drmditch Posted February 18, 2017 Author Share Posted February 18, 2017 You can also buy the unpainted bodies direct from Dapol as well for for a little more at £1.61 each http://Dapol.co.uk/index.php?route=product/category&path=177_60_85_125 Thank you. All these good starting points. Why did I bother with my ex-Mainline one! In the past I have found the Dapol plastic quite soft, and one has to be very careful modifying a moulding. Has anyone else experienced this? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted February 18, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 18, 2017 Bachmann's announcement philosophy does seem to have moved away from, 'announce now and then supply the models in umpteen years time', to a more sort of 'design and develop the tooling first, and then only announce once the first samples are ready to show, and so be able to supply the models in about a year's time', (more like how Hornby do it) so with respect to LMS standards freight stock, and their new approach, an announcement should be imminent given Bachmann's LMScentric outlook lately, the glaring gap in the market, and just how much these are seriously wanted by so many of us!!! I doubt, 34C, that anyone is scratchbuilding LMS wagons in quantity these days, let alone smoking a pipe full of St Bruno and belching clouds of smoke while doing it. At least with LNER wagons, we have a decent source of kits to draw upon in the Parkside range; I can think of nothing remotely similar in LMS terms. Maybe Tatlow is to blame with his oh so wonderful and seminal works on the subject, making LNER wagons so much more known about these days. Ironic, that in his preface, he states that he undertook his research, as an LMS modeller with a need for LNER wagons, because there was so little information available at the time! I used to smoke St Bruno back in the day... Never made me any better at building LMS vans, though! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted February 18, 2017 Share Posted February 18, 2017 Very much so on the Dapol kits, but not with the unpainted bodies; crisp mouldings, and a hard grade of styrene to match contemporary RTR. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted February 19, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 19, 2017 Paul Bartlett's web site has several pages dedicated to LMS vans. http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/lmsvan If you're needing to change axel boxes try filing the faces off and making new ones from .010" plastic card. Bolts can be punched in from the rear with a suitable blunt point before cutting out. Regards Shaun. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium kevinlms Posted February 19, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 19, 2017 Yes. I should say that most of my LNER freight stock, especially the vans are kit built, and most of those from Parkside. That is why I am still surprised that there are no RTR or straightforward kit options for the LMS steel-ended fitted vans. I can understand the temptation for models of the same in BR condition with external diagonal strapping but surely there must be a market for pre-nationalisation vehicles. After all, fitted vans were common-user from 1936. There is an interesting article on the various up to 1930 vans for the LMS. 'Smokey' Bourne compiled a series of sketches showing the sides & a chart listing the variations in Railway Modeller for 1991 September issue, pages 396 to 398. Diagrams covered are. D1808 D1812 D1814 D1821 Meat van D1822 Meat van D1828 D1829 D1830 D1832 D1663 D1889 All types have the corrugated ends. He recommended using the Parkside kit chassis. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwealleans Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 Mick Moore has done a couple of articles on modifying Cambrian LMS vans in MRJ - issue 205 according to the online index. I thought it was over two issues, but I must be wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted February 19, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 19, 2017 Yes. I should say that most of my LNER freight stock, especially the vans are kit built, and most of those from Parkside. That is why I am still surprised that there are no RTR or straightforward kit options for the LMS steel-ended fitted vans. I can understand the temptation for models of the same in BR condition with external diagonal strapping but surely there must be a market for pre-nationalisation vehicles. After all, fitted vans were common-user from 1936. I'd have to agree with this; as an early BR modeller I would like the option of this van in unfitted unrebuilt by BR condition, as there were no doubt plenty still around in BR grey and post-war LMS livery. Until the standard BR 12ton van came on the scene in quantity, these were easily the most commonly seen van in general. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 It's a baffling omission from RTR, and we may as well also mention the yet more common LMS general merchandise opens while we are about it. I am not ungrateful to Bachmann for tackling a spread of the LNER equivalents, but not thereafter moving on to the LMS types is - strange. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted February 19, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 19, 2017 It's a baffling omission from RTR, and we may as well also mention the yet more common LMS general merchandise opens while we are about it. I am not ungrateful to Bachmann for tackling a spread of the LNER equivalents, but not thereafter moving on to the LMS types is - strange. Again, the point applies equally to the early BR period, and there isn't a standard BR open either, fitted or unfitted, steel or planked. These are wagons that were numerous, in service for many years, and which could be produced in several liveries and variations thereof to ensure multiple sales and collector's interest, and there were the hybar and hybarshoc variants as well; you'd have thought they were no-brainers from the rtr viewpoint. Then again, what do I know about marketing! Perhaps Oxford will rescue us. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 Again, the point applies equally to the early BR period, and there isn't a standard BR open either, fitted or unfitted, steel or planked. These are wagons that were numerous, in service for many years, and which could be produced in several liveries and variations thereof to ensure multiple sales and collector's interest, and there were the hybar and hybarshoc variants as well; you'd have thought they were no-brainers from the rtr viewpoint. Then again, what do I know about marketing! Perhaps Oxford will rescue us. All of those are already in the Bachmann range along with many other versions such as China Clay, Sand Tipplers and Pipes. http://www.hattons.co.uk/stocklist/1000393/1000588/1000637/0/Bachmann_Branchline_OO_Gauge_1_76_Scale_Wagons/prodlist.aspx?showPreowned=false&pageid=1 Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted February 20, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 20, 2017 China clay, sand tipplers, pipes, and tubes are specialist wagons not suitable for small blt. Not denying they are good and useful models, just not for me really! http://www.hattons.co.uk/stocklist/1000393/1000588/1000637/0/Bachmann_Branchline_OO_Gauge_1_76_Scale_Wagons/prodlist.aspx?showPreowned=false&pageid=1 Jason Only hybar, all others are LNER derivitaves or rebuild LMS. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium kevinlms Posted February 20, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 20, 2017 May sound a bit silly but if you want to build fitted LMS vans you could do no better than first source a January 1975 Model Railway Constructor. Ian Nuttall and A N Other (Apologies I forget the co author) penned an article on carrying out simple to complex alterations to the Ratio LMS van to end up with a number of different variations. Even though it was published decades ago it is still relevant today. As others have said, the Airfix/GMR/Dapol body tarts up well. Specially with Rumney and LMS models bits clagged on. This one started out as a GMR body bought for 50p from my local toy fair. BR-LMSboxVMdling-008-editSm.jpg Be careful if buying GMR bodies though. There was an early version whose body mould was atrocious. P Article entitled 'Variations on a Ratio theme' and co-author is Roger Ellis. Note that much of the variations are based on BR modifications (like many of the posts in this thread). My understanding is that the OP is looking for models to suit pre-nationalisation days. If he is only interested in pre WW2 days, then vehicles such as the D2079 variety are no good, as they were built for the LMS by the LNER in 1942. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
drmditch Posted March 4, 2017 Author Share Posted March 4, 2017 Having completed the Ratio kit for a Dia 1897, I was reluctant to throw away my attempted conversion of an old Mainline moulding. So, I chopped the roof of and replaced it with something to a better curvature. Compared with the Ratio product, my detail, especially the width of the channels on each side is overstated. The major inaccuracy is the narrow width. However, provided I try to avoid running them next to each other, I'm not too unhappy with the result. (Comparisons with Mr Essery's 'An Illustrated History of LMS Wagons Volume One' Plates 83 and 85) Most of my stock is still packed away, but I did locate a Cambrian kit for Dia 1664 which I built a few years ago. I don't know how often even fitted vans would have been cleaned and/or re-painted in reality, but my railway is set in 1946/47, so assuming these vans haven't been re-painted for at least ten years including wartime service, they are entitled to look a bit battered! When I work on more LMS vans, I'll certainly consider more Cambrian kits, or Dapol conversions. Thank you to everybody who has posted advice. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted March 4, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 4, 2017 Nice work! Personally I think a rake of vans should look tatty and battered and looks even better with a freshly painted one or two in the rake. A quick google search will reveal that hardly any two vans in a rake appear the same shade. Regards Shaun. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted March 4, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 4, 2017 Having completed the Ratio kit for a Dia 1897, I was reluctant to throw away my attempted conversion of an old Mainline moulding. So, I chopped the roof of and replaced it with something to a better curvature. Compared with the Ratio product, my detail, especially the width of the channels on each side is overstated. The major inaccuracy is the narrow width. However, provided I try to avoid running them next to each other, I'm not too unhappy with the result. Post_28.JPG Post_29.JPG (Comparisons with Mr Essery's 'An Illustrated History of LMS Wagons Volume One' Plates 83 and 85) Most of my stock is still packed away, but I did locate a Cambrian kit for Dia 1664 which I built a few years ago. Post_30.JPG I don't know how often even fitted vans would have been cleaned and/or re-painted in reality, but my railway is set in 1946/47, so assuming these vans haven't been re-painted for at least ten years including wartime service, they are entitled to look a bit battered! When I work on more LMS vans, I'll certainly consider more Cambrian kits, or Dapol conversions. Thank you to everybody who has posted advice. The post war railway was well behind in basic maintainence, and the look to go for is overall filth, grime, semi-derecliction, and more battered than cod from my local chippy. You seem to be doing ok with this... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jub45565 Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 Mick Moore has done a couple of articles on modifying Cambrian LMS vans in MRJ - issue 205 according to the online index. I thought it was over two issues, but I must be wrong. There is a pair of articles in MRJ 238/9 which might be the ones you're thinking about? The Cambrian van kits are some of their more recent ones, and are nicely moulded. They also do the 9' wheelbase wagons D1666/7. Rumney models do lots of lovely little bits of metal to model the 10' wheelbase wagons based around the Parkside Dundas BR 5 plank sides. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iak Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 Check the Rumney Models website out. Look under Future Plans and.... Lets say if you are interested, let Justin know. Especially if you have 9'wheelbase Cambrian LMS vans... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 Something that really bugs me is that the Bachmann and Dapol "LMS" vans, well...aren't. I've scoured Essery's LMS Wagons and the closest I get is the van shown in post 38 with a single diagonal strap. The B and D vans look more like BR built Standard vans. This is tragic in that, in the case of Dapol, they produce Egg, Banana and other vans with very good livery, but on incorrect bodies. Mutton dressed as lamb. If I have this wrong, I hope someone can show me. So, my vote, in the case of LMS vans is to use kits. The articles in MRJ mentioned above (and I think they were over more than one issue) are very useful. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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