Jump to content


Google Ads are only seen by non-members of RMweb - Create an RMweb account and you'll only receive modelling ads.

Photo
* * * * - 1 votes

Kadee Couplers





  • Please log in to reply
471 replies to this topic

#1 Calimero

Calimero

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 141 posts

Posted 29 October 2010 - 14:04

I'm fitting Kadee couplers for my layout can anyone help me?

What are the best ones to fit to 'OO' stock?

The layout has 2nd radius curves on it so are there specific types for this?

Thanks all

Google Ads are only seen by non-members of RMweb - Create an RMweb account and you'll only receive modelling ads.

#2 wollastonblue

wollastonblue

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 427 posts
  • LocationDown the road from SVR

Posted 29 October 2010 - 14:16

Hi,

For stock that have NEM pockets you need either Kadee #19, #20 or #21, I use #21's on my layout. Of other stock just use standard Kadee #5's. One thing though make sure you get the Kadee height gauge, as some NEM pockets are not at the relevant level.

Hope this helps.


  • Craftsmanship/Clever x 1

#3 66C

66C

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 581 posts

Posted 29 October 2010 - 14:34

With such tight curves you will most likely have problems with the standard length shank No5.

You should consider using No46 couplers that have a long shank and so allow more sideways movement in the coupler.

These are also more suitable for long wheelbase 4 wheel stock and modern stock that has longer buffer shanks.

Regards
  • Informative/Useful x 1
  • Agree x 1

#4 RFS

RFS

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 2,344 posts
  • LocationSouth Derbyshire

Posted 29 October 2010 - 14:52

Hi,

For stock that have NEM pockets you need either Kadee #19, #20 or #21, I use #21's on my layout. Of other stock just use standard Kadee #5's. One thing though make sure you get the Kadee height gauge, as some NEM pockets are not at the relevant level.

Hope this helps.


The Kadee couplings for NEM pockets are #17, #18, #19 and #20. #21 requires a draft box and not an NEM pocket. I've found that #18, #19 and #20 are best for my layout which has 3' radius curves. Not found a use for #17s yet.

Best thing to do would be to buy one packet of each and try out on your stock to see what fits best.
  • Informative/Useful x 2
  • Agree x 1

#5 Calimero

Calimero

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 141 posts

Posted 29 October 2010 - 14:56

Thanks, the locos (IE 141s) have NEM pockets and most of the wagons although kit/scratch and conversion will be rebogied/underframed using Bachmann products so shoul all be NEM pocketed as well.

I've read about the height guage so this will be a must but need to sort out correct couplers to get round those second radius curves.

Are there any retailers UK that sell a big selection?

#6 Flood

Flood

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 1,733 posts
  • LocationPreferably 83G (84D), sadly 17A

Posted 29 October 2010 - 14:59

North Wales Models

Reasonably priced and quick delivery - just a happy customer etc etc.
  • Agree x 1

#7 James Hilton

James Hilton

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 575 posts
  • LocationLlangollen

Posted 29 October 2010 - 15:10

Both Express Models and Nairnshire Modelling Supplies are where I get my Kadees from :) Google them :) No link other than a happy customer!



#8 RFS

RFS

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 2,344 posts
  • LocationSouth Derbyshire

Posted 29 October 2010 - 17:20

I too get most of mine from North Wales Models, via their Ebay shop. Big plus point is that their postage charges are reasonable even if you only want one packet of 4.
  • Agree x 1
  • Like x 1

#9 HighSpeed1

HighSpeed1

    Registered Member


  • Members
  • Pip
  • 6 posts

Posted 17 November 2010 - 15:41

Thanks, the locos (IE 141s) have NEM pockets and most of the wagons although kit/scratch and conversion will be rebogied/underframed using Bachmann products so shoul all be NEM pocketed as well.

I've read about the height guage so this will be a must but need to sort out correct couplers to get round those second radius curves.

Are there any retailers UK that sell a big selection?


Hi All,

Be careful when using NEM Kadee's with Bachmann chassis, as some have their NEM pockets set for 'cranked' tension-lock couplings. This makes the pockets way too high for Kadee's. My solution when converting Bachmann chassis is to completely forget about using NEM couplings and use good ol' No.5's instead.

Steve
  • Like x 1

#10 10800

10800

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 2,029 posts
  • LocationTeignmouth, Devon

Posted 17 November 2010 - 15:46

M G Sharp http://www.kato-unit...ers-1171-0.html

#11 Butler Henderson

Butler Henderson

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 3,472 posts

Posted 17 November 2010 - 20:58

Hi All,

Be careful when using NEM Kadee's with Bachmann chassis, as some have their NEM pockets set for 'cranked' tension-lock couplings. This makes the pockets way too high for Kadee's. My solution when converting Bachmann chassis is to completely forget about using NEM couplings and use good ol' No.5's instead.

Steve


You can easilly make up a cranked Kadee using an NEM Kadee and parts of a NEM tension lock. (Photos details are on the old forum)

#12 2ManySpams

2ManySpams

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 15,468 posts
  • LocationBermuda Triangle

Posted 17 November 2010 - 21:29

North Wales Models

Reasonably priced and quick delivery - just a happy customer etc etc.


Second that.

#13 Oldddudders

Oldddudders

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 11,407 posts
  • LocationLe Mans, France

Posted 17 November 2010 - 21:41

North Wales Models

Reasonably priced and quick delivery - just a happy customer etc etc.

Yes, spot on. Had a parcel from them today. Kadee #18s plus some ballast & bits, quite a boxful, arrived in France in just over a week for a measly £4.92 postage. Some other ebay sellers should look closely at their postal charges. Not my first order from them, won't be my last.

#14 BR60103

BR60103

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 1,591 posts
  • LocationHoneysuckle Cottage, Guelph, Ontario, Canada

Posted 18 November 2010 - 03:27

Kadee make a big selection of mounting because the American market has a variety of places to mount. Kadee's website has specs for the mounting height for all their variants. You do not need to settle on just one as they are all compatible. You may have to use different lengths depending on buffers and how far back you have to mount the draft gear.
When I started, Kadee had the 4/5, 6, 7, 8, and 10 (10 is now 5). And they were mechanical, not magnetic.

#15 charliepetty

charliepetty

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 2,409 posts
  • LocationLeeds, Yorkshire

Posted 05 December 2010 - 10:21

DC Kits sell them too, they also visit dozens of shows throughout the UK. www.dckits-devideos.co.uk

#16 corax67

corax67

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 3,235 posts
  • LocationSunny Kent

Posted 05 December 2010 - 11:30

If you are looking to fit Kadee to UK stock then the following articles which appeared in Modern Railway Modeling magazine are a very useful starting point


http://www.modernrai...pdfs/issue3.pdf


http://www.modernrai...pdfs/issue4.pdf

#17 2ManySpams

2ManySpams

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 15,468 posts
  • LocationBermuda Triangle

Posted 09 December 2010 - 18:00

DC Kits sell them too, they also visit dozens of shows throughout the UK. www.dckits-devideos.co.uk


How on earth do you know that Charlie? :P
  • Funny x 2

#18 Jaggzuk

Jaggzuk

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 522 posts
  • LocationNorth Yorkshire

Posted 19 July 2013 - 20:43

Now, it might appear to be a bit of an odd question considering that I have no actual layout as of yet; all at the planning stage, but a recent experience at home has sort of got me thinking.  

 

I recently bought some old OO stock for my 2 1/2 year old son to play with, rather than my expensive stuff.  Well as it turns out, as he has very good fine motor skills, he can shunt and drive his models round a very simple loop I built him with great control and care.

 

He also loves nothing better than to couple up long trains on the floorboard floor and pull them along and here lies the problem, tension hook couplings.  When he wants to separate the trucks and coaches the hooks make life really difficult.

 

I have a lot of stock pilled rolling stock, mixed old, new and kit.  I started life thinking that 3 link couplings would be the way to go for realism reasons, so most of my made kits have them.  A few RTR were converted to 3 link, but now that idea has fallen by the wayside due to new little fingers.

 

Having read a fair bit on Kadee I sort of think that they will be the best for me and my son on the layout I am planning.  So what is the view of other users on this and in particular these points:

 

            Conversion ease - loco, wagon coaches, not looking for a big answer, just is it worth the effort?

            Usability - me and my son

            Robustness – in case of hard shunting and stock being separated by being picked up vertically.

            Cost

            What to do with the 3 link, leave the hook in place?

           

Any help much appreciated.



#19 HLT 0109

HLT 0109

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 938 posts
  • LocationCambridgeshire

Posted 19 July 2013 - 21:28

Having read a fair bit on Kadee I sort of think that they will be the best for me and my son on the layout I am planning.  So what is the view of other users on this and in particular these points:

 

            Conversion ease - loco, wagon coaches, not looking for a big answer, just is it worth the effort?

            Usability - me and my son

            Robustness – in case of hard shunting and stock being separated by being picked up vertically.

            Cost

            What to do with the 3 link, leave the hook in place?

           

Any help much appreciated.

 

Kadees are the coupler of choice for me but they can be quite difficult to fix in place of original TLCs on anything that does not have NEM pockets or if using the non-NEM type..  Once it is done however, I think they are well worth the effort.  Kadees are metal so quite robust (unlike the Bachmann's EZ Mate version which is plastic) but they do rely on a tiny coil spring that can be dislodged and lost with careless handling (the EZ version is even worse in that respect) and I find them extremely difficult to refit.  The cost can be about £2 per wagon but cheaper in bulk - try P & H Models for keen pricing.  I suspect you would have to remove 3-link if they hang from the bufferbeam as they will foul the Kadee on bogied wagons/coaches.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Harold.


  • Thanks x 1

#20 47137

47137

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 1,202 posts
  • LocationEssex, UK

Posted 19 July 2013 - 22:02

Having read a fair bit on Kadee I sort of think that they will be the best for me and my son on the layout I am planning.  So what is the view of other users on this and in particular these points ...

I am a 'new user' of Kadees, I have fitted about 30 pairs in the last two months. Here are my thoughts ...

 

            Conversion ease - loco, wagon coaches, not looking for a big answer, just is it worth the effort?

It has got to be worth the effort. I sat behind the fiddle yard of a club layout using tension locks and thought how glad I am I have got rid of these things at home.

            Usability - me and my son

Mine never come detached. There might be unwanted uncoupling if you build abrupt gradients.

            Robustness – in case of hard shunting and stock being separated by being picked up vertically.

If you twist the vehicle slightly as you lift it, it comes away cleanly. Less risk of damage than with the tension locks. The coupler heads have tiny springs and these are a serious challenge to refit if they come out. However I have had only one come out so far.

            Cost

Seem fair value, even if you cut off the trip pins and forego the magnetic features.

            What to do with the 3 link, leave the hook in place?

If the Kadee is in the right place, the hook can stay but you will have to lose the chain.

 

One thought - if you know you will never turn the vehicles round, you could remove the tension lock hook from one end of each vehicle. You could always try this first? Easier uncoupling, but might be frustrating if your son starts to assemble two parts of a train which he then finds won't couple up together. Or, remove the hook from both ends of each loco (I always used to do this), this makes uncoupling the train from the loco easier.


  • Thanks x 1

#21 Dunsignalling

Dunsignalling

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 5,061 posts
  • LocationMilepost 154 3/4

Posted 20 July 2013 - 03:01

I am a 'new user' of Kadees, I have fitted about 30 pairs in the last two months. Here are my thoughts ...

Conversion ease - loco, wagon coaches, not looking for a big answer, just is it worth the effort?
It has got to be worth the effort. I sat behind the fiddle yard of a club layout using tension locks and thought how glad I am I have got rid of these things at home.
Usability - me and my son
Mine never come detached. There might be unwanted uncoupling if you build abrupt gradients.
Robustness – in case of hard shunting and stock being separated by being picked up vertically.
If you twist the vehicle slightly as you lift it, it comes away cleanly. Less risk of damage than with the tension locks. The coupler heads have tiny springs and these are a serious challenge to refit if they come out. However I have had only one come out so far.
Cost
Seem fair value, even if you cut off the trip pins and forego the magnetic features.
What to do with the 3 link, leave the hook in place?
If the Kadee is in the right place, the hook can stay but you will have to lose the chain.

One thought - if you know you will never turn the vehicles round, you could remove the tension lock hook from one end of each vehicle. You could always try this first? Easier uncoupling, but might be frustrating if your son starts to assemble two parts of a train which he then finds won't couple up together. Or, remove the hook from both ends of each loco (I always used to do this), this makes uncoupling the train from the loco easier.

Hi

I've been using Kadees for the best part of 20 years and have very little to add - 47137 has picked it up most of the tricks very quickly, it took me at least a year to get where he is now.

1. The springs don't ping off too often and Kadee include a couple of spares with each packet of couplers. I have never needed to open the extra packet of springs I bought when I started out.

They also make a little tool, # 241 that makes replacing them fairly easy and is safer than using the pointy end of a craft knife. The trick is to pick up the spring close to one end and put the long end on to the knuckle first. Also pick them up from a small container (a plastic milk bottle top is good) so they don't disappear if (when) you drop them.

Kadee suggest fixing them in place with a small drop of CA (superglue) but it needs to be a VERY small drop applied with great care to avoid gluing up the pivot.

2. Even if you don't do it to every vehicle, having a few 'convertors' with Kadees on one end and tension-locks on the other is a good idea if you want to run on someone else's railway or have visitors who want to run on yours. When not 'on duty' they can just run around together. I have a pair of freight vans for goods trains and a pair of parcels vans for passenger trains; if you want to run coal trains, a pair of 16-tonners would be a good idea, too. It also means you don't have to fit Kadees to everything straight away.

Good luck

John

Edited by Dunsignalling, 20 July 2013 - 03:03 .

  • Like x 2
  • Informative/Useful x 2
  • Thanks x 1

#22 47137

47137

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 1,202 posts
  • LocationEssex, UK

Posted 20 July 2013 - 08:58

1. The springs don't ping off too often ... The trick is to pick up the spring close to one end and put the long end on to the knuckle first. Also pick them up from a small container (a plastic milk bottle top is good) so they don't disappear if (when) you drop them.

Kadee suggest fixing them in place with a small drop of CA (superglue) but it needs to be a VERY small drop applied with great care to avoid gluing up the pivot.

"Putting in Kadee knuckle springs": I took the spring out to modify a coupler and then lost at least six to the carpet putting it back in. In the end I tried this, which worked first time: I fixed the pointed end of a wooden cocktail stick into the side of the spring using superglue. Manipulated both ends of the spring into place. Held the spring in place and teased out the cocktail stick ...

 

- Richard.


  • Craftsmanship/Clever x 1

#23 kevinlms

kevinlms

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 3,280 posts
  • LocationLaunching Place, Australia

Posted 20 July 2013 - 12:46

Hi

I've been using Kadees for the best part of 20 years and have very little to add - 47137 has picked it up most of the tricks very quickly, it took me at least a year to get where he is now.

1. The springs don't ping off too often and Kadee include a couple of spares with each packet of couplers. I have never needed to open the extra packet of springs I bought when I started out.

They also make a little tool, # 241 that makes replacing them fairly easy and is safer than using the pointy end of a craft knife. The trick is to pick up the spring close to one end and put the long end on to the knuckle first. Also pick them up from a small container (a plastic milk bottle top is good) so they don't disappear if (when) you drop them.

Kadee suggest fixing them in place with a small drop of CA (superglue) but it needs to be a VERY small drop applied with great care to avoid gluing up the pivot.

 

The reason the tool works & a craft knife doesn't is because the blade is too narrow. Something a bit thicker would work well too.

 

I would agree 100% that the key is to pick up close to one end & put the long end onto the knuckle first. Anything else will only cause severe frustration.

 

I've never tried the superglue method and I'm not sure that I would.



#24 JZ

JZ

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,400 posts
  • Location200 yards from Radstock North

Posted 20 July 2013 - 17:53

 Not found a use for #17s yet.

 Bachmann Presflos. I've fitted mine with #17 and they will handle 24" rad in my fiddle yards.


  • Informative/Useful x 1

#25 Jaggzuk

Jaggzuk

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 522 posts
  • LocationNorth Yorkshire

Posted 22 July 2013 - 13:17

Thanks guys for the really helpful answers to my questions.  I am pretty much sold now on the Kadee way forward.  So will now look at getting the appropriate packs of couplings and start the conversion process, I might first get one the of sample pack they do to see what all the different type are.

 

I guess I have one outstanding question on robustness which is still making me a bit hesitant.  How resilient are the couplings to being hit a bit too hard when being coupled, i.e. if ‘little hands’ are at the controls and the shunting move is a bit too fast/hard?

 

Paul









Google Ads are only seen by non-members of RMweb - Create an RMweb account and you'll only receive modelling ads.