PECO Announces Bullhead Track for OO

[coachmann]

Peco bullhead track has thick sleepers as per Peco Streamline code 75 track. C+L  hi-sleeper flexible track matches it.

 

DCC Concepts flexible track has thin sleepers  (as does SMP) but is unique in having stainless steel rail.

 

A purely personal viewpoint is I don't like the stainless steel rail (A) It is not the easiest to solder wires to...(B) It is barely held in place by the chairs and ( C) Forget cutting it with a saw.......It is difficult enough with purpose-made Exuron cutters and has a tendency to twist if not held firmly by pliers.  My goods yard needs relaying and no way will I replace the DCC Concepts track with further DCC track despite having it in stock.

Edited July 6, 2017 by coachmann

[martin_wynne]

 it sounds like Peco bullhead could be just what I'm after, but I've only recently heard about it and didn't know that it was already available. I must admit it's difficult to get a simple summary from this thread, so if anyone is able to link to or re-confirm the key details that would be helpful. I guess there aren't any matching points yet? How does it compare with DCC concepts track?

 

Code 75 nickel-siver bullhead rail. Neat rail joiners/fishplates are available. Full chair detail, modified to clear 00 wheel flanges. Sleepers at UK 00 size and spacing. Thick sleepers to match up with their existing code 75 track.  No turnouts yet, they will match the existing Streamline geometry. First (large radius) expected/promised some time this year.

 

DCC Concepts track uses stainless steel rail instead of nickel-silver, and thin sleepers. Matching turnouts promised, using prototype geometry, but they have gone quiet on these lately.

 

edit: Snap!

 

Martin. 

Edited July 6, 2017 by martin_wynne

[martin_wynne]

Peco info: click image to see in better quality.

 

© PECO / Railway Modeller

 

Martin.

[Adrock]

Excellent, thanks both. That's my decision made then! And I can use my existing code 100 flexi track and streamline point work in the storage yards, which is even better.

[Roy Langridge]

Excellent, thanks both. That's my decision made then! And I can use my existing code 100 flexi track and streamline point work in the storage yards, which is even better.

If you pick up the latest ModelRail magazine, there is an article where they have used this track and it nicely shows the fishplates etc. Pages 45-51.

 

Roy

[Crewlisle]

I'm new to this thread and am looking to source some 00 gauge track for my next layout project. Having been away from building for a couple of years, it sounds like Peco bullhead could be just what I'm after, but I've only recently heard about it and didn't know that it was already available. I must admit it's difficult to get a simple summary from this thread, so if anyone is able to link to or re-confirm the key details that would be helpful. I guess there aren't any matching points yet? How does it compare with DCC concepts track?

 

Thanks

 

Peco bullhead track has thick sleepers as per Peco Streamline code 75 track. C+L  hi-sleeper flexible track matches it.

 

DCC Concepts flexible track has thin sleepers  (as does SMP) but is unique in having stainless steel rail.

 

A purely personal viewpoint is I don't like the stainless steel rail (A) It is not the easiest to solder wires to...(B) It is barely held in place by the chairs and ( C) Forget cutting it with a saw.......It is difficult enough with purpose-made Exuron cutters and has a tendency to twist if not held firmly by pliers.  My goods yard needs relaying and no way will I replace the DCC Concepts track with further DCC track despite having it in stock.

 

Code 75 nickel-siver bullhead rail. Neat rail joiners/fishplates are available. Full chair detail, modified to clear 00 wheel flanges. Sleepers at UK 00 size and spacing. Thick sleepers to match up with their existing code 75 track.  No turnouts yet, they will match the existing Streamline geometry. First (large radius) expected/promised some time this year.

 

DCC Concepts track uses stainless steel rail instead of nickel-silver, and thin sleepers. Matching turnouts promised, using prototype geometry, but they have gone quiet on these lately.

 

edit: Snap!

 

Martin. 

 

These three comments make all the 2627 previous comments a waste of space on this forum for all the nit pickers out there!  They answer all the questions that the average modeller would ask.

 

90% of the modellers who want to use bullhead rail will be more than satisfied what Peco is offering.  This is about the same proportion as the percentage of modellers who are more than happy with the best track system on the UK market including all their point work which can be used straight out of the box with no modifications.  I can vouch for their reliability after using Peco track & point work for over 40 years (30 years on the exhibition circuit) & being DCC for the last 10 years.  The only polarity switching on my layout with 30 points is on my live diamond - no frog juicers & no polarity switching via point motors.  The number of failures over this time I can count on one hand; then they were only on sidings.

 

If you want perfection, build your own!  Then again, many critics of anything can only criticise & not have the skills to do anything about it.

 

Peter

[mightbe]

Then again, many critics of anything can only criticise & not have the skills to do anything about it.

 

Peter

 

I was with you up to here. It's worth noting that many of the most active participants in this thread are seasoned track builders in their own right, with invaluable knowledge and experience. 

 

In any case the discussion has been infinitely more interesting than the press releases themselves.

 

Quentin

[Kiwi]

I was with you up to here. It's worth noting that many of the most active participants in this thread are seasoned track builders in their own right, with invaluable knowledge and experience

This is true. But some of them also like to remind us of that a tad too often.

[Ian_H]

I quite enjoyed it when it went of topic, if anybodies interested I going to wash the car now, or maybe I won't  

Edited July 8, 2017 by Ian_H

[hayfield]

These three comments make all the 2627 previous comments a waste of space on this forum for all the nit pickers out there!  They answer all the questions that the average modeller would ask.

 

90% of the modellers who want to use bullhead rail will be more than satisfied what Peco is offering.  This is about the same proportion as the percentage of modellers who are more than happy with the best track system on the UK market including all their point work which can be used straight out of the box with no modifications.  I can vouch for their reliability after using Peco track & point work for over 40 years (30 years on the exhibition circuit) & being DCC for the last 10 years.  The only polarity switching on my layout with 30 points is on my live diamond - no frog juicers & no polarity switching via point motors.  The number of failures over this time I can count on one hand; then they were only on sidings.

 

If you want perfection, build your own!  Then again, many critics of anything can only criticise & not have the skills to do anything about it.

 

Peter

 

 

Peter

 

I would echo your points that the Peco track system is of high quality, reliable and easy to use. They also cleverly designed an interchangeable system of turnouts and crossings which is simplicity itself. The major problem with the introduction of the "Streamline" range was that they moved from 4mm scale to 3.5 mm scale. There is also a minor issue in the trade off for a fully interchangeable system is that they deviated from the normal geometry, and for production purposes they used flatbottom rail. You could call these latter two points nit picking

 

The hobby has moved on from the initial introduction of the "Streamline" range in the 50's. If you now look at the quality and range of the ready to run market, its chalk and cheese from what was available 60+ years ago. Modellers would not put up with either H0 scale models or models where the main dimensions have been compromised to fit an existing chassis, or one where major details have been omitted.

 

Manufacturers now have a more discerning customer, who now has woken up (belatedly) to the lack of track to the same quality in appearance to the stock and buildings now available as standard, there is a growing number of modellers expecting this void to be fulfilled and expectations are running high, lets face it the modern RTR loco is built to a detail standard only achievable previously by the best of scratch builders. They are rightly expecting a track system to become available to these standards. Is this nit picking or expecting the same quality applied to a track system as it is to rolling stock

 

Do not forget the original Peco system "Indvidulay" was track building components for both plain track and turnouts, using bullhead rail to 4mm scale. Pressure (and competition) needs to be applied to the manufacturers to ensure products are up to modern day standards. Having said that some may prefer the scaling down of the model to match the narrower gauge, not an issue, likewise others may prefer the larger code 100 product.

 

I for one look forward to a 4 mm scale product using both bullhead rail and chairs, the compromise quite rightly will be the geometry to allow the ease of building track formations (I would expect crossings and slips will follow quickly). Lets face it its a great marketing opportunity that Peco is building for itself  Well done and good luck to them

Edited July 8, 2017 by hayfield

[unklian]

 So has anyone actually managed to buy any yet.......??

[chris p bacon]

 So has anyone actually managed to buy any yet.......??

 

If you look back through the posts there are some that have purchased and used the bullhead track.

 

There are no turnouts available yet.

[unklian]

If you look back through the posts there are some that have purchased and used the bullhead track.

 

There are no turnouts available yet.

 

 Really ? I have looked back through most of the posts and it all seems to be speculation about what the track will be like. Only the post #2631 says anything about anyone using it and that is a magazine article . Sorry if I have missed something but where exactly are these posts please ?

 

PS I have searched else where and found the BH track for sale, but not on Pecos own website !!

Edited July 8, 2017 by unklian

[Nick G]

 So has anyone actually managed to buy any yet.......??

 

 

Yes, I bought some from my local model shop yesterday.

[unklian]

Yes, I bought some from my local model shop yesterday.

 

 Thank you Nick, I will be hot footing it down to my local emporium on Monday, and see if they have some .

 

 

and PS apologies to Chris P Bacon I finally found when it went on sale back in February and page 89 of this thread !

Edited July 8, 2017 by unklian

[Nick G]

The fishplates are rather nice too, they have the raised bolt heads on them. PECO STREAMLINE SL-114 RAIL JOINERS

[HillsideDepot]

Here's some on my Drew's Sidings layout:

Front and rear tracks, with modified "Bi-Block" track in the middle. I like it, can accept the compromises, and am looking forward to seeing the Bullhead point work.

[hayfield]

Here's some on my Drew's Sidings layout:

Front and rear tracks, with modified "Bi-Block" track in the middle. I like it, can accept the compromises, and am looking forward to seeing the Bullhead point work.

 

The spacing of the sleepers and chair detail make it look so much better than the H0 streamline previously available, I guess it was only 2 or 3 years ago when many were saying this was a waste of time and effort, how things change

[HillsideDepot]

The spacing of the sleepers and chair detail make it look so much better than the H0 streamline previously available, I guess it was only 2 or 3 years ago when many were saying this was a waste of time and effort, how things change

Yes, it does look much better, for those very reasons. I should add that the sleeper spacing on the Bi-Block has been altered to approximate that of the Bullhead as the two together really show up the difference. 

[autocoach]

I've never heard my American pal refer to them in any other way but switches, or sometimes points (maybe he has been here for to many years?).

 

When we have an operating sesh, I am often appointed by him to be the switchman.

 

I don't ever recall him calling me a turnoutsman.

Going back through this thread I spotted the above.

 

On US (as opposed to Canadian/Mexican) railroads, in particular western lines,  I recall it was the head (riding in the cab or tender dog house) or rear brakeman (riding in the caboose) on a train who aligned the rails on a switch beyond the yard limits of a very large yard. The action of "bending iron" has disappeared from the main except in emergency as most mainline as opposed to industrial switches are now electronically controlled (see very large Tortoise or Cobalt machines life imitates modeling). Industrial or local switching still requires the brakeman (only one in the cab of modern diesels) to have the local key to unlock the manual switch and throw it (bending iron). 

 

The above has nothing to do with Bullhead Rail of course. I was just checking on the latest on delivery dates rumored in this topic to see if Christine Hatton could deliver my first set of Peco bullhead turnouts on her US odyssey next month to meet US customers.  As it stands the answer is no.

Edited July 11, 2017 by autocoach

[martin_wynne]

I've never heard my American pal refer to them in any other way but switches, or sometimes points (maybe he has been here for to many years?).

 

When we have an operating sesh, I am often appointed by him to be the switchman.

 

I don't ever recall him calling me a turnoutsman.

 

The switch is the part of a turnout with the moving points. So if you operate them, you are indeed the switchman.

 

If you were the turnoutsman, what you gonna do when you get to a slip?

 

 

Martin.

[bertiedog]

The spacing of the sleepers and chair detail make it look so much better than the H0 streamline previously available, I guess it was only 2 or 3 years ago when many were saying this was a waste of time and effort, how things change

With respect this was all raised by myself and others nearly 50 years ago personally with Mr Pritchard, who stated he was forced to do things that people would buy, it was too financially risky to move to finer standards whilst the rolling stock makers all used their own types of wheels. It is still not an area where real standards exist and are actually used. However they are close enough now to justify the existing code 75, and the forthcoming code 75 bullhead points.

 

Stephen

[AndyID]

With respect this was all raised by myself and others nearly 50 years ago personally with Mr Pritchard, who stated he was forced to do things that people would buy, it was too financially risky to move to finer standards whilst the rolling stock makers all used their own types of wheels. It is still not an area where real standards exist and are actually used. However they are close enough now to justify the existing code 75, and the forthcoming code 75 bullhead points.

 

Stephen

 

Looks like John (Hayfield) was referring to the sleeper spacing and chair detail. That doesn't have much to do with rail height. Peco could have produced 00 track with Code 100 rail fifty years ago and it would have been just as compatible with wheels as their H0 product range.

 

I can't imagine Peco didn't consider doing that but I'm sure they had their reasons. In any event as they now have a substantial share of the World market it doesn't seem to have been a bad decision.

[hayfield]

Looks like John (Hayfield) was referring to the sleeper spacing and chair detail. That doesn't have much to do with rail height. Peco could have produced 00 track with Code 100 rail fifty years ago and it would have been just as compatible with wheels as their H0 product range.

 

I can't imagine Peco didn't consider doing that but I'm sure they had their reasons. In any event as they now have a substantial share of the World market it doesn't seem to have been a bad decision.

 

 

Andy

 

You are correct that I was referring to the sleeper spacing and as I have mentioned prior to Peco introducing the Streamline system they had an 00 scale track system. Looking back at the competition when Streamline was introduced, Peco went the H0 route, GEM and Farish (Formway) stayed with 00

 

Rail height had to be code 100 right up to the 80's with the Hornby (Triang) wheels being so coarse and the Lima pizza cutter wheels, with the advent of Airfix (GMR) and Mainline wheel standards improved and a move to code 75 was forced on to Peco loosing sales to SMP and C&L

 

Standards is another topic, sadly there seems to be no one group who will organise a set of standards which the manufacturers will take heed of, though on the whole manufacturers seem to be getting closer to each other. We wait and see what Peco come up with in the new turnouts they are producing, but I guess with the hobby mainly made up with older folk they will want to run the widest range of stock (both old and new) with the exception of the stock with the coarsest wheels.

 

When we saw the introduction of the Airfix GMR range we had no idea it would lead to explosion of quality and range of rolling stock now available, perhaps the same will happen to track over the next 40 years

[BlackRat]

The switch is the part of a turnout with the moving points. So if you operate them, you are indeed the switchman.

 

If you were the turnoutsman, what you gonna do when you get to a slip?

 

 

Martin.

Become the driver......!