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Dick Turpin

Hornby Princess Coronation Class (Duchess)

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This is all based on photographs. Perhaps we should wait until someone sees an actual model prototype at one of the shows?

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These are not finished products by any means, I am sure any gaps, colour issues will be sorted by the time of production. Happily for the some of us (well me actually) who love the loco without knowing the ins and outs of a cats a**e about it and the fact that I have a severe form of colour blindness it is a case of...If it looks like a Princess Coronation to me I am happy.

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This is all based on photographs. Perhaps we should wait until someone sees an actual model prototype at one of the shows?

 

If we shouldn't pre-judge the model by the released photos - why release them?

 

Any apparent deficiencies are bound to attract adverse comment; if the aim is to excite interest, it is often counter-productive.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

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Crimson Lake/Maroon Gate...

 

:banghead:

 

Nobody's mentioned how good the tender looks, compared to the old tooling..

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I hardly need remind members of RMweb that the people who have been at the NRM since it's inception are not a bunch of amateurs. 

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Judgement only has value for what you are looking at not necessarily the finished product. The value in showing these pictures is to give the viewer a sense of what is to come not exactly what is to come. Of course if glaring errors are spotted on these photos then they serve a purpose. The colour issue cannot be judged accurately because in photography angles, lighting exposure etc can affect how we perceive colour, then there is the colour of the reproduction in the article which may differ from the original shot. 

All that aside I am so glad I pre-ordered mine because these look as if they will sell like hot cakes. (do hot cakes sell any quicker than fresh cream buns?....dont stray off topic).

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I've got to be honest - if Hornby brought out exactly what they have previewed I would buy both BR versions straight away without hesitation (pausing only to make sure my wife didn't notice :))

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Judgement only has value for what you are looking at not necessarily the finished product. The value in showing these pictures is to give the viewer a sense of what is to come not exactly what is to come. Of course if glaring errors are spotted on these photos then they serve a purpose. The colour issue cannot be judged accurately because in photography angles, lighting exposure etc can affect how we perceive colour, then there is the colour of the reproduction in the article which may differ from the original shot. 

All that aside I am so glad I pre-ordered mine because these look as if they will sell like hot cakes. (do hot cakes sell any quicker than fresh cream buns?....dont stray off topic).

 

I'm not too worried about the colour - in the unlikely event that it's too far out, a repaint is always an option.

 

I do, however, strongly dislike having to take a piercing saw to a brand new model, just to get a trailing truck which pivots and has flanged wheels as per the prototype.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Edited by cctransuk

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My Britannia Pacific came with an optional pair of flanged wheels for the trailing truck. Doesn't the LMS Pacific?  I left the flangeless wheels in place. I have always assumed those who consider themselves to be railway modellers understood that RTR manufacturers still have to design for settrack curves.  

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If we shouldn't pre-judge the model by the released photos - why release them?

 

Any apparent deficiencies are bound to attract adverse comment; if the aim is to excite interest, it is often counter-productive.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

So following on from that loftily expressed suggestion,maybe Hornby should withdraw from posting The Engine Shed ?

 

Oh for Heaven's sake....you can make that case for all pre-release images from all manufacturers.So maybe a "news embargo" until the day of release ?. Believe me ,I know of at least two commissioners of r-t-r models who are seriously contemplating that and one of them due to comments posted on this forum and the other who informs only on a "need to know" basis.for similar reasons

 

It is the nature of the human condition in the U.K.to utter adverse comment.We can't change that....it's part of the British psyche,historically developed over centuries. It need not be this way.Is it not just possible to accept that this and others are models under development (not perfect) and that Hornby allow us the privelege of following that development ? Or must some of us rub their hands in glee as (they believe) they set themselves up to fail...I hope that is not the case but I suspect the "condition" is affecting some of us.

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So following on from that loftily expressed suggestion,maybe Hornby should withdraw from posting The Engine Shed ?

 

Oh for Heaven's sake....you can make that case for all pre-release images from all manufacturers.So maybe a "news embargo" until the day of release ?. Believe me ,I know of at least two commissioners of r-t-r models who are seriously contemplating that and one of them due to comments posted on this forum and the other who informs only on a "need to know" basis.for similar reasons

 

It is the nature of the human condition in the U.K.to utter adverse comment.We can't change that....it's part of the British psyche,historically developed over centuries. It need not be this way.Is it not just possible to accept that this and others are models under development (not perfect) and that Hornby allow us the privelege of following that development ? Or must some of us rub their hands in glee as (they believe) they set themselves up to fail...I hope that is not the case but I suspect the "condition" is affecting some of us.

To be fair it does say at the foot of The Engine Shed 'As always we love to hear your feedback about the blog and anything you’ve seen within so please do leave your comments on FacebookTwitter and our Official Forums.' and Paul has asked for views on RMWEB

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I would say the red in the photo is spot on. Certainly the Hornby colour does not appear to be any where near! The issue of the flange less fixed trailing wheels surfaces again. A manage iritent on all Hornby Pacifics. Bachmann have manage to solve this!

 

Just to prove that "beauty is in the eye of the beholder".  That Colourrail image bears no relation to any colour that I recall seeing on the real thing (nigh on 60 years ago!).  Certainly, in use, the paint was cleaned (if it was cleaned at all!) with an oily rag which tends to impart a dirty blue and rather darker element.  Which only goes to show how subjective the whole colour thing is.

 

And I for one have been pleased to watch this new tooling develop since seeing the "grey ghost" version announced at Warley.

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So following on from that loftily expressed suggestion ...........

 

 

Not sure what you mean by 'loftily' - it is simply a statement of my position on photos of 'in development' models; expressed (I hope) in correct English.

 

 

So maybe a "news embargo" until the day of release ?.

 

That would be my preference - but manufacturers 'seed the market' with hints, followed by development photos, for their own ends. They are trying to corner the market for a particular subject, and to attract pre-orders.

 

That's fine - but with that strategy comes the possibility / likelihood that aspects of the forthcoming model will be criticised; they can't have it both ways.

 

Specific to this model, I contacted Hornby as soon as the subject was announced; (but after I had pre-ordered it). I pointed out the potential pit-falls of the tender (non-existent) valance, and the lack of authenticity arising from their policy of having non-articulated, flangeless trailing trucks.

 

I took the trouble to point out that an authentic, articulated, flanged trailing truck can easily be made rigid, and raised, by providing an additional tapped hole and a suitable screw, plus the flangeless wheelset already included. Conversely, a non-authentic rigid trailing truck, integral with the mainframes, requires the use of a piercing saw, drill and tap, plus a screw provided by the purchaser, in order to be made to articulate in an authentic manner.

 

The tender issue received encouraging feedback from Hornby's representative - the trailing truck less so; (see #24, 29, 31, 41).

 

When these issues have been raised it is perfectly reasonable to comment as to whether or not there is evidence, later in the development of the model, that any notice has been taken of them.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

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Apparently Mr. Isles has left Hornby, and is now designing 'Angry Birds 2' Models...the market is much less stressfull!

Anon.

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I'm sure this model will be the best yet from Hornby. Despite doubt, I still believe all will be well with the maroon livery application.

Remember the furore over the B12 driving wheels??? I for one won't be cancelling my pre-order with the "Big H".

Edited by Black 5 Bear
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Four coaches. All were sprayed with the same colour.....

 

attachicon.gifWEB BR maroon 1.jpg

attachicon.gifWEB BR maroon 2.jpg

attachicon.gifWEB BR Maroon 3.jpg

attachicon.gifWEB BR Maroon 4.jpg

Thank you Coach for putting some perspective on this discussion, I saw all of the BR red/maroon pacifics, from those emerging from Crewe works to those which had been in revenue earning service for a while. During the period 1958-60 they were kept in a fairly respectable condition and my memories tell me that the colour was quite variable dependent on usage. The only really filthy Duchess I saw was at Crewe, 46234, I recall thinking at the time, how could they allow such a famous locomotive to get into such a dreadful condition but of course she was green although you would not have known. Off topic.....what is the correct pronunciation of 46230 Buccloo or Bucleesh or neither.

 

Rgds,,,,,,,,Mike

Edited by ikks

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I've always pronounced it like Buck-low, but don't go off someone educated in Owdham...   :boast:

Edited by coachmann

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I've always pronounced it like Buck-low, but don't go off someone educated in Owdham... :boast:

My first thought was Buck-loff, as in trough.

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I thought I'd add my bit to this thread for what it's worth.

 

I've been a photographer since the 1970s, and I clearly remember the film comparison articles in the photo press of the day: Colour reproduction varied significantly. For example, Kodachrome 25 in particular was well known for over saturated reds.

 

Digital photography is far more accurate BUT, and this is big BUT: In order to get accurate colours you need to have an accurately profiled workflow with calibrated colour profiles. Looking at the same Website on two different monitors could give quite different results. 

 

Last but not least is the source of light used to take the photograph. Many sources of light such as fluorescent tubes and LEDs do not have a continuous colour spectrum and have problems discerning subtle differences in colour.

 

SHORT SUMMARY: Wait till you have the loco in your hands and look at it in daylight, before passing too many comments about its accuracy.

 

(And oh yes, people are quite bad at remembering exact shades of colour.)

 

I pre-ordered Sir William and have no regrets.

 

Alan

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I dun a Bing and Bucclough is a place in England pronounced buck-loo....   :sarcastic:

 

England is pronounced Scotland...

Edited by coachmann

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Sir William A Stanier will be the most popular Hornby locomotive ever.  PERIOD!!

 

Sean Spicer

 

The last two were not particularly my favourites, 46240 / 46245 were though ! 

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Sir William A Stanier will be the most popular Hornby locomotive ever.  PERIOD!!

 

Sean Spicer

Not heard that one before, who is he?

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Being 63 years old I am lucky enough to be able being hauled by steam on the mainline. To all those who are complaining about the colour of the new Hornby Duchess can I mention that when they were in service you often found that three engines would have three different shades of the same colour and over time the same engine without repainting would go through a multitude of shades as the weather and work affected the paintwork. How then can we say that the shade on the model is wrong when in different lighting conditions the colour appeared to change. 


 


Coachman in post 361 has shown exactly what I mean with his four carriage photos.


 


Enjoy the model and if you don't like it in Tuesday's lighting condition and want it as Friday's condition then start repainting and good luck!


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I've always pronounced it like Buck-low, but don't go off someone educated in Owdham...   :boast:

 

I think...though I am no Scot....it is pronounced..."Bucklew"

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The last two were not particularly my favourites, 46240 / 46245 were though ! 

 Coventry and London. 46240 was the first I ever saw on shed at Landudno Junction in August 1952...and no arguments over the shade of maroon or green because she was in blue.46245 saw service in her final years on Euston-Wolverhampton turns and a number of enthusiasts specials for The Warwickshire Railway Society from New street in 1963/64 which I remember with great pleasure and much nostalgia....as I travelled on them.Definitely in maroon

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