Open Coach Windows - British Outline?

[Steamport Southport]

One wonders why a single compartment of a CK, and no other coach, was selected for this, but presumably a CK could be rostered and the compartment reserved for the stretchee and carers if it was pre-booked to carry a stretcher patient; unbooked emergency cases would probably have to take pot luck in the brake van!

 

I've a feeling it might have been a Southern Region thing as the SR had quite a few CKs in sets of BSK/CK/BSK and other SR carriages also had the stretcher windows including some EMUs.

 

Possibly so they could transport people to sanitoriums on the south coast.

 

 

 

Jason

[russ p]

Is that also the reason a CK has four doors on the corridor side?

Has anyone ever seen evidence of a ck carrying a stretcher?

I wonder if the patient had to buy six tickets or if he or she as extra income for the railway and other passengers jut sat round them.

Could have been bad in the days of water troughs if the patient was laid on their back with the windows slid open and it was the first coach.........

[Fat Controller]

I've a feeling it might have been a Southern Region thing as the SR had quite a few CKs in sets of BSK/CK/BSK and other SR carriages also had the stretcher windows including some EMUs.

 

Possibly so they could transport people to sanitoriums on the south coast.

 

 

 

Jason

Not so much for domestic sanitoria, but for the Lourdes pilgrimage traffic, connecting with the ferries on the south coast. There is still some such traffic, using coaches marked 'Jumbo bus'. I'm not sure if the passengers are put on trains at Calais, as there are regular pilgrimage trains (these days using TGVs for the internal French ones, though loco-hauled stop is used from other countries.)

[russ p]

All those people going to be healed ... Stretcher coach on outward trip.. Disco coach on return, always wondered why BR built that!

[88D]

The problem with incorporating open lights in r-t-r coaches is that (unless it could be randomised in some way) there will be an inevitable "repeat" effect in a long rake.

 

There is also a very good practical reason for avoiding open windows on model coaches, especially for those whose layouts are situated in attics and garden sheds.

 

Preventing the ingress of small wildlife with consequent appearance of tiny, but massively overscale, webs in one's carriage interiors, along with the remains of the prey caught therein. 

 

John

sounds like the voice of experience there, or is it a jest?

[Fat Controller]

It was the guards job to close them when not in use. Still done on many heritage railways. Mainly to stop the train getting full of soot/steam and if you were in the first carriage, water from the water troughs.

 

Also have you noticed the way that older people close windows on trains and buses? Mainly to keep down noise, but also because it was "the done thing".

 

 

 

Jason

It's because 'you can catch cold' or 'get a stiff neck' from a draught, not to mention the damage caused to the 'perms'. My French colleagues still subscribe to the idea that a light breeze is a vector of infection; on the sweltering nights we've had recently, you'll see them donning scarves (and even coats) when nipping out for a quick fag. Poor old Louis Pasteur must be turning in his grave.

[HonestTom]

 

Preventing the ingress of small wildlife with consequent appearance of tiny, but massively overscale, webs in one's carriage interiors, along with the remains of the prey caught therein. 

 

John

 

Does anyone do a 4mm Spider-Man figure? There's your solution.

[nzgresleyfan]

I suppose it depends on the time of year you are modelling. Many windows open in summer months, just the odd sliding vent open in winter.

 

I am modelling a terminus station so perhaps I should at least have the guards window down, if not his door open. It would be hard to replicate the doors being open as the train slowed down to the buffers but a few droplights down even in winter on a train entering the station would look right.

 

But not necessarily one leaving, which reminds me of a time when I caught a train from Liverpool Street back to Chelmsford. I never use to catch the first one I could when I arrived at the station but the next or even the third if that was already in the station, so I had a seat. This particular very hot day the train home was a 312, I was one of the first passengers on board. Myself and another chap opened all the windows at our end of the coach before many others boarded so the journey home would be comfortable. Seconds before the guard blew his whistle on gets this geezer, suit and coat on, closes the drop light as he closed the door. He plonked himself next to me. Within seconds of the train starting to move he got up and closed the other windows, without asking the 30 so nearby passengers if that was OK. I reopened the droplight before Bethnal green. He slammed it shut. "I don't like drafts". For the rest of his journey he sat next to me in his smelly coat and suit with sweat beads on his forehead. When he got off at Shenfield there was a mass opening of the windows. How one person who seem oblivious to the fact it was a hot day make the journey of 30 odd other people physically uncomfortable and by his actions emotionally uncomfortable as it wasn't a day to be confrontational is beyond me. Thank goodness for modern trains having air conditioning, plus when modelling them you don't have to think about open windows.

 

This reminds me of a story I once read:

 

Two women were sitting opposite each other in a full compartment on a crowded train. They had the seats closest to the window and were having a heated argument about whether it should be open or closed.

"I want it closed, I'll catch my death of cold if it's open", said one.

"Open", said the other, "Or I'll suffocate in the stale air!"

The guard hears the ruckus and comes to investigate. Sadly, neither woman will compromise.

A retired Army Colonel has been quietly observing from an opposite corner of the compartment.

"Might I offer a solution?", he asks.

"Gladly", says the frustrated guard.

"Lock the window", says the Colonel, "And that will kill one of them. Then open it, that will kill the other. Then the rest of us might just be able to finish our journey in peace and quiet."

[MartynJPearson]

Not convinced that manufacturers avoid open windows on coaching stock due to spider and dust ingress, as a load of my diesel locos (such as Bachmann 47's) have open windows and I'm sure the creepy crawlies can't tell one from the other (if they did, would the restaurant car be their primary destination?). The argument of a rake looking too consistent seems more feasible.

[The White Rabbit]

Though if you're buying Bachmann's new coaches with passengers inside, the argument about repetition could apply to them too. Presumably if you are willing to build up a rake of similar coaches over time by buying different issues of the same model, with different running numbers and/or passengers inside, manufacturers could adopt a similar policy with windows.

 

The problem I see with this is it gives people too much choice: do you buy a (say) SK as weathered/pristine, with/without pasengers, with/without open windows etc.? By offering more choice you might expand the market for that particular model but I bet you wouldn't expand it enough to justify the extra costs in production to cover all the options. And you'd probably have to have consistency in a rake, otherwise the difference in appearance between coaches with/without passengers and/or closed/open windows would draw attention. 

[Phil Bullock]

How about aftermarket replacement glazing ?

 

Standard window sizes across the range - consistency avoided by random selection fo replacements

 

Phil

[caradoc]

I take it you've not been on the Merseyrail Electrics then. The OAPs are always slamming the windows because of the noise in the tunnels. Including ones that aren't even near them.

 

It's not just kids and teenagers that have no manners.

 

 

Jason

 

Jason, the problem with the 507 and 508 units (and other similar types such as 314, as  per my post #12) is not just the noise but also the howling gale which blows through the coach when the train gets up any speed ! Although I have to admit that I travelled on a Class 320 yesterday and was grateful that many of the hopper windows were open, given the unusually warm conditions. In an open coach there are bound to be some who want windows open and some who want them closed - Not sure how that can be reconciled ?

[DCB]

Modelling a few open windows can bring a model to life but it does need to be random.  Its one of the few things left which we can do quickly and easily to customise our models.  If they start making RTR with open windows you can be sure someone will write a piece on how to modify them to be modelled closed.  

[Mallard60022]

I had a client that would have no droplights semi open in his Comet Gresley builds as coaches never had their windows open in sidings in his world. 

Phil

Edited July 12, 2018 by Mallard60022

[The White Rabbit]

Modelling a few open windows can bring a model to life but it does need to be random.  Its one of the few things left which we can do quickly and easily to customise our models.   

 

Sorry it's houses rather than carriages, but hope this illustrates the point. There was a lot of potential repetition here, so it was a no-brainer to cut out some extra open sash windows from the Metcalfe window sheet and add some home-produced blinds and flower vase window assemblies. As you say, quick and easy modelling. On the actual model, when you view the other side, you can see some houses with open windows (and no curtains) are having a big wash day. 

[davknigh]

Geoff Kent did an article on scratchbuilding coaches out of styrene in MRJ 222. In it he shows ways of creating open windows that could easily be applied to kits and with a bit of imagination to RTR.

 

Cheers,

 

David

[muddy water]

MJT brass overlays for EMUs have some open window frames.

You just have to remember when you fit glazing strips to cut out the missing glass!!