Thoughts going out to Manchester

[57xx]

What horrible news to wake up to, such a sickening and cowardly attack. My thoughts go out to everyone affected.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-40010124

[mark axlecounter]

So so sad. My thoughts are with the families and friends

[TheSignalEngineer]

Very subdued at Picc this morning. Police with machine guns at the ticket barriers.

[Edwardian]

My thoughts are with the families and friends of all those affected.

 

Perhaps it is the sensitivities of a father, but I have wept more than once this morning at the news that at least 22 people have been killed, including the many children and young people whose innocent and joyful concert-going was the target of the attack.

 

I spoke with a colleague of mine just now, at work as usual in Manchester, and, although not personally affected, naturally she and everyone else in the office feels devastated. '96, I recall, was nothing like this, and I can only imagine the atmosphere and sense of shock there this morning.  

 

So very sad.

[Trains4U]

Two of my nieces were at the concert.

Fortunately they are both home safely and were well away from the explosion.

 

This certainly brings it home.

[tamperman36]

my deepest thoughts and condolences  go to all those who have loved ones caught up in Manchester, and a big thank you to the people of Manchester for there generosity and help following this horrific event

 

God bless them all.

[mcowgill]

Perhaps it is the sensitivities of a father, but I have wept more than once this morning at the news that at least 22 people have been killed, including the many children and young people whose innocent and joyful concert-going was the target of the attack.

 

 

There have been no end of atrocities in the news over the years but this one has upset me far more than any other, partly as a father of a daughter in the same age group as many of those in Manchester last night, but also as I heard the news just as I boarded a train at Liverpool Street on the way home from a concert myself.

 

Just 20 minutes earlier I heard KT Tunstall refer to the experience of coming together for live arts and music (apologies for her colourful language):  "This is something that people have done for millennia, come into caves or rooms and you come together and it's just us.  Nobody cares what colour you are, who you're shagging or who you vote for.  None of it matters.  This is special, it's a sacred space and we should appreciate that"

 

It upsets me that people have gone to one of these places for a joyful experience and they lost their lives through a random act that was no fault of their own

 

Martin

Edited May 23, 2017 by mcowgill

[MarcD]

We landed in Manchester airport last night and as we drove home up the M61 I lost count of how many ambulances and police cars were heading south to Manchester. Initially we thought there had been a serous road traffic accident, there had been no mention of it at the airport at all. Only after we stopped did we find out what had happened.

I only have the question that most people have. Why?

Marc

[PhilH]

I'm not usually lost for words, i am now.

 

Heartbreaking.

[APOLLO]

My daughters left for school (and GCSE exams) this morning with fingers crossed. They said some from their school were at the concert.

 

As others have said - Why ? I also have many questions, no answers.

 

R.I.P. to those murdered, a speedy recovery to the injured.

 

Brit15

[lapford34102]

Families thoughts are with all those bereaved, injured or involved. This was a barbaric, futile act that will achieve little. Our people have to get it right all the time, "they" only need to get lucky once sadly.

 

Stu

[Chris116]

As the grandson of a former Dean of Manchester Cathedral and with a mother who was born in Manchester I feel a connection with the city and with the people who have died or have suffered injuries or whose family have been involved in any way.

 

Islam and Christianity are linked by belief in the same God and only those with twisted minds can ever think that murder is part of either religion. Let us unite against the terrorists by showing our love for others whatever their colour or their faith. By doing that we can beat those who use evil.

[Tom D]

My thoughts and prayers are with the families of those who have lost loved ones. My admiration to the emergency personnel who responded so quickly. 

[ParkeNd]

I believe that the object of these atrocities is to create the most unimaginable shock and disgust. This one sure takes the biscuit. The perpetrator must have been in a state of mind that I could never hope to understand. Whatever can be done to stop lone wolves who have been made not to care about their own escape beats me.

[Horsetan]

I believe that the object of these atrocities is to create the most unimaginable shock and disgust. This one sure takes the biscuit. The perpetrator must have been in a state of mind that I could never hope to understand. Whatever can be done to stop lone wolves who have been made not to care about their own escape beats me.

 

That, unfortunately, is the power of certain sects within a religion - and there are quite a few of them (Wahhabi and Deobandi are perhaps the best known outside of the Sunni / Shia mainstream) which are beyond the pale in their aim to impose their thinking upon the world, and are willing to die - and take others with them - in pursuit of that aim. In some ways, we don't help ourselves because we have a tendency to think that such preaching is "out of sight, out of mind".

 

By contrast, in this country at least, Christianity hasn't been dangerous for everybody since the 17th/18th century, unless you count The Troubles which were less about religion and more about a political end.

[APOLLO]

Quick update. Twins back from school, Although they do not know them several children from their school were at the concert, with one believed to be in hospital, injuries unknown.

 

With over 20,000 mainly youngsters there, there is a good chance most North West schools will have had at least one or two pupils at this concert.

 

Again it is heartbreaking for all involved.

 

We need a way forward, the terrorist was seemingly "known to the authorities". Not good enough to be just known to them. We need action, straight from the top, NOW.

 

Brit15

[Reorte]

We need a way forward, the terrorist was seemingly "known to the authorities". Not good enough to be just known to them. We need action, straight from the top, NOW.

But what should they do? "Known to the authorities" might just mean a bit suspicious, but it would be a terrible country to live in if the police could constantly be on the back of everyone they're a bit suspicious about. Action is certainly needed but it has to be appropriate action that isn't going to take a step down the police state path. We don't want to be goaded into rash actions.

[APOLLO]

I agree Reorte and such discussion is not for this thread, or even for this forum.

 

It's up to our "leaders", and for us all to be vigilant.

 

I have some fear for the future, not mine, but the future for our children.

 

Brit15

[bike2steam]

Action is certainly needed but it has to be appropriate action that isn't going to take a step down the police state path.

Should the community in which these perpetrators hide, take more responsibility in weeding them out, to help prevent a generalization of blame ??

[Alister_G]

Should the community in which these perpetrators hide, take more responsibility in weeding them out, to help prevent a generalization of blame ??

 

They quite likely have no more knowledge of it than the rest of us, just as friends, neighbours and families of normal suicides are so often completely unaware until it happens.

 

Al.

[Guest CLARENCE]

An absolutely terrible atrocity; but one thing gives me some hope for humanity, the sight of ambulance men and police officers running to help the injured without any care for their own safety. I remember a short piece filmed during the recent horror at Westminster; doctors and nurses at the local hospital dropping everything and running towards the sound of gunshots and sirens. Such remarkable bravery!

 

My prayers go out for the innocent dead and injured.

Edited May 25, 2017 by CLARENCE

[fozzy280472]

Heartbreaking and my thoughts are obviously with the those who lost their loved ones .

I can't help feeling both bloody annoyed by this and also a sense of resignation to the possibility of this kind of atrocity will become a regular occurrence around the world.........one things for sure I pray to whichever god it doesn't.

[Ceptic]

They quite likely have no more knowledge of it than the rest of us, just as friends, neighbours and families of normal suicides are so often completely unaware until it happens

 

 

 

 

Absolute nonsense. Unless the perpetrator was a complete cave dwelling loner, he had family, mates, friends, religious colleagues / associates, etc. who knew of his ambitions.  Even the authorities knew of his presence ! ! 

 

Edited May 24, 2017 by Ceptic

[Ozexpatriate]

By contrast, in this country at least, Christianity hasn't been dangerous for everybody since the 17th/18th century, unless you count The Troubles which were less about religion and more about a political end.

Organized religion and politics are often inseparable. They are both essentially faith-based systems whose darker aspects can thrive on the in-group/out-group thinking that is a hallmark of primate tribalism. (I don't mean to disparage any deeply held spiritual beliefs that give people comfort and spiritual sustenance with this remark, but offer the observation that these institutions can lend themselves to group-think based abuses. Our brains are hard-wired this way and it takes acts of great consciousness to behave differently.)

 

Even in Britain, religious suppression did not end formally until well into the 19^th century with the Roman Catholic Relief Act of 1829, and let's be honest, it didn't end there - rightly as you point out with The Troubles.

 

There is a parallel that I sometimes consider, and that is the notion of how long does it take for any major religion to 'stabilize' from a political into a peaceful pursuit.

 

Today, Christianity is about 1,984 years old (give or take). Islam is about 1,385 years old.

 

If we consider what was happening in Christianity in 1418 (at the same 'age' Islam is now), John Wycliffe had been excommunicated for three years. He would be executed in 1428.

 

In 1418, the Spanish Inquisition was still 60 years in the future. Martin Luther would nail his Ninety Nine theses to the door of the All Saints Church in Wittenberg 99 years later and the Wars of the Reformation would begin some seven years after that. In 1418, the Thirty Years war was still two centuries in the future.

 

This argument is easily dismissed by saying that my comparison is one of apples and oranges, but to me history suggests that Islamist extremism will get worse before it gets better - as it did for Christianity in a similar 'gestational' period.

 

None of this excuses the despicable and deplorable actions in Manchester last night. My thoughts are with the concert attendees and their families.

Edited May 23, 2017 by Ozexpatriate

[exmoordave]

Very sadly I cannot visualise a peaceful long term resolution. It takes two to make a peace, but only one to make war.

 

My heart and sincere condolences go out to all who have had their lives shattered by this atrocious, senseless act of utter brutality, perpetrated by a piece of murderous scum.