Teaky's attic

[teaky]

I've not been particularly productive recently as my youngest son contracted some kind of lurgy and was off sick so I felt I could not make a noise right above his bedroom.  I managed to do a bit of electrical testing.  Just for my piece of mind really, before any plastering is done.  I have also given the eaves hatch a coat of gloss.  Despite treating the plywood with knotting prior to undercoat and gloss, I can still see a few small dark spots so I have put on some more knotting before I patch paint a little more gloss.  A further coat of gloss will go on as the final stage of finishing the room.

 

As the weather forecast suggests today will be the last day before further rain I decided to get the ladders out and finish the soffit vents.  There were three at the back and one at the front which I could not do with the others because of the scaffolding being in the way.  I have also tweaked the vents so that they are better aligned - not perfect but they're probably good enough not to bug me any more.

 

 

If I do decide they need a further tweak then I'll do that when I get around to cleaning the soffits, window frames and windows sometime in the next few months.

 

[teaky]

Life has been getting in the way recently, as it is wont to do, but things are now picking up.

 

At the very start, I agreed with the BCO that I could fit a space saver staircase.  This has alternate tread half width steps rather than the usual full width treads which means it requires less floor space.  N.B. If you are considering this you must bear in mind that they can only be used to access a single (loft) room (a bedroom plus en-suite still counts as one room) and interpretation of the regulations may vary so check with your local Building Control before including one in your planning.  The main reason for not wanting a standard staircase was that the layout of our house means that the most suitable position would have been right in the middle of the new loft room which sounds fine until you realise that you need to enclose the stairs at top or bottom.  This would have meant either a central dividing wall in the railway room or turning our light and airy landing into a corridor, neither of which was particularly appealing.  Opting for a space saver staircase meant that I only had to pinch most of the airing cupboard and a small chunk out of the built-in wardrobes behind and also that the structural changes are all but invisible on the first floor and only a little storage space is lost.  The stairs come out in the loft towards one end with (eventually) only a balustrade reaching any higher.

 

Look away now bgman. 

 

The staircase is in and fixed in place.

 

 

The gaps and scruffy walls at either side will be lined with fireproof plasterboard as will the underside of the staircase where it protrudes into the built-in wardrobes behind.  I will also be building a balustrade around the top to stop people falling down the hole.

Edited August 11, 2022 by teaky
Re-adding photos.

[teaky]

Well that's a landmark!  I helped my youngest son to move out and into a flat with his girlfriend this morning.  After 20 years it's going to be a new experience not having him at home anymore.

 

This afternoon I have indulged in completing some wood butchery.

Chris P Bacon and other carpenters should look away now!

 

 

In addition to the main part visible in the loft there are assorted pieces (some carefully cut to thickness, some simply scraps) which I have screwed to the walls either side of the staircase in order to even things up.  There's a roughly 10% variation, mainly along one side, which you don't notice from the bedroom side of the wall but when there's a staircase up the centre it becomes much more obvious.

 

There are also some lengths of timber at various points to give something to screw into when fixing the handrails, plus a few more pieces just there to give something to fix plasterboard to.

 

It is crude to look at but a spirit level indicates it is straight and level.  Everything is firmly fixed down through the floor and/or through the sides into the floor joists with some substantial screws.  There is very little movement when I push against the balustrade from any direction so I reckon it will do the job.

 

All this butchered timber won't be visible.  I am going to clad it in plasterboard so the walls either side of the stairs should will continue up to the top of the balustrade.

 

Edited August 11, 2022 by teaky
Re-adding photos.

[teaky]

I've been making some progress, honest!

 

Here are a few shots of all the fiddly bits where the underside of the staircase has been boarded with fire-rated plasterboard.

 

The staircase protrudes into the top corner of one wardrobe.

 

The other wardrobe loses space near the ceiling but gains space near the floor.

 

 

Exciting eh?!

 

Edited August 11, 2022 by teaky
Re-adding photos.

[teaky]

More excitement!

 

Plasterboarding is complete.

 

 

 

 

 

So, after a mug of tea, I'll clear away my tools, store the useful pieces of board and timber in the garage, take the rest to the tip for recycling and sweep up all the dust (again).

 

Edited August 11, 2022 by teaky
Re-adding photos.

[teaky]

I'll give the plasterer a call tomorrow and find out when he's free.

 

Plastering is definitely a job for the experts as far as I am concerned.  I enjoy the challenge of learning new skills but a large room, especially one with sloping ceilings, doesn’t seem like the ideal place to start.  I've done the pre-plastering preparation of fixing metal angle beads, filling and sanding, and will scrim tape the joints just before the plasterer arrives as well as purchasing the plaster itself because I seem to be able to buy it for less than the plasterer.  This should help keep costs down a little, although plastering isn't usually too expensive.

[St Enodoc]

More excitement!

 

Plasterboarding is complete.

 

balustrade 4.JPG

balustrade 5.JPG

stairs 5.JPG

stairs 6.JPG

 

So, after a mug of tea, I'll clear away my tools, store the useful pieces of board and timber in the garage, take the rest to the tip for recycling and sweep up all the dust (again).

Rob, looking at those "special" stairs from above, they look a bit scary. Are you supposed to go down backwards? Either way, I wouldn't mind a handrail if it were me.

[teaky]

On 20/05/2018 at 10:27, St Enodoc said:

Rob, looking at those "special" stairs from above, they look a bit scary. Are you supposed to go down backwards? Either way, I wouldn't mind a handrail if it were me.

Fear not.  I have two handrails (as required by the Building Regulations, in fact) which will be fitted once the plastering is complete.  These will be fixed with screws through the plasterboard into assorted pieces of timber which I fixed in place prior to the final layer of fire-rated plasterboard.

 

Here's a piece chopped from an earlier photo showing the handrails sitting on top of the staircase.

 

I agree that it does look a little scary but it is all in the mind really.  Each step is actually deeper, front to back (the going) than the main staircase in our house, so provided you correctly alternate your steps it is straightforward.  Visually, it appears steep but once you've convinced yourself that it isn't what it first appears it gets easier.  Whilst I haven't been dashing up and down like I tend to do on standard stairs, I've been getting faster the more I use these alternate tread stairs.  The trick seems to be to pause briefly before ascending or descending to make certain you begin with the correct foot.

 

The one thing that is tricky is turning around midway if you forget something.  There's plenty of room for both feet on each step but you have to be careful and it's probably best to avoid this.  As it happens, I've survived doing this lots of times during construction as I worked on the timber supports and plasterboarding.

 

It will definitely be much easier when there are two handrails because, aside from the obvious physical safety, the brain will be reassured.

 

The trickiest bit, which I didn't predict, is opening the door at the bottom.  You reach the door whilst still standing on the bottom step and because I am tall it is a bit like having a door handle at thigh height rather than waist height.  I expect shorter people won't have this problem.  Nor will they have to be quite so careful not to smack their head on the door frame which is effectively nearer 1.8m high than the usual 2.0m even though vertical measurements at any point on the stairs show there is always more than 2.0m of headroom.

 

Sorry to give such a long-winded answer to your simple question but I thought I'd be thorough.

Edited August 11, 2022 by teaky
Re-adding photos.

[St Enodoc]

Fear not.  I have two handrails (as required by the Building Regulations, in fact) which will be fitted once the plastering is complete.  These will be fixed with screws through the plasterboard into assorted pieces of timber which I fixed in place prior to the final layer of fire-rated plasterboard.

 

Here's a piece chopped from an earlier photo showing the handrails sitting on top of the staircase.

handrails 1.JPG

 

I agree that it does look a little scary but it is all in the mind really.  Each step is actually deeper, front to back (the going) than the main staircase in our house, so provided you correctly alternate your steps it is straightforward.  Visually, it appears steep but once you've convinced yourself that it isn't what it first appears it gets easier.  Whilst I haven't been dashing up and down like I tend to do on standard stairs, I've been getting faster the more I use these alternate tread stairs.  The trick seems to be to pause briefly before ascending or descending to make certain you begin with the correct foot.

 

The one thing that is tricky is turning around midway if you forget something.  There's plenty of room for both feet on each step but you have to be careful and it's probably best to avoid this.  As it happens, I've survived doing this lots of times during construction as I worked on the timber supports and plasterboarding.

 

It will definitely be much easier when there are two handrails because, aside from the obvious physical safety, the brain will be reassured.

 

The trickiest bit, which I didn't predict, is opening the door at the bottom.  You reach the door whilst still standing on the bottom step and because I am tall it is a bit like having a door handle at thigh height rather than waist height.  I expect shorter people won't have this problem.  Nor will they have to be quite so careful not to smack their head on the door frame which is effectively nearer 1.8m high than the usual 2.0m even though vertical measurements at any point on the stairs show there is always more than 2.0m of headroom.

 

Sorry to give such a long-winded answer to your simple question but I thought I'd be thorough.

Ah, that all makes sense. Thanks.

[chris p bacon]

The trickiest bit, which I didn't predict, is opening the door at the bottom.  You reach the door whilst still standing on the bottom step and because I am tall it is a bit like having a door handle at thigh height rather than waist height. 

 

 

I saw something similar a few years ago. The solution (which was a bit Heath Robinson but worked) was lever handles with a second handle on the inside mounted at an appropriate height and linked to the bottom handle by a rod. 

Push down on the top and the bottom one worked as well.

 

You could get something like an espagnolette (?)  for the opener but the cost would be prohibitive for such a simple door.

[Stubby47]

Does the door need to have a handle to open it? Could you use a sprung-loaded roller catch instead?

[chris p bacon]

Does the door need to have a handle to open it? 

 

 

I've got some big kick plates if you need one.

[Buhar]

You could get something like an espagnolette (?) for the opener

Can I have ham and mushrooms in mine?

[teaky]

Does the door need to have a handle to open it? Could you use a sprung-loaded roller catch instead?

The thought had occurred to me, Stubby.  I thought I'd see how it goes though.  That definitely seems like the most straightforward solution.

[teaky]

I've got some big kick plates if you need one.

I wouldn't want to be repairing the door frame every time I used the room though.

[teaky]

Here we go again. 

 

I had planned all along to use a plasterer I've used before.  He visited several weeks ago and we discussed what would be involved.  I spoke to him on Monday morning and he was on site but promised to call me on Tuesday evening when he was back home with all his paperwork.  Nothing and haven't been able to get hold of him since.

 

I spoke to another plasterer this morning and he is busy for at least three weeks.

 

I now have another guy coming this evening to take a look.  All being well, he's available immediately, i.e. Tuesday.  I'm not sure how to take that since I was expecting everyone to have some work on but we'll see.  Plenty of positive reviews on his website but then he controls what goes on there.

 

It does seem unnecessarily difficult to engage tradesmen sometimes.

 

Well, that's today's moan off my chest.

[chris p bacon]

The problem for plasters is that they are half way through the chain. The first fix works they need doing before they can start can be late with unforeseen problems, but those that are following them will be on their case as soon as they know the jobs ready to go.

 

It doesn't always follow that someone who can start soon has no work, it could be the next job for him has been put back and he can fit another in beforehand. I think you need one for only about 2 maybe 3 days max (if just the loft).

[teaky]

The problem for plasters is that they are half way through the chain. The first fix works they need doing before they can start can be late with unforeseen problems, but those that are following them will be on their case as soon as they know the jobs ready to go.

 

It doesn't always follow that someone who can start soon has no work, it could be the next job for him has been put back and he can fit another in beforehand. I think you need one for only about 2 maybe 3 days max (if just the loft).

That may well be the explanation Dave.  It's certainly possible on this occasion.

 

Anyway, the plasterer left a few minutes ago.  I liked him.  He asked the right questions and made the right suggestions about how he would approach various bits.  His price was OK too.  So, all being well, he should be here at 08:00 on Tuesday.

 

Spot on with your estimate too - two maybe three days is just what he said.

[teaky]

BTW Thanks for the Friendly/Supportive clicks folks.  It's appreciated.

[teaky]

Phew!  300kg of plaster up two flights of stairs.  Who would have thought railway modelling would keep you fit?

[73c]

Blimey! that's a lot

[Northroader]

There’s easier ways to get plastered.

[teaky]

Blimey! that's a lot

You're telling me!

 

About 80m² at 3mm thick (12 x 25kg bags).

[chris p bacon]

You're telling me!

 

About 80m² at 3mm thick (12 x 25kg bags).

 

We take 10 up then top up if required. Nothing cheeses you off more than bringing 2 back down.

[teaky]

Now you tell me!