilator for new build vehicles . At some point these were, following the LM Regions workshops lead, changed from being produced in cast-iron to cast aluminium alloy, though the shape remained the same. Generally vehicles would have the same type of ventilator fitted throughout however subsequent workshop overhauls and outstation repairs occasionally caused different types to be mixed on the same roof, although this wasn’t a common occurence. Other notable oddities were the fitment to at least two vehicles with “torpedo†style roof ventilators that had more in common with the pre-Nationalisation designs, having large side cones as opposed to the ballshaped chambers used commonly by BR and at times the LMS before it. Although I've yet to complete the drawing for the shell ventilator, these are the two types of torpedo ventilator used; This final style was as Brian said used on the Mark 2s also - up and until the end of Mark 2c production. [i should have added that Dart Castings (amongst others) supply both types of Torpedo Vent; The original; (Ridged Dome) and the re-designed version; (Scalloped Dome)

Bahram - My old boy was given the job of putting the thistles on to the buffers at the Caley - they were actually ground on and not etched - hence they were quite resistant to removal even during its celebrity period in traffic. We often saw it at Copland Road and he couldn't help reminding me each time that was his claim to fame however at some point after its move to the Kelvin Hall they'd allowed the buffers (which were once heavilly lacquered) to get rusty and I suspect they were removed in the cleaning up - and of course were sadly never redone!

Scrub that Dave, I thought it was a real NBL loco not a billy bunter - though the same works probably applies!

Inverurie and St.Rollox - mostly St.Rollox as far as I know Dave......