RMweb Premium newbryford Posted July 30, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 30, 2018 Basic DPDT (double pole double throw) wiring. Cheers, Mick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgman Posted July 30, 2018 Share Posted July 30, 2018 Tim, My attachment in a txt message failed so I've uploaded it here, hope it helps ? G p.s. done on my iPhone very quickly so please excuse the dodgy camera work ! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Captain Kernow Posted July 31, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted July 31, 2018 Thanks chaps, I think I've got it now! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted July 31, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2018 Thanks chaps, I think I've got it now! One can do one's own DPDT switch but it is an AR$£ so one can purchase a very nice one with a coulourful light on it from Brimal Componants. It is a little more expensive of course but one could sell one's shorts to fund it and you don't have to play solderers and burn ones digits as well as swearing a lot. https://www.brimal.co.uk/points-motor-switch-with-indicators.html His Duckness of 36E 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted July 31, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2018 By the way, if you discover how to 'centre' the pokey wire thing that drives the point then do let me know. Philth Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted July 31, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2018 (edited) By the way, if you discover how to 'centre' the pokey wire thing that drives the point then do let me know. Philth There is a way of auto centring Digital IPs with a special address command , but the way I do them and Analog motors is a bit simpler. Make it move and then remove power half way across...…….. Edited July 31, 2018 by newbryford Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgman Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 There is a way of auto centring Digital IPs with a special address command , but the way I do them and Analog motors is a bit simpler. Make it move and then remove power half way across...…….. Agree with the above, an easy off the board method that I've used once the DPDT switch and wires are completed is to put the two power leads across a 9v battery and centre the throw wire. Once centred install under the boards. G 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted July 31, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2018 There is a way of auto centring Digital IPs with a special address command , but the way I do them and Analog motors is a bit simpler. Make it move and then remove power half way across...…….. I knew that ................ and I was just waiting to see who would come up with the method......................................and I am a little liar. Thanks. Think I've done that in the past P 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted July 31, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2018 There is a way of auto centring Digital IPs with a special address command , but the way I do them and Analog motors is a bit simpler. Make it move and then remove power half way across...…….. Analogue iPs come pre-centred. The best thing is to fit them before applying any power, otherwise it's trial and error blipping the power on and off as above. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted July 31, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2018 Want a laugh? Went up the Junction as I actually felt ok this morning and it isn't melting heat up there. I'll see how the Mullard runs I thinks to meself. Off it goes but when it gets to that Xover it stutters a little. Couple more circuits and yes, it stutters. So I reconnect the DCC 80; perfect running. Another WTF moment!!! Both main lines and Station loops operating well. However, in anticipation of some more testing I connected my one Cobalt (all switched up etc.) used a 14V Regulated supply and.......................it works. Then I sorted an old fashioned connector for one set of Solenoids fior the FY (connector from trusty H & M Controller 16V AC to H & M Flash Gordon switch machine). That works. Finally I connected my PSU2 and DCC Concepts ADsfx 8 (solenoid decoder) to the newer set of FY solenoids. They worked. Decided it was time to stop whilst things were going well. P 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted July 31, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2018 (edited) Analogue iPs come pre-centred. The best thing is to fit them before applying any power, otherwise it's trial and error blipping the power on and off as above. Digital IP and Omega are also centred when delivered Note - Although delivered in a central position, Digital IPs no longer have auto self centre enabled (even though the manual says it is enabled) because of the rise of DCC systems that can only operate up to accessory address 99 and the Digital IP uses addresses 197-199 for auto centre on/off and reverse functions. Cobalts (like Tortoises) don't actually have to be fitted dead centre as the spring wire takes up the slack in the gears. In a "centre" position, both types of motor have a reasonable amount of slack/backlash in the gear train to move them a 2-3 millimetres anyway. And if they are fitted well off centre, then the spring wire can be tweaked to suit the offset Cheers, Mick Edited July 31, 2018 by newbryford Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted July 31, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2018 Digital IP and Omega are also centred when delivered Note - Although delivered in a central position, Digital IPs no longer have auto self centre enabled (even though the manual says it is enabled) because of the rise of DCC systems that can only operate up to accessory address 99 and the Digital IP uses addresses 197-199 for auto centre on/off and reverse functions. Cobalts (like Tortoises) don't actually have to be fitted dead centre as the spring wire takes up the slack in the gears. In a "centre" position, both types of motor have a reasonable amount of slack/backlash in the gear train to move them a 2-3 millimetres anyway. And if they are fitted well off centre, then the spring wire can be tweaked to suit the offset Cheers, Mick Thanks Mick. The Omega I've fitted does just that. I didn't centre the point and I didn't centre the motor. I placed the point in one position and because the motor is so easy to install using the sticky pad, I adjusted its' position (without touching the underboard surface) as if it had just driven the point to it's position and then stuck the point/pad 'up' and added the screws as advised (just enough to hold the motor secure, not rammed tight). Works really well thanks. I might do some more when I have done a few more switches. When I get my 'new' Cobalts I think I might stick with Omegas as I might eventually go DCC control as well (with Power Pro/5A. P 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Captain Kernow Posted July 31, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted July 31, 2018 Well, I have achieved success this afternoon. Having completed most of the track laying on the scenic section, I turned my attention to the Cobalt motor and the DPDT switch. I wired it up according to advice from Mick and Grahame and bingo! It works! But what's all this 'centering' malarky? Not heard about this before. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgman Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 (edited) Well, I have achieved success this afternoon. Having completed most of the track laying on the scenic section, I turned my attention to the Cobalt motor and the DPDT switch. I wired it up according to advice from Mick and Grahame and bingo! It works! But what's all this 'centering' malarky? Not heard about this before. Its merely the method of installing the motor from new. I believe it comes with the moving crank ( for want of a better word ) in the centre. When attaching the slidey piece in the grooves with the wire it will be central, and when fitted from below with the switch blades in the centre it doesn't exert any undue pressure on them, therefore, in theory the unit should be easier to install. Well thats what I think ! Over to the hexperts Mal Harkie Edited July 31, 2018 by bgman Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jukebox Posted August 5, 2018 Share Posted August 5, 2018 By the way, if you discover how to 'centre' the pokey wire thing that drives the point then do let me know. Philth Hook the +/- power leads to the cobalt, then use a 9v battery, touching them to the terminals. Release when you get mid way. Cheers Scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted August 5, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 5, 2018 (edited) Hook the +/- power leads to the cobalt, then use a 9v battery, touching them to the terminals. Release when you get mid way. Cheers Scott Oh thanks matey. I had forgotten that trick. So simple isn't it? P Edited August 5, 2018 by Mallard60022 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Captain Kernow Posted August 5, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 5, 2018 I'm nearly ready to start wiring the Cobalts up now and connecting them to the control panel, so I'll be doing a bit of centering before I do so. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 6, 2018 Centering: relax and stand like a tree (arms and hands down by your side but slightly away from your sides). Take a slow, deep breath through the nose and exhale slowly through the mouth. Repeat that several times. Continue to stand like a tree for a few minutes and concentrate on your wiring diagram in your mind. When calm and centered then you may begin. Chi Gung 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgman Posted August 6, 2018 Share Posted August 6, 2018 Centering: relax and stand like a tree (arms and hands down by your side but slightly away from your sides). Take a slow, deep breath through the nose and exhale slowly through the mouth. Repeat that several times. Continue to stand like a tree for a few minutes and concentrate on your wiring diagram in your mind. When calm and centered then you may begin. Chi Gung Get on with it ! I.M.Patient Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 6, 2018 Centering: relax and stand like a tree (arms and hands down by your side but slightly away from your sides). Take a slow, deep breath through the nose and exhale slowly through the mouth. Repeat that several times. Continue to stand like a tree for a few minutes and concentrate on your wiring diagram in your mind. When calm and centered then you may begin. Chi Gung I think you've got to the root of the issue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Captain Kernow Posted August 6, 2018 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 6, 2018 Centering: relax and stand like a tree (arms and hands down by your side but slightly away from your sides). Take a slow, deep breath through the nose and exhale slowly through the mouth. Repeat that several times. Continue to stand like a tree for a few minutes and concentrate on your wiring diagram in your mind. When calm and centered then you may begin. Chi Gung Cordon Bleu. I have now centred one Cobalt and am awaiting the glue holding down the wooden spacers under the baseboard to dry. These are provided so that there is some decent thickness of wood to screw the holding screws into. I have tested the distances and this should remove any requirement to trim the steel operating rod of the Cobalt motors. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 6, 2018 Cordon Bleu. I have now centred one Cobalt and am awaiting the glue holding down the wooden spacers under the baseboard to dry. These are provided so that there is some decent thickness of wood to screw the holding screws into. I have tested the distances and this should remove any requirement to trim the steel operating rod of the Cobalt motors. Splendid wheeze old boy. If you do have to trim it I used a mini drill and cutting disc with point in situ. I did not stand like a tree before doing this. Ar$£. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted August 6, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 6, 2018 Splendid wheeze old boy. If you do have to trim it I used a mini drill and cutting disc with point in situ. I did not stand like a tree before doing this. Ar$£. Do not use normal cutters on the operating wire. Do not ask me how I know..... Cheers, MIck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgman Posted August 6, 2018 Share Posted August 6, 2018 Do not use normal cutters on the operating wire. Do not ask me how I know..... Cheers, MIck Not cutting wire but bullhead track this morning using my "trusty" Xuron cutter and the damn things snapped ! One blade just flew into the ether, I've never encountered that before. D.Isgruntled Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted August 7, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 7, 2018 Do not use normal cutters on the operating wire. Do not ask me how I know..... Cheers, MIck Why do you think I use a cutting disc.........I even tried Tin Snips (like a dimbo would). CKs wheeze sounds good to me. A.Slitter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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