RMweb Gold Donw Posted October 19, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 19, 2016 No one could b*gger up plain black surely haha.... I need to research these '57XX' Panniers seeingh as they carried 3600-3799, 4600-4690, 7700-7799, 8700-8799 and 9711-9799. I have left out the 57XX series becasue of roof shape and 67XX series because they were not vacuum fitted. If I buy or build one of those it would have to be 9681 which I have had the pleasure of driving on the Dean Forest Railway. Sadly it is not in service at the moment waiting an overhaul. Don Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted October 19, 2016 Author Share Posted October 19, 2016 That's some garden railway your planning there Larry I presume SWMBO has given the layout planning consent . What you now need is a good head gardener to produce the scenery and foliage ...... any offers yet ???? It is a good breakfast at the Rhug Estate though you should be moving up to the Buffalo ###### now your modelling 7mm...... On a serious note I'm impressed as to how much you can get within the station area in the shed you certainly have an eye for planning will enjoy the further developments. Mary won't know what is afoot until it happens. The loop at the shed doorway is to 5' 6" radius so as to avoid things on the washing line snagging on it, so you can see I have as much concern for household activities as anyone. The 'L' curve is 6' radius i think but it still misses the patio, while the rest of the railway goes across lawn we simply never use. Hi Coach, I have a set of books called 'The Pannier Papers' and they are a minefield of info on the different types, with lots of photographic reference. Again you are welcome to borrow them to help get your head around the differences. That is very kind and I will take you up on your offer. I enjoy research. Welcome to 0 gauge. If you know Bracks his garden layout is worth a visit. I have spent some happy hours operating his layout. You don't need fishplates for handbuilt track when you can curve the rails before laying. However if you are using flexi track for tight curves the rail will try and straighten out so something needs to hold it. The Peco ones will work but if you have any trouble with doglegs appearing at the track joints soldering the rails to a brass screw under the rail will stop it and can be hid by ballast My interest in 7mm is a bit earlier than yours but this would have been seen at Oswestry at some stage Not much chane of getting a sound chip specifically for one of those My intention is to build a much conpressed version of Dolgelley set around 1904, although progress has been stalled due to a house move and major diy following that. Hi Don, Surely a chip and sugarcube would fit inside a 7mm tender? The ensemble looks very attractive. Yes, Alan 'Bracks' and I have known each other since the early 1970's due to our occupations. He cycled to our home one day from Wrexham! He doesn't yet know about my 0 gauge conversion... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted October 19, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 19, 2016 Mary won't know what is afoot until it happens. The loop at the shed doorway is to 5' 6" radius so as to avoid things on the washing line snagging on it, so you can see I have as much concern for household activities as anyone. The 'L' curve is 6' radius i think but it still misses the patio, while the rest of the railway goes across lawn we simply never use. That is very kind and I will take you up on your offer. I enjoy research. Hi Don, Surely a chip and sugarcube would fit inside a 7mm tender? The ensemble looks very attractive. Yes, Alan 'Bracks' and I have known each other since the early 1970's due to our occupations. He cycled to our home one day from Wrexham! He doesn't yet know about my 0 gauge conversion... It is not the fitting of the speaker etc. but it is rather too late to record the sound of a real one. I hope there is a sound recording from a Dean goods or a Dukedog that should be reasonable for a Duke and other Dean locos. Mind you is there anyone still around who can remember the should of a Sharpie. Don edit who changed sound into should ? blessed smellchucker Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted October 20, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 20, 2016 Hi Coach, I have a set of books called 'The Pannier Papers' and they are a minefield of info on the different types, with lots of photographic reference. Again you are welcome to borrow them to help get your head around the differences. Jinty They are undoubtedly the best reference for panniers as the text is good, the captions are good, and the photos are generally well chosen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted October 20, 2016 Author Share Posted October 20, 2016 Thanks Jinty. A quick perusal after you left for home showed I am in for a good 'read'. I have already discovered none of the 87XX's were based on the route through Oswestry. There are some books on Amazon covering GWR locomotive classes that I should seriously consider buying. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Happy Hippo Posted October 20, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 20, 2016 They are undoubtedly the best reference for panniers as the text is good, the captions are good, and the photos are generally well chosen. And after you have read them you will realize, that the panniers you are referring to are not 57xx but the 8750 variety. As up until 8749 they all had the arc roof on the cab However, it doesn't help that the 67xx series are split so that the later ones have the larger cab, despite being in a lower number series. I used to get a lot of stick from certain members of my father's family over referring to certain members of the pannier family as Great Western engines when they were the product of outside contractors. But I recall their greatest scorn seemed to be reserved for the 66xx 0-6-2t locos built by Armstong Witworth. I can only presume that they caused the most trouble to the workshop staff when they first arrived in S Wales. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Happy Hippo Posted October 20, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 20, 2016 A helpful insight as to what was at Oswestry through the years: http://shedbashuk.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/oswestry-1938-1964.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted October 20, 2016 Author Share Posted October 20, 2016 A helpful insight as to what was at Oswestry through the years: http://shedbashuk.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/oswestry-1938-1964.html Wow, Thanks very much, that's extremely useful. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
81A Oldoak Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 Help is on the way for lovers of the 57XX/8750 0-6-0PTs. Meanwhile, here is a photo of my model of my ex-Cambrian 0-6-0 896 of 89A Oswestry ona visit to Cwm Bach. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jintyman Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Hi Coachman, I think you may find that the handrails should bend out to clear the top feed pipe where it comes down over the tank by the cab. It may be that the handrail knobs are too long, therefore allowing the clearance without the prototypical avoidance bend. It also may prove that it would be too much work to change all for the sake of a little bend in the handrail. The Tower brass 8750 is a handsome loco indeed, and crying out for a nice Maroon B' Set to tug around. Jinty The bend can be seen clearly here http://trainphotos.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/edd/2015/07/96811-1560x1011.jpg Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted October 24, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 24, 2016 Hi Coachman, I think you may find that the handrails should bend out to clear the top feed pipe where it comes down over the tank by the cab. It may be that the handrail knobs are too long, therefore allowing the clearance without the prototypical avoidance bend. It also may prove that it would be too much work to change all for the sake of a little bend in the handrail. The Tower brass 8750 is a handsome loco indeed, and crying out for a nice Maroon B' Set to tug around. Jinty The bend can be seen clearly here http://trainphotos.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/edd/2015/07/96811-1560x1011.jpg That picture shows it how I remember Someone hadn't made a good job of fitting the dome. Don Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted October 24, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 24, 2016 The bunker side steps come in an accessory pack so i soldered them in position this afternoon... WEB Pannier 4.jpg The Tower Brass 8750 is neatly detailed but I considered the injector overflow pipes were too small in diameter..... WEB Pannier 1.jpg I bend up new pipes from 1.1mm brass road and fabricated a rectangular joint flange and support bracket from scrap brass and soldered them in place... WEB Pannier 2.jpg Same on the other side.... WEB Pannier 3.jpg Washed and ready for test fitting DCC decoder and bass reflex speaker.... WEB Pannier 5.jpg Seeing as 9680 and 9682 had 'external' overflow pipes from the injectors, I have taken a chance that 9681 (Oswestry based till later 1950's) had the same. It is preserved as well, so I have just Googled a shot of it in heritage condition. What a flook....The support bracket and joint box are in the same position as mine.... Is it my eyes or has the front middle lower lamp bracket gone AWOL? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold martin_wynne Posted October 25, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 25, 2016 A friend offered to draw me Templot plans while another offered to build a turnout or two, but to be honest I have to make do with shortish points Hi Larry, Templot can do short turnouts just as easily as long ones, and can help you get as much as possible in a small space. Maybe not to this extreme: Templot screenshot Using ready-made turnouts such as Peco will always take more space than a custom-built formation. regards, Martin. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted October 25, 2016 Author Share Posted October 25, 2016 Hi Coachman, I think you may find that the handrails should bend out to clear the top feed pipe where it comes down over the tank by the cab. It may be that the handrail knobs are too long, therefore allowing the clearance without the prototypical avoidance bend. It also may prove that it would be too much work to change all for the sake of a little bend in the handrail. The Tower brass 8750 is a handsome loco indeed, and crying out for a nice Maroon B' Set to tug around. The handrail knobs are actually too long all round. It would be no big deal to replace them together with a newly formed handrail and I may indeed do this. I hadn't spotted the missing middle lamp bracket so it will be attended to. Some remedial work was necessary on the loco as purchased but nevertheless it's price saved me a considerable amount of £££'s just a few hours before i was prepared to buy a brandnew one off Tower'. Someone mentioned the dome but it looks okay to me. The model isn't with me at the mo....PGH is installing sound while i get on with coach building. Hi Larry, Templot can do short turnouts just as easily as long ones, and can help you get as much as possible in a small space. Maybe not to this extreme: Using ready-made turnouts such as Peco will always take more space than a custom-built formation. Hi Martin and thanks. I agree handmade points struck off a continuous mainline curve would have saved space particularly if they were almost overlapped and built as one unit. But this being my first venture into 0 gauge, i wanted to start with what I am familiar with (Peco) so that I have the options of just flicking them over, connecting them to point rodding or motorising them with the latest DCC gadgets (near-neighbor Jintyman is kindly offering advice as I proceed). This is my final project. I'm confident it will satisfy long term but i don't yet know how much time I want to sepnd on building it. This might sound odd to the hobbyist, but I have worked full time painting for other hobbyists for so long that I can take or leave my own spare-time ventures. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 This is my final project. I'm confident it will satisfy long term but i don't yet know how much time I want to spend on building it. So you've not yet tasted Gauge 1? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted October 25, 2016 Author Share Posted October 25, 2016 So you've not yet tasted Gauge 1? Yup, I painted some of Pete Waterman's. There is an article in one railway mag where builder Geoff Holt said he warned me to strengthen my workbench before he brought over a Beyer-Garratt for painting! Gauge 1 just didn't appeal to me one bit. It's a strange thing but gauge 0 always seems to have weight and solidarity about it whereas Gauge 1 looked to me to be more about tin boxes soldered together. I can't describe it in any other way. If any detail is missing it shows! Pete was already returning to 0 gauge even before I had painted the last of his larger gauge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted October 25, 2016 Author Share Posted October 25, 2016 Innit great to have good friends. PGH phoned an hour ago after reading this thread and asked if I wanted him to fit new handrail and knobs on the Pannier while it's at his place. His hand is in a bandage where I bit it....... Any Gauge 0-ers any experience of Masterpiece Models locos? They're a bit out of my price range but their 38XX 2-8-0 looks smashing. I remember the pleasure I got out of watching the 00 Hornby model. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Focalplane Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 Larry, I think the new layout (and its design principles) is a classic example of "each to his/her own". No two hobbyists will have the same priorities and only small layouts can indulge an individual to go it alone and be a jack of all trades, hopefully master of some of them. On the subject of track design, I have used Martin's Templot to design and build the track for my currently stored Shipston-on-Stour 4mm layout. And I did it using A Mac with Crossover as per Martin's recommendation. Talk about a steep learning curve, but once I understood the nuances and philosophy behind Templot it was a useful and interesting experience. As an experiment before tackling 7mm scale I also built two C&L turnouts, the second one being a three way. Ironically I have not used either one of them (yet), going for a turntable, the ultimate space saver for an MPD layout. As for saving £££s, I feel sure there is a good second hand market for reliable Gauge O locomotives, particularly those RTR made primarily of brass. The Gauge O Gulid operates two forms of SH sales, one a sort of bring and buy stall at their meetings, the other their Executor and Trust department. The 57XX class now seems to be covered by three manufacturers and at least one kit - all in Gauge O. Though not all are currently available, the expensive options will both be out within a year or two. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted October 25, 2016 Author Share Posted October 25, 2016 Hi Paul, At the moment the Peco track is just laid out loosely on the old baseboard. I can alter it if I decide to go for straight turnouts and a double slip seeing as this would effectively lengthen the platforms, but it is all in the air and it gives me plenty of breathing space. If someone built me special turnouts I would be obliged to stick with them rather than be a complete ar$$ and waste their time and effort. I will do my best to create something that looks the part and on that score there is no shortage of inspiration (and skill) in RMweb's 7mm layout & modelling section. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Focalplane Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 Re. Masterpiece Models As an owner of one Lee Marsh Jubilee and another Lee Marsh reserved, and having inspected both Lee Marsh and Masterpiece at the Bristol Gauge O show in February, I would say that they are very similar in build quality and specification. Masterpiece recently had a change of ownership but the new owner is moving in the same direction as his predecessor (in fact embracing Scale 7 only more so) so there is no change there. The South Korean quality control (managed by experts here in the UK) does justify the higher prices of both makes. I expect that the 38XX will have working inside valve motion as well, a useful addition given the amount of under boiler space that is visible. Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John R Smith Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 I think that I do prefer the second, more curvaceous example. To me it looks more railway-like and somehow looks more spacious too. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Happy Hippo Posted October 25, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 25, 2016 I expect that the 38XX will have working inside valve motion as well, a useful addition given the amount of under boiler space that is visible. Paul Excuse me being a pedant, but quality of workmanship aside, it won't be true working valve motion. Even if they put a proper crank axle onto the loco, it will be driving from the crank end and not the pistons, will not notch up and I very much doubt that the reversing lever will change to the opposite end of the quadrant prior to a change of direction. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 The straight and the curved approach..... WEB 0 Layout plans 3.jpg WEB 7mm Oswestry 2.jpg 2ND 2ND 2ND All Day long Larry, superb. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 Also Larry, Are you aware that Peco do a Micro Switch that fits inside the cover in the middle of the Point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 I like my railways big and curvy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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