Improving the look of 1980s RTR coaches

Macforrest · February 9, 2022

HI all! I’ve recently had the opportunity to clear out some ‘stuff’ and take stock of my model railway purchases from the 90’s. I came across a good number of Mk2 & 3 coaches from the BR sectorisation era, including Lima Network SouthEast Mk2bs and InterCity Mk2fs, Dapol Mk2ds and Hornby Mk2as. I had started ‘improving’ these around 20 years ago but clearly lost momentum.

With a layout build not likely for a good number of years and no access currently to many of the things I would normally be doing, I’ve decided to pick this up again.

There are a lot of examples of some really impressive detailing and modifying projects, but my goal is to create an improved model with a more prototypical appearance without getting too carried away, so no major repaints or rebuilds; to see what can be done with some basic extras without needing to put in many long hours of high skill level modelling, so this might be of interest to a few who are looking to make some simple modifications to their own ‘legacy’ coaches rather than fork out upwards of £60 each on the latest models.

I know there are a lot of folk who also really go to town on weathering to recreate the abuse that some rail vehicles are subjected to, but I’m also going to keep my models ‘pristine-ish’. During my time at school model railway club there was no better feeling than producing your latest purchase to run on the club layout, with its shiny out-of-the-box finish. To me this is still part of the joy of model railways.

It's my aim to build up 4 rakes; 2 will be a mix of Mk2a, b & c to represent Network SouthEast Waterloo to Exeter stock and 2 cross-country (North East -South West) air-conditioned rakes, one as a later Intercity ‘Swallow’ formation and the other a mix of blue/grey and Intercity ‘executive’ liveries as an early sectorisation era rake. There are also a few Lima Mk3s to work on, together with a pair of Lima HST power cars, this will make up a third XC train.

Edited April 18, 2022 by Macforrest

jwpalfrey · February 10, 2022

Keep us updated, I too have a lot of mainly Lima mk1's and mk2's from the 90's in IC swallow and NSE liveries (Two of my favourite from sectorisation era). I too prefer the out of the box finish as opposed to weathering. Weathering looks great if you have a layout equally well detailed/modelled/realistic, I'm affraid I'm not that good/patient modeller.

I did aquire a Hogwarts express set off ebay needing some work and only the coaches and loco, but I was impressed on one hand with the new detail on Hornby mk1's, but on the other hand astounded by how much was common with my Triang mk1's from the 60's. Other than flush glazing, improvement to roof moulding and painted details they are the same. Does that justify 2-3 times the price? Anyway old stock is still good by my books. I'm interested to see what you do.

BernardTPM · February 10, 2022

1 hour ago, jwpalfrey said:

I did aquire a Hogwarts express set off ebay needing some work and only the coaches and loco, but I was impressed on one hand with the new detail on Hornby mk1's, but on the other hand astounded by how much was common with my Triang mk1's from the 60's. Other than flush glazing, improvement to roof moulding and painted details they are the same. Does that justify 2-3 times the price?

Those would be the later 1980s upgrades of the Tri-ang design, not the current new range of Mk.1s. It does though show how good the basic design was 60 years ago.

Macforrest · February 12, 2022

On 10/02/2022 at 10:34, BernardTPM said:

Those would be the later 1980s upgrades of the Tri-ang design, not the current new range of Mk.1s. It does though show how good the basic design was 60 years ago.

Indeed! You have probably noticed at the front of the 'collection' two Triang/Hornby Mk2a's.... bought second hand for £4 each they're no different to the NSE liveried one at the top of the stack, bought new in about 1998. it's well worth taking the time to do a bit of work on these!

cravensdmufan · February 12, 2022

The one thing I did to all my Lima and Hornby Mk2s which I felt improved their appearance no end was to paint the insides of the window frames matt dark grey, thus disguising the thickness of the mouldings.

Then change the wheels to metal ones on the Hornby ones and a quick application of weathering powders on the bogies and underframes.

If you want to spend a bit more time paint the seats and tables with matt colours to get rid of the light coloured plastic. Here's pictures albeit of a Bachmann one, but see what a difference it makes.

You will have good looking carriages for very little expenditure.

Edited April 1, 2022 by cravensdmufan
Re-uploaded photos

dj_crisp · February 12, 2022

6 hours ago, cravensdmufan said:

The one thing I did to all my Lima and Hornby Mk2s which I felt improved their appearance no end was to paint the insides of the window frames matt dark grey, thus disguising the thickness of the mouldings.

Then change the wheels to metal ones on the Hornby ones and a quick application of weathering powders on the bogies and underframes.

If you want to spend a bit more time paint the seats and tables with matt colours to get rid of the light coloured plastic. Here's pictures albeit of a Bachmann one, but see what a difference it makes.

You will have good looking carriages for very little expenditure.

Really effective and thanks for sharing

Will

MJI · February 13, 2022

Worth checking Shawplan laserglaze as well

ess1uk · February 13, 2022

Looking forward to seeing what you do

Macforrest · February 16, 2022

On 13/02/2022 at 16:36, MJI said:

Worth checking Shawplan laserglaze as well

Not surprisingly, Laserglaze has featured heavily in this project. Really is a top quality product....

Macforrest · February 16, 2022

Update to follow very soon....!

Macforrest · February 16, 2022

A ‘starter for 10’; Lima Mk3 SO (HST trailer). Really just something easy to get me into the swing of it! The first task is to remove the one-piece roof and windows so the glazing section can be replaced with something better. The clear plastic is the closest Lima came to flush glazing and as such the material fits into the window recesses by around a millimetre, so a tricky procedure utilising a thin lever and builders frame wedges to gently prise the one-piece section away from the body. I think this process has been described on this site, so I won't repeat it...!

Macforrest · February 16, 2022

Once out, I cut away the plastic along the line of the window tops using a mini-drill cutting disc. This left enough plastic to positively re-locate the roof section.

The next thing to come off were the buffers, as Lima model the loco-hauled Mk3 variants. After removal with a razor saw, a light abrasion with 320 then 400 grit mini sanding sticks followed by a coat of satin black paint is all that’s needed here.

The shortcomings of Lima bogies is well discussed, but the cost of the common solution to replace them with spares from other manufacturers and work entailed with modifying the underframe to fit these is more than I wanted to commit to with around 15 coaches to do. Anyway, I think the BT10 bogies look quite good! Instead I used Gibson replacement wheels and to these I fitted the rather lovely Stenson 9mm brake disc inserts.

The final modification to the underframe was to attach two M6x25mm washers for a bit of extra weight (7g!). These fit rather handily around the moulding which locates the push-fit bogie pivot and were fixed in place with epoxy.

Edited April 18, 2022 by Macforrest

Macforrest · February 16, 2022

Attention turned to the interior, the second class seating being painted with an orangey red, tables in satin white. The 2+1 arrangement is not prototypical for the SO coach but making do with what I have I will just have to ensure the 2-seat side always faces the viewing side! Vestibules were painted, first matt white then gloss yellow and this can still be seen with the roof fitted, so worth doing.

Coach ends are a clip fit, so I removed these and gave them a spray with gloss black. Once dry, Fox C3 restriction and data panels were applied, being sealed with a coat of satin varnish. I used these as they are the correct type for HST trailers (TF, TS, TRUB etc) whereas Railtec’s versions are FO, SO etc. These decals are about 20 years old and the film appears to have yellowed a bit. It would have been interesting to see if applying them on top of a coat of gloss varnish instead of paint would have made a difference.

Final job was to fit Shawplan Lazer-glaze, which really makes a huge difference to the look of these early models. I applied Humbrol Clearfix on the inner edges of the window frames to bond the windows in place. Again you have the option to go the full distance and fit etched window frames, but the scalpel work required to remove the moulded frames, the preparation and painting and to really highlight the difference, painting of the inner part of the frame silver as per the prototype would add hours to this job. Fine if you have them to spare, not to mention the patience!

Edited April 18, 2022 by Macforrest

Macforrest · February 16, 2022

The finishing touch is the ‘No Smoking’ window stickers, again by Fox. The end result is a reasonable representation of a HST trailer for minimal effort!

Next up will be something a bit more 'meaty', Lima’s air conditioned Mk2.

Edited May 10, 2022 by Macforrest

MJI · February 16, 2022

That looks a lot better

Macforrest · February 18, 2022

The Lima Mk2f is strangely(?) numbered as a Mk2e which means a number change for starters. The detailing is also limited, and whilst the gangway doors are nicely represented, equipment below the solebar is scarce and lacks ‘depth’. The buffer beam is too shallow and the buffers look a bit scrawny. All of this can be easily remedied. It's a fairly basic model but at the time not bad for a tenner! For the cost of today's models you could almost buy a whole rake!!

Edited May 11, 2022 by Macforrest

MJI · February 18, 2022

I have a couple of these I will run with some Joueff Mark 3s

I may try to avoid frames unlike my Airfix ones (usually have to change due to damage).

But looking forwards to this.

Macforrest · February 19, 2022

First job was to cut away the moulded handrails and the lump representing the lamp brackets. The gangway connector can be removed to avoid damage, two clips at the back of this makes taking these off a doddle. Brass fittings were added; 0.45mm wire for handrails and Shawplan etched lamp brackets; it would be nice to not have to bend each bracket individually but handrails are easy enough with a small pair of round-nose pliers.

The roof was removed by carefully twisting the coach ends in opposite directions until you hear a ‘snap’. Roof and glazing then just pull out, but with the locating clips now broken the seating will need to be fixed in place with adhesive to stop it coming loose and moving around once the vehicle is re-assembled.

Glazing was cut away, leaving a slight overlap again to locate the roof on the model and Lazerglaze fitted with a film of Clearglaze applied to the frames to hold them in place . The backs of the toilet windows were painted white, but I don’t feel this gives an accurate portrayal of the frosted finish so if anyone has any suggestions?

‘

No smoking window decals were applied as the finishing touch; Railtech produce reverse printed waterslide decals of these, and they look really good, as they are applied to the inside of the window just as they would be on the full size version! The added bonus of this is they cannot be accidentally 'flaked off' by a wayward hand or lineside scenery. They have not yet produced the later Intercity style square ones (1st class and no smoking emblem on white background) so hopefully there’ll be enough demand in the future to justify production. However, this coach models an example of the earlier Intercity stock, so the round ones are well suited.

Edited May 11, 2022 by Macforrest

Macforrest · February 19, 2022

Coach ends were then sprayed gloss black; a look at a photo of the metalwork on the real thing showed quite a glossy and dented finish, so I tried to recreate this. The handrails were picked out in satin white and a selection of Railtec decals applied. The moulded jumper cable does not leave much room for this, and the underside of the tank filler moulding could do with a little paring away, but the most noticeable legends can be incorporated. Rainbow Railways supplied me with some ‘AC2F’ decals to finish this off.

The existing buffer beam was cut off to its full height but ensuring a protrusion was left where the end body clips are located.

A new one was fabricated from 60 thou plasticard using a paper template scaled down from a drawing I found online. Even then, the dimensions did not quite match the model and some gentle filing was necessary to get a good fit. Buffer centres were drilled out and MJT cast retracted buffers fitted as well as their dummy buckeye coupling in raised position. These really add some bulk to the look of the coach end. With at least 8 more lima Mk2s to work on, I’m going to have to look at a better way of producing identical parts such as buffer beams.

Steps were also added; these are from Stenson Models and are for HEA wagons, but with some slight modification fit easily to the underside of the coach. I made them a bit shorter than the prototype to clear the tension lock couplings, but I think the effect is still good.