Hitachi trains grounded

[Afroal05]

16 minutes ago, Coryton said:

I see that GWR are saying "As a result we have had to cancel a significant number of long-distance train services today, Monday 10 May, and expect disruption to continue into tomorrow, Tuesday 11 May.  "

 

While I'm sure that's true, given the current state of affairs it seems a bit of an understatement.

 

Like saying "More than one of our trains is out of service"

 

They do go on to say

"The problem continues to be investigated by Hitachi and once trains have been checked and cleared, we hope to be able to release them back into service as soon as possible. A further update will be provided in due course. "

but overall their phrasing - and the fact that journeys with tickets dated for this week can only be postponed until Sunday - would give me a very different idea of how long the disruption might last than the impression I get from reading this forum.

 

I don't know when the rhetoric will change but it probably ought to at some point. I suspect that PR will be last to hear about a lot of the plans as they keep changing. The plan and the route forward seems to change with every hour as new information emerges or another 800 is failed.

 

There are now only two units on the Reading - Newport circuits, 800006 and 009.

 

It is suggested each unit will take days to fix. If the fix can only be completed at heavy maintenance depots - North Pole and Stoke Gifford then that could clearly take a very long time to fix.

 

6 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

You don't air your dirty washing in public and nor do you over sell the impact as you don't know how quickly things may improve (or not).

 

PR is about saying enough to let the public know there is an issue, but not spelling out every last impact and certainly don't make promises you may not keep nor lose custom by stating things will be bad for weeks or months.  There will be timetable planning now being worked out to deliver a service, which may not be perfect but will get the public travelling with a less than optimal number of sets.

 

I'm inclined to agree although I think there is probably some middle ground between saying that there will be disruption for a few days which gives a false impression that everything will be right by the weekend and saying that it is the end of the world and don't bother getting a train this side of Christmas.

 

[Mike_Walker]

1 minute ago, Afroal05 said:

 

I don't know when the rhetoric will change but it probably ought to at some point. I suspect that PR will be last to hear about a lot of the plans as they keep changing. The plan and the route forward seems to change with every hour as new information emerges or another 800 is failed.

 

There are now only two units on the Reading - Newport circuits, 800006 and 009.

 

It is suggested each unit will take days to fix. If the fix can only be completed at heavy maintenance depots - North Pole and Stoke Gifford then that could clearly take a very long time to fix.

 

 

I'm inclined to agree although I think there is probably some middle ground between saying that there will be disruption for a few days which gives a false impression that everything will be right by the weekend and saying that it is the end of the world and don't bother getting a train this side of Christmas.

 

Which Christmas?

[Coryton]

25 minutes ago, Afroal05 said:

I'm inclined to agree although I think there is probably some middle ground between saying that there will be disruption for a few days which gives a false impression that everything will be right by the weekend and saying that it is the end of the world and don't bother getting a train this side of Christmas.

 

Quite. I'm sure there is a middle ground between what would appear to be unrealistic optimism and the pessimistic approach of saying it's going to be weeks or months.

 

I'm sure they will be planning how to provide a service of sorts this week. But unless I've fallen for a lot of incorrect doom-mongering it's not likely to be anything like a normal service on Wednesday.

 

Normally in my experience the rail industry isn't shy of looking more than a day ahead and predicting ongoing disruption.

 

Incidentally, to add to the fun there seems to have been disruption between Newport and Cardiff today due to overhead line damage. 

 

 

Edited May 10, 2021 by Coryton

[Ian Hargrave]

And so if there are only two of these things currently in service,does that mean that the rest of the “fleet” ( of how many ? ) are either waiting inspection or repairs ?  Be useful,if embarrassing ,to have numbers in each category.We are approaching the end of a National Lockdown but seemingly from Lands End to John O’ Groats we are replacing one tight restriction with another on our national rail network .Have freedom...can’t travel.

[Coryton]

6 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:

And so if there are only two of these things currently in service,does that mean that the rest of the “fleet” ( of how many ? ) are either waiting inspection or repairs ?  Be useful,if embarrassing ,to have numbers in each category.We are approaching the end of a National Lockdown but seemingly from Lands End to John O’ Groats we are replacing one tight restriction with another on our national rail network .Have freedom...can’t travel.

 

So it would seem and though I've lost track of everything I've read, the fact that LNER* appear to have inspected much of their fleet suggests that GWR* have already declared a fair number of units as either failed or requiring more detailed inspection.

 

It is also pretty clear that huge efforts are being made to restore as much service as possible, even though more limited than it should be even with a lockdown timetable and somewhat less convenient (e.g. normally through journeys requiring a change at Newport or Swindon, then again at Reading).

 

Although I've been critical of GWR communications (and initially what seemed like rather harsh rules on changing tickets) nothing I've seen has suggested that they are doing anything but the best they can to restore as much service as possible.

 

* Or rather Hitachi on their behalf

[woodenhead]

Question, now we have a quasi nationalised railway due to the Pandemic.

 

Can LNER lend GWR some 800s if GWR is more impacted than LNER, or are there incompatible signalling differences between the LNER and GWR cabs?

[Coryton]

2 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

Question, now we have a quasi nationalised railway due to the Pandemic.

 

Can LNER lend GWR some 800s if GWR is more impacted than LNER, or are there incompatible signalling differences between the LNER and GWR cabs?

 

ATP on the GWR but not LNER units?

[boxbrownie]

2 hours ago, RANGERS said:

Not sure that East Midlands Railway picked the best day to be launching the construction of their revolutionary new fleet of trains....

 

 

 

 

No problem, they just have to stick a few more blobs of ally weld on the brackets and it’ll all be fine 

[boxbrownie]

1 hour ago, Coryton said:

 

Well statements like "expect disruption to continue into tomorrow, Tuesday 11 May." would normally mean that they expect things to be pretty much back to normal on Wednesday.

 

Unless I'm being fed a lot of misinformation here, the chances of that are essentially zero and I don't see what's gained by giving the impression otherwise.

 

 

 

 

Just seen in the BBC news channel on the “flying banner” that GWR trains are expecting long delays to service for weeks.

 

That is on the BBC though.....

[Coryton]

1 hour ago, Coryton said:

 

Quite. I'm sure there is a middle ground between what would appear to be unrealistic optimism and the pessimistic approach of saying it's going to be weeks or months.

 

 

And now it's changed to: "As a result we have had to cancel a significant number of long-distance train services on Monday 10 May and disruption is expected to continue on Tuesday 11 May, and into the week." (my bold) which seems like a reasonable statement given what's known at present.

[Ian Hargrave]

2 minutes ago, boxbrownie said:

Just seen in the BBC news channel on the “flying banner” that GWR trains are expecting long delays to service for weeks.

 

That is on the BBC though.....

Given current situation updates,do we expect anything less ? Just in time for our new holiday season in the West Country and Wales. When,if ever,did we face such a situation as this on our rail system ? Oh hang on a minute,maybe during the long winter of 1947 when there was a shortage of practically everything.. But this is the 21stC. 
 

A consequence maybe of putting all our eggs in one basket ? What a mess.

[boxbrownie]

1 minute ago, Ian Hargrave said:

Given current situation updates,do we expect anything less ? Just in time for our new holiday season in the West Country and Wales. When,if ever,did we face such a situation as this on our rail system ? Oh hang on a minute,maybe during the long winter of 1947 when there was a shortage of practically everything.. But this is the 21stC. 
 

A consequence maybe of putting all our eggs in one basket ? What a mess.

Just changed to this now.....

 

I don’t think we should expect anything less no, but just information after reading on here they are saying for the next few days.  

[Coryton]

5 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:

Given current situation updates,do we expect anything less ? Just in time for our new holiday season in the West Country and Wales. When,if ever,did we face such a situation as this on our rail system ? Oh hang on a minute,maybe during the long winter of 1947 when there was a shortage of practically everything.. But this is the 21stC. 
 

A consequence maybe of putting all our eggs in one basket ? What a mess.

 

The speed reductions applied after the Hatfield crash were pretty disruptive and widespread.

[Dunsignalling]

1 hour ago, Ian Hargrave said:

And so if there are only two of these things currently in service,does that mean that the rest of the “fleet” ( of how many ? ) are either waiting inspection or repairs ?  Be useful,if embarrassing ,to have numbers in each category.We are approaching the end of a National Lockdown but seemingly from Lands End to John O’ Groats we are replacing one tight restriction with another on our national rail network .Have freedom...can’t travel.

Somewhere earlier in the thread there's a mention of GW running three out of a total of 93 sets.

 

In any event, should this take two or three months to sort out, I suspect Cornwall will be heaving this summer even if some of those who were planning to come by train stay away, Some might, but many more will use, or hire, a car instead.  

 

John

Edited May 10, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[meil]

I simply point out that aeroplanes are riveted, bolted or glued but not welded.

 

There was an aeroplane that was welded in part but managed to unstick itself on it's maiden flight - Hermes?

[Ian Hargrave]

2 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

Somewhere earlier in the thread there's a mention of GW running three out of a total of 93 sets.

 

John

Now apparently down to two 

[Ian Hargrave]

5 minutes ago, Coryton said:

 

The speed reductions applied after the Hatfield crash were pretty disruptive and widespread.

 
With the greatest respect....as widespread as this ?

[woodenhead]

Conspiracy theory: the trains are fine, the Government just don't want us all to jump on trains next weekend and go on holiday

[boxbrownie]

2 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

Conspiracy theory: the trains are fine, the Government just don't want us all to jump on trains next weekend and go on holiday

Nailed it......

[Fat Controller]

1 minute ago, Ian Hargrave said:

 
With the greatest respect....as widespread as this ?

Yes, as Railtrack's records of which rail had been  used where were apparently less that comprehensive. I was at work that day, and very glad our rail had come from different suppliers. Apart from the areas where services were suspended, there were draconian speed restrictions network-wide: that's something that's harder to plan for than a simple suspension of services.

[Coryton]

9 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:

 
With the greatest respect....as widespread as this ?

 

I would say so, yes. Here we're dealing almost entirely with long distance services running out of two London termini. The post-Hatfield speed restrictions were spread across much more of the UK than that and affected local as well as long distance services.

 

The impact on each route was undoubtedly less than what we're currently seeing on GWR, but there were some pretty significant reductions in services.

[caradoc]

16 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:

With the greatest respect....as widespread as this ?

 

Yes ! I was night shift in Glasgow Control shortly after the accident when our Route Director decreed that the WCML from the Route boundary north of Gretna to Carstairs was to shut at 0800 the next morning for GCC checks - No leeway was permitted. Somehow it was left to me to advise the affected train operators and many trains, freight especially, started their journeys with no hope of beating the deadline. Eventually I had to instruct Carlisle PSB not to send any further trains down the WCML and stable them wherever they could - they were not exactly pleased.

 

And whereas on the night shift we might normally get one or two emergency speed restrictions imposed, now we got ten a night. The whole sorry business had a devastating effect on the railway and, among other things, contributed greatly to rail almost totally losing the Royal Mail traffic. 

 

[rab]

Local paper excels again:

 

https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/plymouth-news/no-indication-great-western-railway-5394671

 

Can't even get a picture of the right train.

 

How long before the rumour starts that

HST's are also affected!!!

[Coryton]

23 minutes ago, rab said:

How long before the rumour starts that

HST's are also affected!!!

 

You've just started it now!

[stewartingram]

22 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said:

These bendy-buses are amazing 

Nope. Rear engine d/d - don't know which variety though.

 

Stewart