Hornby Class 87 - Confirmed Newly Tooled Version for 2017 !

[James90012]

On 16/05/2023 at 18:29, WolfofBadenoch said:

 

Here's some shots. Two cab to cab with 8pin on left and 21 pin on right. In the 4 head on photos L-R is 21pin, 8pin, 21 pin, 8pin

 

Same issue with me - it's very, very difficult to get the body to sit fully snug again. Though I do have similar issues with the older Heljan 33s where the body clips aren't quite 'tight' enough to hold the body down. 

[Matt]

I had issues with 1 of mine - in the end I removed the contacts for cab lighting which seemed to help get body seated properly. I recall getting quite frustrated….

[andyman7]

I deliberately didn't rush for these latest 87s as I though I would let the dust settle and also allow the original minimum discount period to elapse but was able to pick up 87009 for £170 which takes the edge off the price a bit. Whilst 87006 is interesting it is a one-off livery whilst InterCity Executive is a bread and butter livery for me.
I have to admit the red stripe door issue does not leap out at me, yes it's there if you look but it's not screaming at me. On test it ran with just the marker lights on at each end but the switch underneath marked for day/night activates the headlight which of course should be on all the time for normal running. 
I've been reading the discussion on decoder fitting - I must admit I'm a bit gobsmacked that the new 21 pin board is located in a space that doesn't fit a standard 21 pin decoder. Whilst chassis milling might be an option for some I'm not prepared to go there so I wanted to check if anyone knew of a decoder that would fit - or at least could cope with a bit being shaved/chamfered off the decoder rather than the chassis? 

[ColinB]

Yes, I found that a normal 21 pin decoder was slightly too wide and another fault was that it was hanging upside down off the connector, never a very good idea, plus you have to remove the main circuit board to get to it. I assume a HM7000 must be slightly narrower. I did eventually slightly file down the 21 pin decoder, it was a spare LaisDCC one I had, so not much lost if I damaged it. Fortunately it still worked. Not sure I would want to do the same with £120 sound decoder.

[WolfofBadenoch]

What is the best way to remove numbers, nameplates, and plaqes on the 87?

 

I want to rename + number a couple of 87s but not sure which is the best way to remove existing numbers, nameplates and plaques without damaging the underlying paint. I thought i'd practise on an old Lima model as shown below. Admittedly manufacturing techniques etc have probably changed and it's a different company but my trial run hasn't gone well.

 

Using IPA i've removed the underlying paint but barely removed  any of the nameplate around Charles.

 

At the MacIntosh end the lettering has been removed but also the underlying paint using T-Cut. Similarly the underlying paint is coming off more than the plaque again with T-Cut.

 

[GRUNFOS]

I used blue T-cut on a cotton bud gently rubbing it comes off easily. Also removes the orange lines on Heljan 86's.

 

 

Edited June 30, 2023 by GRUNFOS
more info

[Pete the Elaner]

55 minutes ago, WolfofBadenoch said:

What is the best way to remove numbers, nameplates, and plaqes on the 87?

 

 

 

T cut for me too. It left the area around the plate & number a little shiny, but otherwise comes off cleanly. Mask off the grilles though; If you get T cut in there, it leaves a white residue which is difficult to remove.

 

Different manufacturers use different finishes, but I used the above on 2 Intercity 87s.

I bought a Heljan Railfreight 86 with the intention on removing the name & changing the sector to RF General, but I can't get the sector off without damaging the colour underneath it. I was a bit puzzled because the nameplate came off nicely on my O gauge 50149.

[Pete the Elaner]

On 26/05/2023 at 21:21, andyman7 said:

I've been reading the discussion on decoder fitting - I must admit I'm a bit gobsmacked that the new 21 pin board is located in a space that doesn't fit a standard 21 pin decoder. Whilst chassis milling might be an option for some I'm not prepared to go there so I wanted to check if anyone knew of a decoder that would fit - or at least could cope with a bit being shaved/chamfered off the decoder rather than the chassis? 

 

I've not been paying much attention to the second run of these so have only just seen this.

 

Oh Hornby, you've gone & done it again 😢 let down a potentially great model with a really stupid mistake.

The first gen of these had a decoder pocket too small for most decoders (including their own) & a speaker location which didn't allow any clearance for a speaker's magnet.

& now they provide a connection for a 21 pin decoder but don't provide enough space for one.

The red stripe on the cab door is just careless. I can't believe nobody at Hornby noticed in time to get it right.

The plastic BW pan was a disappointment too.

Edited June 30, 2023 by Pete the Elaner

[cairnsroadworks]

2 hours ago, Pete the Elaner said:

 

T cut for me too. It left the area around the plate & number a little shiny, but otherwise comes off cleanly. Mask off the grilles though; If you get T cut in there, it leaves a white residue which is difficult to remove.

 

Different manufacturers use different finishes, but I used the above on 2 Intercity 87s.

I bought a Heljan Railfreight 86 with the intention on removing the name & changing the sector to RF General, but I can't get the sector off without damaging the colour underneath it. I was a bit puzzled because the nameplate came off nicely on my O gauge 50149.

I have had a nightmare with the latest Heljan 86s. Nothing shifts the decals so had to repaint the two tone grey 😂

[adb968008]

6 hours ago, cairnsroadworks said:

I have had a nightmare with the latest Heljan 86s. Nothing shifts the decals so had to repaint the two tone grey 😂

T-Cut worked for me, but it was a test of saints, patience, two nights and a whisky.

its not easy to lift.

[cairnsroadworks]

38 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

T-Cut worked for me, but it was a test of saints, patience, two nights and a whisky.

its not easy to lift.

I think you were lucky 😂

[adb968008]

22 minutes ago, cairnsroadworks said:

I think you were lucky 😂

I was with the whisky.

 

🙂

[97406]

18 hours ago, WolfofBadenoch said:

What is the best way to remove numbers, nameplates, and plaqes on the 87?

 

I want to rename + number a couple of 87s but not sure which is the best way to remove existing numbers, nameplates and plaques without damaging the underlying paint. I thought i'd practise on an old Lima model as shown below. Admittedly manufacturing techniques etc have probably changed and it's a different company but my trial run hasn't gone well.

 

Using IPA i've removed the underlying paint but barely removed  any of the nameplate around Charles.

 

At the MacIntosh end the lettering has been removed but also the underlying paint using T-Cut. Similarly the underlying paint is coming off more than the plaque again with T-Cut.

 

I think that's Lima's rubbish paint, thin and soluble. I have 3 early Bachmann 40s with Lima mid sections and the original Lima paint almost wiped away with IPA without the need to soak.

 

I used very fine (and well used) wet and dry to remove Heljan's numbers off one of their 86s and a 25. Used wet and rolled into a small cylinder. Varnish and/or weathering hides any difference in finish when viewed from certain angles.

[WolfofBadenoch]

Thanks everybody for the advice.

I had successful a go last night with T-cut and as described by many the paintwork is a shiny but still there :-) -

 

Stephenson side  all removed. Royal Scot side i left the nameplate on as the new one will go over the top.

[WolfofBadenoch]

With advice from  a fair few members up the page and some Railtec transfers i've got my own 87s 🙂

 

Thanks everyone.

[brushman47544]

On 04/07/2023 at 21:34, WolfofBadenoch said:

With advice from  a fair few members up the page and some Railtec transfers i've got my own 87s 🙂

 

Thanks everyone.

Very nice job, but the BR blue ones really do need the data panel below the number. They look very odd - at least to me - without it.

[WolfofBadenoch]

On 08/07/2023 at 19:10, brushman47544 said:

Very nice job, but the BR blue ones really do need the data panel below the number. They look very odd - at least to me - without it.

 

Thanks.

 

I hadn't noticed that while checking nameplate positions. 😕

The Railtec number/nameplate sets contain data panels so they can be replaced, but i'm not sure i want to remove panels on 1 of the locos as it came pre-weathered. 

[APT Fan]

Hi,

Does anybody know what the best 'replacement' pantograph would be for 87001, are they difficult to fit? The factory one is awful, worse than the APT which at least doesn't fall off the actual model. What on earth were Hornby thinking of? I only realised how bad it was after purchasing a Bachmann Class 90 and had something to compare it with.

[adb968008]

1 hour ago, APT Fan said:

Hi,

Does anybody know what the best 'replacement' pantograph would be for 87001, are they difficult to fit? The factory one is awful, worse than the APT which at least doesn't fall off the actual model. What on earth were Hornby thinking of? I only realised how bad it was after purchasing a Bachmann Class 90 and had something to compare it with.

 

phone Bachmann spares and buy a class 90 pantograph from them ?

 

£20 last time I bought one.  [ Bachmann havent updated their spares site in a while, they have more than the website shows ]
 

One thing Bachmann, Heljan and Hornby have all got the same is the position for the insulators.. ive swapped a few several times.

 

With the 90 just snip the end that goes into the body for the lifting arm, unless you want to fit a servo too.. (Bachmann can also sell you that).

Edited July 26, 2023 by adb968008

[APT Fan]

23 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

 

phone Bachmann spares and buy a class 90 pantograph from them ?

 

£20 last time I bought one.  [ Bachmann havent updated their spares site in a while, they have more than the website shows ]
 

One thing Bachmann, Heljan and Hornby have all got the same is the position for the insulators.. ive swapped a few several times.

 

With the 90 just snip the end that goes into the body for the lifting arm, unless you want to fit a servo too.. (Bachmann can also sell you that).

 

So it would just be 'glued' on top of the four insulators?

 

HaHa!! Nice one, fit a servo motor into a Hornby Class 87? It was bad enough trying to fit sound.

[APT Fan]

Hi,

Does anyone know how to remove the pantograph on the latest model?

[APT Fan]

https://support.Hornby.com/hc/en-gb/article_attachments/4403630109458

 

I don't quite understand this service sheet. How can the part number of X7259 for the pantograph sets be the same for R3580 and R30030? Also how can the part number of X7253 for the main PCB be the same for all models when some are 8 pin and others are 21 pin?

[NS Peak]

On 17/12/2023 at 11:08, APT Fan said:

Hi,

Does anyone know how to remove the pantograph on the latest model?

 The way I did it was to take the body off and turn it over and you will see the holes in the roof where the insulators are glued in.  You can try to loosen up the glue first but if you try a solvent make sure it won’t damage the body.  I then used gently a small needle file to gently push out the insulator from underneath ( I said gently twice for a reason). You need to be firm and constant to break the glue bond don’t be rough or stab at it.  Then repeat with the other insulators and the pantograph will come loose and then it’s eas6 to remove the insulators as you wish.

[NS Peak]

On 27/12/2023 at 17:55, APT Fan said:

https://support.Hornby.com/hc/en-gb/article_attachments/4403630109458

 

I don't quite understand this service sheet. How can the part number of X7259 for the pantograph sets be the same for R3580 and R30030? Also how can the part number of X7253 for the main PCB be the same for all models when some are 8 pin and others are 21 pin?

The service sheet is only for the 8pin models there is a different updated service sheet for then 21 pin models.  The sheet only covers the initial release which is why it only shows a single pcb.  The sheet does show different pantographs and multiple working cables base£ on the models with only R3580 not having a Brecknell Willis pan

[Daddyman]

11 hours ago, NS Peak said:

 The way I did it was to take the body off and turn it over and you will see the holes in the roof where the insulators are glued in.  You can try to loosen up the glue first but if you try a solvent make sure it won’t damage the body.  I then used gently a small needle file to gently push out the insulator from underneath ( I said gently twice for a reason). You need to be firm and constant to break the glue bond don’t be rough or stab at it.  Then repeat with the other insulators and the pantograph will come loose and then it’s eas6 to remove the insulators as you wish.

If the pantograph is no longer needed, then could you drill out the locating pegs from below? - a drill bit of the same approximate size as the spigots (but not larger) usually works in these sorts of applications. Tug at the pantograph as you drill, and stop when it comes loose.