Driving standards

[Compound2632]

Just now, Pete the Elaner said:

I agree. Sometimes drivers seen hesitant to pass but occasionally I've been aware of holding others up so pull in to a layby or similar. The reactions I get shows this is appreciated.

 

There's hesitancy to pass; there's also being on a winding road with or without double white lines down the middle. 

 

The unfortunate truth is that the more aggressive sort of driver will take risks and / or break the law to get past the cyclist(s) in such circumstances; that does no-one any good, least of all the innocent fellow coming the other way.

[Enterprisingwestern]

 

The one thing I don't understand about (some) cyclists is their willingness to put themselves in danger unnecessarily.

A case in point being the (quite right and understandable) requirement for cars to give 1.5m gap when overtaking a cyclist, but at the next hold up/traffic lights they cycle down the inside of you paying no heed to the 1.5m gap, then wobble off keeping pace at the side of you.

 

Mike.

[Pete the Elaner]

5 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

There's hesitancy to pass; there's also being on a winding road with or without double white lines down the middle. 

 

The unfortunate truth is that the more aggressive sort of driver will take risks and / or break the law to get past the cyclist(s) in such circumstances; that does no-one any good, least of all the innocent fellow coming the other way.

 

I get to see both extremes quite regularly.

[Pete the Elaner]

11 minutes ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

The one thing I don't understand about (some) cyclists is their willingness to put themselves in danger unnecessarily.

A case in point being the (quite right and understandable) requirement for cars to give 1.5m gap when overtaking a cyclist, but at the next hold up/traffic lights they cycle down the inside of you paying no heed to the 1.5m gap, then wobble off keeping pace at the side of you.

 

Mike.

 

Many seem to have a 1-way attitude of "It is my right, so I shall do it".

I don't understand this. Car occupants have the protection of a big metal box.

 

Cars also have blind spots. Vans & lorries have worse ones. Technically it is the driver's responsibility to cope with these, but a technicality doesn't help someone once they have been knocked off, or worse. If I pass through a blind spot quite closely, I can easily be missed & the car will not need to move very much to knock me off.

I don't usually want to be too close to the kerb in the debris either. That is the puncture zone.

[PhilJ W]

I've seen a truck with an arm* connected to the indicators that opens out like the old semaphore indicators that is intended to prevent cyclists and others going down the nearside of the truck. I have also seen a cyclist bend such an arm and continue down the nearside of the truck. Fortunately so did a police officer. *Also a warning notice telling cyclists not to go down the nearside of the vehicle.

[Nick C]

1 hour ago, Pete the Elaner said:

Many seem to have a 1-way attitude of "It is my right, so I shall do it".

I don't understand this. Car occupants have the protection of a big metal box.

Or just a general lack of awareness or consideration for their own safety. I saw one cyclist when I was on the way home from work yesterday - at dusk, he was wearing all black, had no lights, and was texting, using both hands. Why take such risks? If I cycle at night (which, admittedly, I've not done for a long time), it's with nice bright lights and a hi-viz jacket to make sure I can be seen.

 

No point being 'right' if you're dead...

[Pete the Elaner]

12 minutes ago, Nick C said:

Or just a general lack of awareness or consideration for their own safety. I saw one cyclist when I was on the way home from work yesterday - at dusk, he was wearing all black, had no lights, and was texting, using both hands. Why take such risks? If I cycle at night (which, admittedly, I've not done for a long time), it's with nice bright lights and a hi-viz jacket to make sure I can be seen.

 

No point being 'right' if you're dead...

 

I completely agree.

There is a lot of fuss about using mobiles while driving & rightly so. What difference is cycling?

No lights when it is dark is an annoyance. There are 2 types of light. Those which allow you to see, which are often expensive, & another which allow you to be seen, which are cheap.

The argument about wearing dark has always baffled me. I have heard many argue that it bright daylight, dark colours are easier to see than bright ones. Somebody even tried to argue this by quoting an article (which actually contradicted him). Why even read an article when we can use our own eyes to judge it.

If I am buying cycling clothes or ones which I may wear while on a bike, why pick dark when there is a bright alternative?

[mezzoman253]

Yesterday on the way to my Covid booster. Old guy on a bicycle approaching the main road(which I'm on) from the left. Double hatched lines for him to stop at. No just comes straighout and luckily I miss him. On the way back 2 kids on electric scooters crossing the road at an island by a mini roundabout. I expect them to just rush across, which they do. I have to brake on the roundabout and nearly get rear ended by the car behind. Then an older lady jogging, not facing the oncoming traffic and in the road. There's pavement on the other side. I have to slow right down as we're approaching a blind bend and can't safetly overtake. Eventually I pass her on a clear bit of road after the bend. She has ear buds in and is totally unaware of me and the crocodile now formed.

 

Rob

 

 

Edited October 7, 2022 by mezzoman253

[Nick C]

8 minutes ago, Pete the Elaner said:

 

I completely agree.

There is a lot of fuss about using mobiles while driving & rightly so. What difference is cycling?

No lights when it is dark is an annoyance. There are 2 types of light. Those which allow you to see, which are often expensive, & another which allow you to be seen, which are cheap.

The argument about wearing dark has always baffled me. I have heard many argue that it bright daylight, dark colours are easier to see than bright ones. Somebody even tried to argue this by quoting an article (which actually contradicted him). Why even read an article when we can use our own eyes to judge it.

If I am buying cycling clothes or ones which I may wear while on a bike, why pick dark when there is a bright alternative?

If dark colours were easier to see in bright daylight, then the many and various PPE requirements (such as ROGS for the railway industry) would specify it, rather than the day-glo orange or yellow that they actually require...

[Enterprisingwestern]

29 minutes ago, Nick C said:

If dark colours were easier to see in bright daylight, then the many and various PPE requirements (such as ROGS for the railway industry) would specify it, rather than the day-glo orange or yellow that they actually require..

 

Stop letting facts and common sense get in the way of these guerilla cyclists!

 

Mike.

[kevinlms]

On 08/10/2022 at 01:16, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

Stop letting facts and common sense get in the way of these guerilla cyclists!

 

Mike.

But it's their RIGHT to be stupid, have you learnt nothing during Covid?

[Reorte]

On 07/10/2022 at 14:33, Pete the Elaner said:

If I am buying cycling clothes or ones which I may wear while on a bike, why pick dark when there is a bright alternative?

 

Can't say I'd do that personally. Someone who fails to notice you (note notice, rather than see) will do so regardless, if it's light. If it's not light then you should have lights on the bike anyway, and the same applies if you do. I've a reflective sash I'll wear if I need to cycle in the dark too though.

 

[Flying Pig]

2 hours ago, Reorte said:

If it's not light then you should have lights on the bike anyway,

 

Lights will get you noticed at a distance which is important in light traffic where you aren't iluminated by other vehicles' headlights.  However, they won't give drivers much idea of how far away you are, because they give no information about your size.  They can also be lost amongst the other lights in heavy traffic.  My experience as a driver is that it is much easier to deal safely with a cyclist wearing hi-viz in the dark.

[Reorte]

38 minutes ago, Flying Pig said:

 

Lights will get you noticed at a distance which is important in light traffic where you aren't iluminated by other vehicles' headlights.  However, they won't give drivers much idea of how far away you are, because they give no information about your size.  They can also be lost amongst the other lights in heavy traffic.  My experience as a driver is that it is much easier to deal safely with a cyclist wearing hi-viz in the dark.

That's what the reflective sash is for.

[ejstubbs]

 

[PhilJ W]

When I went out this morning there was a car stopped on the A13 at the Pitsea flyover, it was a BMW fitted with low profile tyres. The tread of the O/S rear tyre had become completely detached from the tyre sidewalls. The driver had successfully brought the car to a stop with the tread and bits of rubber strewn across the road. 

[boxbrownie]

13 hours ago, PhilJ W said:

When I went out this morning there was a car stopped on the A13 at the Pitsea flyover, it was a BMW fitted with low profile tyres. The tread of the O/S rear tyre had become completely detached from the tyre sidewalls. The driver had successfully brought the car to a stop with the tread and bits of rubber strewn across the road. 

Was it a new(ish) vehicle or a few years old?

 

If it was older it could have had cheap “re-engineered” tyres.

[Fat Controller]

47 minutes ago, boxbrownie said:

Was it a new(ish) vehicle or a few years old?

 

If it was older it could have had cheap “re-engineered” tyres.

In his latter years, when health precluded driving, the garage fitted the Cresta with these tyres, on the basis the car wasn't used between annual MoTs. This was fine, until dad gave up driving entirely, and presented me with the beast; he omitted to tell me (or was perhaps unaware) of the cheap tyres, and so I was unaware of the speed restriction on them. I discovered it during a trip down the A1; the front treads detached, taking the headlight wire harness with them, just north of Newark.

[boxbrownie]

20 minutes ago, Fat Controller said:

In his latter years, when health precluded driving, the garage fitted the Cresta with these tyres, on the basis the car wasn't used between annual MoTs. This was fine, until dad gave up driving entirely, and presented me with the beast; he omitted to tell me (or was perhaps unaware) of the cheap tyres, and so I was unaware of the speed restriction on them. I discovered it during a trip down the A1; the front treads detached, taking the headlight wire harness with them, just north of Newark.

Yikes……good job the seats were vinyl 🫣

[Pete the Elaner]

On 08/10/2022 at 23:35, Reorte said:

 

Can't say I'd do that personally. Someone who fails to notice you (note notice, rather than see) will do so regardless, if it's light. If it's not light then you should have lights on the bike anyway, and the same applies if you do. I've a reflective sash I'll wear if I need to cycle in the dark too though.

 

 

Not quite. I have a good example too:

A while back, I was cycling along a country road by a cyclist wearing brown. He did not get very far before he blended in with the background, the hedge which was lining the road. A bright colour would have made him much more obvious & to any approaching car, faster to recognise as a cyclist.

 

Roadside & trackside workers are required to wear bright colours, not just clothing with a reflective strip. This is not just some sort of uniform. It is to allow them to be seen earlier & more easily.

[PhilJ W]

2 hours ago, boxbrownie said:

Was it a new(ish) vehicle or a few years old?

 

If it was older it could have had cheap “re-engineered” tyres.

It looked quite new, a white BMW, I couldn't see the registration. It did appear that the tyre walls were still attached to the wheels. 

[eastglosmog]

11 minutes ago, Pete the Elaner said:

 

Not quite. I have a good example too:

A while back, I was cycling along a country road by a cyclist wearing brown. He did not get very far before he blended in with the background, the hedge which was lining the road. A bright colour would have made him much more obvious & to any approaching car, faster to recognise as a cyclist.

 

Roadside & trackside workers are required to wear bright colours, not just clothing with a reflective strip. This is not just some sort of uniform. It is to allow them to be seen earlier & more easily.

As an illustration, as happened last Saturday.  Bright sunlit road suddenly going into dark shadow under overhanging tree canopy.  Cyclist totally invisible, except for the high viz vest he was wearing.

[PhilJ W]

Even the (so called) professionals get it wrong.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-63290908?at_custom1=[post+type]&at_campaign=64&at_custom3=bbc_wales_news&at_custom4=1F574B6C-4E4E-11ED-8375-1FB6923C408C&at_medium=custom7&at_custom2=facebook_page&fbclid=IwAR1MgedbJWs8MijAcn0L75ZcKDmdUDyu8UazQKCimXW8-bSZpqd1D3kseCs

[Reorte]

10 hours ago, eastglosmog said:

As an illustration, as happened last Saturday.  Bright sunlit road suddenly going into dark shadow under overhanging tree canopy.  Cyclist totally invisible, except for the high viz vest he was wearing.

I'd be worried about the sight of anyone driving who finds that "totally invisible." Yes, such contrasts can make things harder to see but it should not be impossible.  Otherwise who knows what else might be there? In to the back of a parked car?

[PhilJ W]

18 hours ago, eastglosmog said:

As an illustration, as happened last Saturday.  Bright sunlit road suddenly going into dark shadow under overhanging tree canopy.  Cyclist totally invisible, except for the high viz vest he was wearing.

The local council has replaced most of the street lights with LED lights. For all their advantages one problem is that they cast deep shadows. A pedestrian or cyclist wearing dark clothing is virtually invisible in those shadows, it's only when they move that you know they are there.