RBAGE Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 John explained that he will use Peco bullhead so he will probably have to wait quite a while for anything but straight turnouts. Once curved ones were available, they would no doubt be too tight for the layout anyway. So, short of building the track himself, straight track is the obvious choice. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 Shipley MRS did a splendid version of Evercreech Junction, sadly lost to fire. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold unravelled Posted December 17, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 17, 2017 Looking forward to watching the development and construction of this layout. My visits to Evercreech were in its final years, most of my pictures are on their own thread here somewhere. One feature which alwaysstood out was the row of bufferstops above the station. Will you manage to play around with levels enough to represent this in the model? Thanks Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted December 17, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 (edited) John, if you would like to study a few formations for your Cleethorpes then the Ivo Peters S & D books covering 1960/61/62 show quite a few photo's and the stock is identifiable. There are then all the summer season North/Midlands Bournemouth workings bringing other 'interesting mixes' to the line. However I can provide several interesting formations for the Cleethorpes circa 1961 if you wish; (there was an 11 coach maximum and they were then double headed, the train loco almost always being a 7F allowed 10 max). Sadly this is almost all I know about the route as I never travelled on it. I never knew the Cleethorpes existed until I was researching for my own layout (Seaton Junction). Like many folk I know something of the route through its popular history. I really regret never seeing Bath GP and Bournemouth West. Phil Edited December 17, 2017 by Mallard60022 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted December 17, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 John explained that he will use Peco bullhead so he will probably have to wait quite a while for anything but straight turnouts. Once curved ones were available, they would no doubt be too tight for the layout anyway. So, short of building the track himself, straight track is the obvious choice. The new Peco turnouts are quite easily 'modified' to curvy shapes. John will be fine using that method as he can create his own geometry (within certain bounds). Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cctransuk Posted December 17, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 (edited) Personally I'd rethink this one – you have an enormous amount of space at your disposal relative to most folks but it's almost entirely full of straight track work – unlike the real location. I most definitely won't be building track - there's more than enough for one person here, without learning an entirely new discipline. Peco will - in time I trust - produce all that I will need. I want to build an environment within which I can look at and run my stock - I'm not after a meticulous reproduction of every molehill around the station. If it is possible to run a (near) prototypical sequence of (near) prototypical trains - that'll do me !! I am fortunate to have a comprehensive library of S&DJR books and a considerable collection of railway photos, taken in the environs of EJ station, so it should be possible to recreate something that looks the part. Regards, John Isherwood. Shipley MRS did a splendid version of Evercreech Junction, sadly lost to fire. That's terrible - I hadn't realised that it was gone! Regards, John Isherwood. Edited December 17, 2017 by cctransuk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cctransuk Posted December 17, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 Looking forward to watching the development and construction of this layout. My visits to Evercreech were in its final years, most of my pictures are on their own thread here somewhere. One feature which alwaysstood out was the row of bufferstops above the station. Will you manage to play around with levels enough to represent this in the model? Thanks Dave Dave, I'm afraid that all track will be as near billiard-table horizontal as I can achieve - I have read too many horror stories associated with gradients on layouts! Nonetheless, a little contour-juggling outside the trackbeds may still allow the model to look less than fen-like! Regards, John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted December 17, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 I want to build an envirinment within which I can look at and run my stock - I'm not after a meticulous reproduction of every molehill around the station. If it is possible to run a (near) prototypical sequence of (near) prototypical trains - that'll do me !! I am fortunate to have a comprehensive library of S&DJR books and a considerable collection of railway photos, taken in the environs of EJ station, so it should be possible to recreate something that looks the part. That's exactly how things should be except for maybe an exhibitiuon layout. Your layout, your fun and memories. Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cctransuk Posted December 17, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 John, if you would like to study a few formations for your Cleethorpes then the Ivo Peters S & D books covering 1960/61/62 show quite a few photo's and the stock is identifiable. There are then all the summer season North/Midlands Bournemouth workings bringing other 'interesting mixes' to the line. However I can provide several interesting formations for the Cleethorpes circa 1961 if you wish; (there was an 11 coach maximum and they were then double headed, the train loco almost always being a 7F allowed 10 max). Sadly this is almost all I know about the route as I never travelled on it. I never knew the Cleethorpes existed until I was researching for my own layout (Seaton Junction). Like many folk I know something of the route through its popular history. I really regret never seeing Bath GP and Bournemouth West. Phil Phil, All contributions gratefully received !! I have all of Ivo's books and films of the S&DJR, so it's just down to finding the research time to compile more authentic rakes. I did (once) visit Bath Green Park station, to meet my Dad off a Bournemouth train, but I never travelled on or visited any other part of the S&DJR. Regards, John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RBAGE Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 John, I have a set of half plate photographs taken towards the end and soon after closure. Full of detail. I can't remember the name of the photographer but I think they passed to the trust after his death. They will be invaluable and a must, if you don't already have them. Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted December 17, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 Personally I'd rethink this one – you have an enormous amount of space at your disposal relative to most folks but it's almost entirely full of straight track work – unlike the real location. I'm inclined to agree, I think it's much too straight. Building pointwork isn't all that difficult and certainly a lot easier than that 10100 kit you're waiting for.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cctransuk Posted December 17, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 (edited) I'm inclined to agree, I think it's much too straight. Building pointwork isn't all that difficult and certainly a lot easier than that 10100 kit you're waiting for.... Michael, I'm sure that you're correct - but, apart from a 6' x 3' Hornby Dublo 3-rail trainset that lived beneath my teenage bed, and an even smaller North Wales NG (4mm. scale) layout, this will be my first, and last, layout. I know what I am (reasonably) good at; I haven't tried track-building, (and have no great desire to learn at my age); and I don't expect to have enough years left in me to build EJ, including the track, and have time to enjoy it. There's loads of stock left 'to do' - as the above stocklists show - and I enjoy stockbuilding. OK, straight is boring, but I have limited width compared to length; and stock storage is paramount. I only have myself to please, and it'll do for me. 10100 has no place on the S&DJR - but it WILL appear, and I look forward to the challenge of building it. When you're 21, you have your lifetime ahead of you and you can dream of building everything - but you haven't the money to do it. When you're 68, you may have the money, and space, but you realise that you've probably only got one shot at building your ideal. If you want to have time to play with it, and enjoy the building process, you might as well concentrate on doing yourself the bits that give you satisfaction, and buy-in the bits that don't really worry you. Curvature is only a straight line messed-about with - (there speaks a civil engineer-as-was)! Regards, John Isherwood. Edited December 17, 2017 by cctransuk 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cctransuk Posted December 17, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 (edited) I look forward to seeing this develop. Ivo Peters albums inspired my photography and gave me the idea of photographing 'my own patch' intensively. Maybe I missed it in the text, but I wonder which period or year you are choosing to model...? Larry, Strictly, according to the thread title, 1961 - but I can't leave out the last of the S&DJR Johnson 0-4-4Ts can I? (Craftsman kit, not the forthcoming RTR). Regards, John Isherwood. Edited December 17, 2017 by cctransuk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cctransuk Posted December 17, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 John, I have a set of half plate photographs taken towards the end and soon after closure. Full of detail. I can't remember the name of the photographer but I think they passed to the trust after his death. They will be invaluable and a must, if you don't already have them. Bob No, Bob, I don't have them. It astonishes me every time I see evidence that RMweb members, with no acquaintance with the OP whatsoever, are so generous with their time, knowledge and property. My new thread today, (created mainly due to our cat, Shadow, being ill; and me consequently not being motivated to concentrate on modelling), has been a perfect demonstration of the open-heartedness of this group. Thanks to you all, John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RBAGE Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 Rather than information being power, it's actually for sharing, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 I'm tempted to agree with the previous comments about strait track, in just 17.5ft I have a nice revers curve that ads both flow and length to the view IMHO. 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cctransuk Posted December 17, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 I'm tempted to agree with the previous comments about strait track, in just 17.5ft I have a nice revers curve that ads both flow and length to the view IMHO. South Yard 6 005.JPG South Yard 6 001.JPG I don't disagree - but if I am to retain a comfortable operating well - where two operators can pass - and also accommodate the station / yard trackwork together with the storage yard (which is a prerequisite) - it's straights I'm afraid. ..... unless you can show me how? Regards, John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cctransuk Posted December 17, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2017 Mundane, but characterful - the containers :- CONTAINER STOCKLIST ORIGIN TYPE DESCRIPTION / LOAD DIAGRAM NUMBER BR A SMALL COVERED, 4T. 3/001 A 186B BR A SMALL COVERED, 4T. 3/001 A1498B BR B LARGE COVERED, 4T, PLYWOOD 3/049 B ? B KIT BR B LARGE COVERED, 4T, PLYWOOD 3/049 B ? B KIT BR BD LARGE COVERED, 4T, M/BOARD 3/050 BD49356B KIT BR BD LARGE COVERED, 4T, M/BOARD 3/052 BD5246B BR BA LARGE COVERED, 10T, ALUMIN 3/075 BA4326B KIT BR BC LARGE COVERED, 4T, M/BOARD 3/100 B ? B KIT BR BM LARGE VENTILATED, 4T,(MEAT) 3/150 BM ? B KIT BR FM LARGE INSULATED, 4T, (MEAT) 3/201 FM13076B BR FM LARGE INSULATED, 4T, (MEAT) 3/201 FM13158B BR F LARGE INSULATED, 4T, (EGG BOXES) 3/202 F 12899B KIT BR AF SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. 3/250 AF16048B BR AFU SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. 3/251 AFU16092B BR AF SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. 3/252 AF16400B BR AFU SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. 3/253 AFU16302B BR AFU SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. 3/253 AFU16320B BR AFU SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. 3/253 AFU16327B BR AFU SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. 3/253 AFU16430B BR AFU SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. 3/253 AFU16457B BR AFU SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. 3/253 AFU65178B BR AFP MEDIUM REFRIGERATED, 4T, BIRDS EYE 3/256 AFP66352B BR AFP MEDIUM REFRIGERATED, 4T, BIRDS EYE 3/256 AFP66357B BR AFP MEDIUM REFRIGERATED, 4T, BIRDS EYE 3/256 AFP66368B BR AFP MEDIUM REFRIGERATED, 4T, BIRDS EYE 3/256 AFP66370B BR AFP MEDIUM REFRIGERATED, 4T, BIRDS EYE (FIBREGLASS) 3/257 AFP16495B KIT BR AFP MEDIUM REFRIGERATED, 4T, BIRDS EYE (FIBREGLASS) 3/257 AFP16496B KIT BR AFX SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3.5T. 3/300 AFX16512B BR L SMALL MINERAL HOPPER, 4T. 3/450 L ? B KIT BR L SMALL MINERAL HOPPER, 4T. 3/450 L ? B KIT BR L SMALL MINERAL HOPPER, 4T. 3/450 L ? B KIT BR L SMALL MINERAL HOPPER, 4T. 3/450 L ? B KIT BR L SMALL MINERAL HOPPER, 4T. 3/450 L ? B KIT BR L SMALL MINERAL HOPPER, 4T. 3/450 L ? B KIT BR L SMALL MINERAL HOPPER, 4T. 3/450 L ? B KIT BR L SMALL MINERAL HOPPER, 4T. 3/450 L ? B KIT BR L SMALL MINERAL HOPPER, 4T. 3/450 L ? B KIT BR L SMALL MINERAL HOPPER, 4T. 3/450 L17253B BR L SMALL MINERAL HOPPER, 4T. 3/450 L17423B BR L SMALL MINERAL HOPPER, 4T. 3/450 L17429B BR S SMALL SUNDRIES, 3T. 3/660 S95018B BR S SMALL SUNDRIES, 3T. 3/660 S95213B GWR AF SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. AF4 AF3051W GWR BK LARGE COVERED, 4T. BK2 BK1829W GWR BK LARGE COVERED, 4T. BK2 BK1847W GWR BK LARGE COVERED, 4T. BK2 BK1850W GWR BK LARGE COVERED, 4T. BK2 BK1869W KIT GWR BP LARGE COVERED, 1.5T. BP1 BP1723W GWR BP LARGE COVERED, 1.5T. BP1 BP1724W KIT GWR BP LARGE COVERED, 1.5T. BP1 BP1726W KIT LMS A SMALL COVERED, 3T, PLYWOOD 18 A2264M LMS A SMALL COVERED, 3T, M/BOARD 19 A2298M LMS BD LARGE COVERED, 4T, M/BOARD 63 BD1814M LMS BD LARGE COVERED, 4T, M/BOARD 66 BD3198M LMS BM LARGE VENTILATED, 4T,(MEAT) 152 BM ? M KIT LMS BR LARGE INSUL/VENT, 4T,(MEAT) 176 BR ? M KIT LMS FM LARGE INSULATED, 4T, (MEAT) 207 FM872M LMS AF SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. 227 AF7M B734575 LMS AF SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. 227 AF9M B734576 LMS DX LARGE OPEN, 4T. 333 DX788M LNER FM LARGE INSULATED, 4T, (MEAT) 15 FM28E LNER FM LARGE INSULATED, 4T, (MEAT) 15 FM30E LNER DX LARGE OPEN, 4T. 32 DX645E LNER AF SMALL REFRIGERATED, 3T. 227 (LMS) AF2046E Regards, John Isherwood. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RBAGE Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 Where do you keep it all? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted December 18, 2017 Share Posted December 18, 2017 (edited) I don't disagree - but if I am to retain a comfortable operating well - where two operators can pass - and also accommodate the station / yard trackwork together with the storage yard (which is a prerequisite) - it's straights I'm afraid. ..... unless you can show me how? Regards, John Isherwood. John, Mine that you see in the above pic is only 2 ft 6 inches wide, if that helps you. Edited December 18, 2017 by Andrew P Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cctransuk Posted December 18, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 18, 2017 John, Mine that yo see in the above pic is only 2 ft 6 inches wide, if that helps you. Andrew, My operating space would be 1200mm. wide (approx 4ft.). However, within that space I will need to have a generously wide loft ladder / access hatch. The sizeable items that will need to be taken into the loft, plus age / mobility considerations as I get older, incline me to keep the central area quite spacious, so that it can be used as a work area during baseboard construction. I don't want to be backwards and forwards between the garage and the loft! The bottom line is that I need a running environment for my stock collection. If it can evoke the spirit of EJ, and operate a sequence something akin to the prototype if I so choose, I'll be more than pleased. The finished layout will be pretty much for my eyes, and those of the family only; if it looks a bit 'train-setty', I can live with that. The trackplan above is very much an exercise in establishing how much of EJ can be reproduced using standard Peco products. It may well turn out that I could introduce a curve through the station - though at the expense of tighter radii at each end. Nothing is set in stone; when and if the baseboards are in-situ, I will be able to tell if there is scope for tweaking the trackplan to give somethin more 'sweeping'. Meanwhile I play around with coloured rectangles, representing locos and trains, on the digital trackplan in order to get a feel of what the storage and siding areas can cope with. Not the same as driving the real thing, but it does give a feel for how the layout might operate. Regards, John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffP Posted December 18, 2017 Share Posted December 18, 2017 Andrew: I'm searching for a "WOW!!!" button for your model! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted December 18, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 18, 2017 (edited) John, maybe a compromise could be thus- Reduce the fiddle by a few tracks and plan for cassettes and spurs from which to load from the cassetes.This reduces the width of the FY side. Then you can tweak you atraight through station to a slight and sweeping curve, convex towards the operating well/concave to the top of your drawing. It would only need to be (say) 80 to 100 mm at the centre of the curve or a bit less if you just went for a reverse curve at one end only. It really is worth having a play but keeping it simple as you intended; I was persuaded about the sweeping crves and I only have 24' length but retain 30" approximately min curves at the ends. Phil Edited December 18, 2017 by Mallard60022 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cctransuk Posted December 18, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 18, 2017 John, maybe a compromise could be thus- Reduce the fiddle by a few tracks and plan for cassettes and spurs from which to load from the cassetes.This reduces the width of the FY side. Then you can tweak you atraight through station to a slight and sweeping curve, convex towards the operating well/concave to the top of your drawing. It would only need to be (say) 80 to 100 mm at the centre of the curve or a bit less if you just went for a reverse curve at one end only. It really is worth having a play but keeping it simple as you intended; I was persuaded about the sweeping crves and I only have 24' length but retain 30" approximately min curves at the ends. Img_0663.jpg Phil Phil, There is much merit in what you suggest - the end radii are currently 1100mm. (43"). I'd like to keep the stock storage on-track if at all possible - at least as far as the 'prototypical' stock is concerned. I'd like to be able to go up to the loft and run trains with the minimum of fuss. The idea of a convex baseboard edge had not occurred to me, and it may be possible to make this change without affecting the storage area. It could be incorporated by projecting it forward, above the central portion of the intended supporting structure / storage cupboards. In fact, it would create an overhang below which it could be possible to locate the control panel for the scenic area tracks. There is a LOT of development work to do yet, but the curve through the station is something I'd like to incorporate, if it can be done without having toy-train overhangs on the curves at each end of the layout. Regards, John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted December 18, 2017 Share Posted December 18, 2017 John, Make sure you have a good FIRE EXTINGUISHER up there. I was in my old Loft Layout many years ago and smelt something funny, when I turned around, the Florescent Light above the escape hatch was on FIRE, there IS only one way out normally, although I see your having Velux as well though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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