Which Flying Scotsman?

[Tiddles47]

5 minutes ago, Hilux5972 said:

Pegler refitted the single chimney when he bought her. 

Yes I know that but thats all (except the tender swap) 

[Chamby]

This might help the discussion:

 

 

Top:  R 3437 Firdaussi, with gloss Apple Green finish, an A3 in mid-1930's condition:  banjo dome and high sided, non-streamlined tender.  Left hand drive, as it was built as an A3 from new.  Large cab cut-outs.

Middle:  R 3627 Flying Scotsman, in 1950 condition with BR blue satin finish, streamlined dome and streamlined, non-corridor tender.  Right hand drive (she was originally built as an A1) and with the small cab cut-outs.  She was converted to left hand drive in the early 50's.

Bottom, R 3081 Flying Scotsman, the NRM collection model, by now with left hand drive, streamlined corridor tender, electrification warning flashes, double chimney and smoke deflectors.

 

The original banjo dome was superseded by the streamlined dome on A3's, and to my knowledge was never carried by 4472/60103.  The differences between the tenders are not huge, and could be remodelled with a little care.

 

And for completeness:

 

 

This one is a hybrid:  Hornby's R3132 Book Law (body), renumbered/relettered as Prince Of Wales in 1949 condition, converted to RHD.  With GNR railed tender, swopped from R3518 Gay Crusader.  The round dome was carried by A1's and some A3 boilers into BR days, Flying Scotsman carried one until 1947, I believe.  60054 still needs to have the large cab cut-out converted to the small one.

 

Not shown:  smokebox without the rectangular panels, as Flying Scotsman would have had before her conversion to A3 in 1947.

 

Phil.

[JamieR4489]

22 hours ago, Ribird said:

I’ll just stick with a Royal Lancer and deal it not having the right tender. If they make one later, I’ll swap tenders.

Also, Royal Lancer is in GNR condition, i.e. it's got no bufferbeam cutouts, higher saftey valves, chimney and cab roof ventilator and short travel valves. I'm not sure when these features were modified to suit the LNER loading gauge.

[Ribird]

3 hours ago, JamieR4489 said:

Also, Royal Lancer is in GNR condition, i.e. it's got no bufferbeam cutouts, higher saftey valves, chimney and cab roof ventilator and short travel valves. I'm not sure when these features were modified to suit the LNER loading gauge.

They were, just remembered that but didn’t notice it on the model. Back to square one, just have to wait for the right model release.

[atom3624]

A lot of good discussion points and information here.

 

Thanks guys.

 

Al.

[Ribird]

 Bringing this topic up again, what would be a good A1/A3 for a 1942 condition that is not in wartime colors (doesn’t have to be Flying Scotsman)

 

What would be a good place to look up old photos of engines during that period?

[Chamby]

On 02/05/2019 at 03:59, Ribird said:

 Bringing this topic up again, what would be a good A1/A3 for a 1942 condition that is not in wartime colors (doesn’t have to be Flying Scotsman)

 

What would be a good place to look up old photos of engines during that period?

 

R3439 Woolwinder for an A1.  Gloss finish can be toned down with satin or Matt varnish.

R3518 Gay Crusader for a RHD A3, if you are prepared to rename/renumber in pre-1946 style shaded font.

 

Yeadon’s register, volume 1 is an excellent reference source for understanding the evolution of the A1 and A3 locomotives over time.

[Going2theDogs]

Hi All,

I have arrived late to this discussion.

What about the Flying Scotsman in BR green?

i know the one shown below is era 11 (& I am unsure when the German smoke deflectors were fitted, but I am sure someone on here can advise). Removal of the warning flashes would of course have to be done to make a potential candidate if you are flexible on the double chimney etc.

Unless  of course Hornby have provided this previously in a 1960's condition - I recall a weathered version a few years back.....

 

[Tiddles47]

24 minutes ago, CB Rail said:

Hi All,

I have arrived late to this discussion.

What about the Flying Scotsman in BR green?

i know the one shown below is era 11 (& I am unsure when the German smoke deflectors were fitted, but I am sure someone on here can advise). Removal of the warning flashes would of course have to be done to make a potential candidate if you are flexible on the double chimney etc.

Unless  of course Hornby have provided this previously in a 1960's condition - I recall a weathered version a few years back.....

 

The version shown is as she is now hence modern warning flashes and corridor tender. Hornby have done 60103 in weathered late BR condition with non corridor tender. The deflectors were added in early 1961 and removed on preservation in 1963 ,then again in preservation in 1993 -1995 and 2000 onwards (minus the time for lengthy overhaul)

[Hilux5972]

4 hours ago, CB Rail said:

Hi All,

I have arrived late to this discussion.

What about the Flying Scotsman in BR green?

i know the one shown below is era 11 (& I am unsure when the German smoke deflectors were fitted, but I am sure someone on here can advise). Removal of the warning flashes would of course have to be done to make a potential candidate if you are flexible on the double chimney etc.

Unless  of course Hornby have provided this previously in a 1960's condition - I recall a weathered version a few years back.....

 

He did say 1942 condition. 

[Going2theDogs]

Hi Hilux5972,

Thanks for the feedback.

Reading Garry’s original post he said ‘around 1970’s - 1980’s’.

I know the BR green was more applicable to the 1960’s & the Hornby weathered version was based on 1963 (so still a little out of the requested time line).

A little modellers license could always be applied if the inclination took him.... 

 

[Going2theDogs]

Apologies Hilux5972

i have just read Ribird post for the 1942 variant later on.

I was responding to the original post from Garry.

sorry for any confusion.

[sncf231e]

For those interested in pictures of models of A3's (and A4's), you might take a look in my free downloadable e-book on LNER Pacifics models: http://sncf231e.nl/lner-pacifics-and-nyc-hudsons/

Regards

Fred

[railroadbill]

7 hours ago, sncf231e said:

For those interested in pictures of models of A3's (and A4's), you might take a look in my free downloadable e-book on LNER Pacifics models: http://sncf231e.nl/lner-pacifics-and-nyc-hudsons/

Regards

Fred

Thanks Fred, very interesting, you have quite a collection!   (Those Aster locos are really  )

[Ribird]

On ‎05‎/‎05‎/‎2019 at 03:58, Chamby said:

 

R3439 Woolwinder for an A1.  Gloss finish can be toned down with satin or Matt varnish.

R3518 Gay Crusader for a RHD A3, if you are prepared to rename/renumber in pre-1946 style shaded font.

 

Yeadon’s register, volume 1 is an excellent reference source for understanding the evolution of the A1 and A3 locomotives over time.

Ok, I have to ask what is RHD?

 

Where would one fine Yeadon's register?

[Hilux5972]

2 hours ago, Ribird said:

Ok, I have to ask what is RHD?

 

Where would one fine Yeadon's register?

RHD is Right Hand Drive. 

[Chamby]

5 hours ago, Ribird said:

Ok, I have to ask what is RHD?

 

Where would one fine Yeadon's register?

 

Yes, RHD means Right Hand Drive.  Externally the most obvious difference is that the reversing lever and the ejector pipe (runs parallel to the boiler handrail) are on the drivers side.  A1’s were originally built as right hand drive, then converted to left hand drive in the 1950’s.  They were all converted to A3’s before this time, so a RHD A3 is one that was originally an A1, after conversion to A3 but before Conversion to LHD.  Examples include Flying Scotsman and Gay Crusader at nationalisation.  Later members of the class were built as A3’s from new, and were only ever left hand drive.

 

Yeadons Register is a large series of books featuring details of each class of LNER locomotives.  Volume 1 covers the A1/A3 class.  It gives details of dates, rebuilds, boiler and tender details, conversion dates etc for the full class, plus illustrative photographs of detail differences throughout the history of the class, including renumbering dates.  If you want to model an individual locomotive at a specific point in time, it is a most helpful guide.  Yeadons guides for all main classes of LNER locomotives are available from some model railway booksellers, and you can often pick up second hand copies on Amazon.

 

Phil

 

 

 

Edited May 7, 2019 by Chamby
Correction

[Ribird]

10 hours ago, Chamby said:

 

Yes, RHD means Right Hand Drive.  Externally the most obvious difference is that the reversing lever and the ejector pipe (runs parallel to the boiler handrail) are on the drivers side.  A1’s were originally built as right hand drive, then converted to left hand drive in the 1950’s.  They were all converted to A3’s before this time, so a RHD A3 is one that was originally an A1, after conversion to A3 but before Conversion to LHD.  Examples include Flying Scotsman and Gay Crusader at nationalisation.  Later members of the class were built as A3’s from new, and were only ever left hand drive.

 

Yeadons Register is a large series of books featuring details of each class of LNER locomotives.  Volume 1 covers the A1/A3 class.  It gives details of dates, rebuilds, boiler and tender details, conversion dates etc for the full class, plus illustrative photographs of detail differences throughout the history of the class, including renumbering dates.  If you want to model an individual locomotive at a specific point in time, it is a most helpful guide.  Yeadons guides for all main classes of LNER locomotives are available from some model railway booksellers, and you can often pick up second hand copies on Amazon.

 

Phil

 

 

 

Where would one find/buy this?

 

Just ignore this. I misread part of this.

Edited May 7, 2019 by Ribird

[Steamport Southport]

Best place to get Yeadon's Register books is Booklaw.

 

https://www.booklaw.co.uk/shop/index.php

 

https://www.booklaw.co.uk/shop/index.php?id_product=105&controller=product

 

 

Jason