Insurance for your collection

[Dan Griffin]

I am planning on building a new layout, again in my garage when my thoughts have turned to insurance.

 

I have found one company online who deals solely with model railways but I thought id ask who people use on here to insure the layouts/collections, especially those housed in garages/sheds ect.

 

regards

 

dan

[yelrow]

Put it on your Household cover. Mine is on all risks, with photos . john

[smokebox]

Household insurance may be all you need but check with your insurer that they will cover it in the garage. Some will cover outbuildings and some won't, some will provide cover at extra cost. They may want extra security adding.

[77philg]

 Depends how much your collection is worth ,some house policy's only offer £2500 for contents of the garage . http://www.towergatepartners.co.uk/walker-midgley-brokers/home/  I have insured through these for both my 00 gauge  and 16mm garden rail collection and also have a separate house policy  by another company. I found that the house policy might have a maximum £5000 large item which you declare up front.  But a layout with all the time parts etc involved to make and replace could be £20,000 -£40,000 .Hence will not be covered, the burglars tend to do a lot of damage to the layout rather than nick it removing what they can etc. Phil

[yelrow]

Any Household name company will not only cover garage, but allow you to set your upper limits. Worked with  a major company, myself. There may well be an increased premium, but you are always better to have your house and buildings with same company. £20-40k, sounds very excessive to me. They need photos, and a expert valuation, to reach theses levels.

[Andy Hayter]

20 - 40k expensive?

 

Try getting a professional to replace a garage sized fully scenic-ed layout.  The man hours involved makes the cost high even if the intrinsic value of individual items might be low.  And in the event of major destruction, I don't see it unwarranted to get a professional in to repair/replace what may be a lifetime's worth of your own work.

[DCB]

The problem is valuation,much the same as with classic cars. Often Layouts come up on ebay for about a couple of hundred quid. Layouts which have taken hundreds of hours to construct and they don't sell.

I tried to sell an N gauge layout I had restored, someone bid £20 and didn't collect.  I stripped out the points and got more than £20 for them recycled the board and still have most of the flexi track.   That layout had a lot of love lavished on it before it was chucked in a skip when the owner died but no one wanted it.

With classic cars you can get an agreed value policy, but they appreciate in value.

Model Railways depreciate, like a stone if you buy new. 33% as you leave the discount store, points 75% as soon as you lay them. Many modern locos have a limited service life, Mazak Rot killed lots of early Hornby Dublo such as Duchess of Atholl wheels and lots of 2000s Hornby Locos, motor and axle failures killed most Mainline locos  many of which remain in collections as non runners so a loss adjusters task is not going to be easy after a fire or theft.

As for paying a professional, I wish you the best of luck finding one who can work to less than a 1% error.

I wouldn't get too excited about insurance.  Get a decent alarm.  I would suggest several screech alarms actually in the shed with strobe lights so the burglars are thoroughly disorientated and most of your neighbours are busy dialling 999 to complain.

Lets face it If you do insure your collection and the shed burns down the wife isn't going to let you replace it is she?  Oh no it will be a romantic cruise or a trip to the states / Australia/ NZ/ Kenya/ Mumbai to see the relations you can't stand!

[APOLLO]

I use Magnet insurance.

 

http://www.modelrailwayinsurance.co.uk/

 

Brit15

[yelrow]

I have never heard of burglars targetting model rail layouts. New stock in a model shop, perhaps. No self respecting burglar, would want secondhand locos, etc. Would be good to be a fly on the wall, when you tell your insurer, you want cover for £40,000, for your layout. Mine wanted a list of everything, when new, plus ages, and photos.  Secondhand layouts, go begging on ebay, nobody wants them. You get more by selling bits off.   I agree, cover is needed, but not whilst wearing rose tinted glasses. No insurer, will give betterment. john

[Fenman]

... No insurer, will give betterment.

I mostly agree with you, but isn’t a “new for old” replacement policy not technically “betterment”?

 

Paul

[Andymsa]

The problem with house hold insurance is that they don't have a full understanding on collectors insurance, and generally the full value of a layout is not covered. It becomes more difficult if it is a shed or outbuilding as you will find that any amount will be only a fraction of the layout cost. Also how do you cover things like scenic materials, once used they have no actual value but still cost to replace. These items have a replacement cost but again household insurance don't really understand this.

 

My layout is insured with a specialist who understands the collectors market, and it's not insured for market value but actual cost to buy specific items. I have an extensive spreadsheet that they have accepted as evidence. Another factor that has to be taken into account is that you constantly add to the value so this has to be taken into account

 

Andy

[The Fatadder]

My last insurance policy (Lloyd’s) covered the garage to the tune of something like 5k. However it came at a cost, and the renewal was something like £150 more than the alternative for the same cover (excluding the garage)

 

I got a collection policy from Magnet for about £70

 

My concern is probably loss due to fire rather than theft, but I want full cover to at least be able to outsource as much as possible rebuilding a lot of improved or kit built stock. Not to mention repairs to the layout itself.

 

Look at Kingstorr as an example, after the fire a lot of the layout was sent to specialist art restorers by the insurance company for repair which saved a lot of the layout.

[polybear]

I have never heard of burglars targetting model rail layouts. New stock in a model shop, perhaps. No self respecting burglar, would want secondhand locos, etc. Would be good to be a fly on the wall, when you tell your insurer, you want cover for £40,000, for your layout. Mine wanted a list of everything, when new, plus ages, and photos.  Secondhand layouts, go begging on ebay, nobody wants them. You get more by selling bits off.   I agree, cover is needed, but not whilst wearing rose tinted glasses. No insurer, will give betterment. john

 

A friend pretty much his entire collection recently to burglars - he'd been building kitbuilt since the 60's in both 4mm and 7mm Gauges.  Replacement value in the order of 75K...

[ardbealach]

I recently put together a spreadsheet listing all my stock.  Firstly it surprised me just how much stock I had, and when I add in the replacement costs, based on Hattons website prices, I was even more astounded.  I have also taken into account EM'ing the stock and replacement wheels in the cost.  And then there are the kit built locomotives no longer available and even the out of the box Hornby and Bachmann no longer listed, which could not be replaced.

 

So it is really stock replacement value that I am looking at for insurance purposes should there be a complete wipe out.  And I haven't even added in the cost of the replacement of the DCC installation and scenery on the layout with scratch built buildings / track point motors etc etc etc.

 

If there should be a complete wipe out, I reckon I would start again in another gauge, or layout theme anyway.  And the insurance money would go some way to offset starting again.

 

My layout is special to me and I suppose not to anyone else.  It therefore has little real financial value.  More so with the stock having EM'ed wheels and Sprat and Winkle couplings. which makes it a bit specialist and not really suitable for out of the box 00. 

[polybear]

My layout is special to me and I suppose not to anyone else.  It therefore has little real financial value.  . 

 

There's a big difference between what it would sell for on Ebay and what it's replacement value is for insurance purposes.  For example, a decent DJH A1 kitbuild may sell for £150 - 250 on Ebay on a good day; however to have one replaced would involve all components (£300+ ?) plus a pro build and paint.  So the wrong side of a grand without trying.

[yelrow]

It would be interesting to get the Insurance  companies view, or hear from anyone who has had a payout, as i still think many are in for a nasty shock. john

[Colin_McLeod]

Regarding layouts not selling on e bay because no one wants someone elses layout: this is not really the point here. In the case of loss the owner DOES want the layout replaced so it is the replacement cost and not the secondhand value that is important.

[ardbealach]

I suspect that an insurance company is not going to pay for brand new model replacement - after all once the wagon / coach is out of its box and sitting on the model railway track it becomes second hand - like a motor car when it leaves the showroom?   The problem is actually putting a figure on 'the replacement value', more so for a kit built locomotive - and more so if the model is no longer in production.   

 

If I added up the hours I have spent on tracklaying / scenery / and the like, even at a minimum wage / hour - it would amount to a very large sum.  A sum which could not be valued.  One modeller might well take twice as long as another modeller for a particular modelling exercise, which would again reflect on that very large sum.

 

Maybe someone from Magnet Insurance - who specialises in model railway insurance - might have read this thread and give us their thoughts on all of this.

 

Insurance premiums are like the government spending on defence.  You have to pay out in the hope you will never need to call on it. 

[DaveF]

I suspect that an insurance company is not going to pay for brand new model replacement - after all once the wagon / coach is out of its box and sitting on the model railway track it becomes second hand - like a motor car when it leaves the showroom?   The problem is actually putting a figure on 'the replacement value', more so for a kit built locomotive - and more so if the model is no longer in production.   

 

If I added up the hours I have spent on tracklaying / scenery / and the like, even at a minimum wage / hour - it would amount to a very large sum.  A sum which could not be valued.  One modeller might well take twice as long as another modeller for a particular modelling exercise, which would again reflect on that very large sum.

 

Maybe someone from Magnet Insurance - who specialises in model railway insurance - might have read this thread and give us their thoughts on all of this.

 

Insurance premiums are like the government spending on defence.  You have to pay out in the hope you will never need to call on it. 

 

 

If you look at the Magnet website, which has already been given, but I will repeat it: 

 

http://www.modelrail...nsurance.co.uk/

 

Youu will find a menu along the top, one part of it gives a summary of cover which some of the people who have posted here may find interesting reading regarding exactly what is covered.

 

I should add I happen to have my model railway insurance with them, but have no connection with them apart from that.

 

David

Edited May 27, 2018 by DaveF

[Andy Hayter]

It would be interesting to get the Insurance  companies view, or hear from anyone who has had a payout, as i still think many are in for a nasty shock. john

 

I agree this time John.  I think many are in for a shock should the worst happen.  I disagreed when you expressed surprise at the cost of refurbishing a trashed layout.  I now agree because I think many thought as you do.  It's only a layout a hundred notes for wood, £2-300 for track a bit for scenic and forgetting the 1000s of man hours which is the fun - unless you have to do it all over again.  So if you tell the insurance company your layout is worth £1000 (or include it in items under a set value), that is the maximum you are likely to get back.  Perhaps that is a benefit of using specialist insurance who might understand the true costs of refurbishment - although I have no personal experience.

 

As to the point of thieves targeting model shops - yes thieves on the look out for model railway equipment will target shops.   However the thief breaking into your garage is more likely to be looking for anything that they think they can make money on, and if it's not power tools, a ride on mower, a motor bike etc then some new looking boxes of Hornby will do as second best.

[Andy Y]

I have never heard of burglars targetting model rail layouts.

Cases of targetting, I would agree, are rare but there are numerous cases of opportunist burglars filling their swag bag with locos from layouts as they are fairly easily moved on (experience has shown that the occasional model shop isn't too fussy on the source of low-priced items they can make a profit on) and represent reasonable value by volume. Often there has been incidental damage.

 

A decent collection or layout is worthy of protection and cover.

[yelrow]

Its one thing to get it covered for a figure that you think represents your time, but totally another, when the claim is progressed. High premiums, paid over many years with no claims, are fine for peace of mind. happen you can afford the cover.  . Down to personal choice/ income. If it helps you sleep better at night, thinking your insurer will cover 1000 hours of labour,  so be it. john

[polybear]

Regarding layouts not selling on e bay because no one wants someone elses layout: this is not really the point here. In the case of loss the owner DOES want the layout replaced so it is the replacement cost and not the secondhand value that is important.

 

There's the added problem when looking at layouts for sale on ebay is their physical size.  It was mentioned very recently on RMWeb that Ambergate sold for £250 on Ebay - the photos looked stunning.  I'm sure many of us would've loved to purchase it at that price (at four times the price it would still be a bargain).  However the physical size makes it a no-no for most.

[Andymsa]

I suspect that an insurance company is not going to pay for brand new model replacement - after all once the wagon / coach is out of its box and sitting on the model railway track it becomes second hand - like a motor car when it leaves the showroom?   The problem is actually putting a figure on 'the replacement value', more so for a kit built locomotive - and more so if the model is no longer in production.   

 

If I added up the hours I have spent on tracklaying / scenery / and the like, even at a minimum wage / hour - it would amount to a very large sum.  A sum which could not be valued.  One modeller might well take twice as long as another modeller for a particular modelling exercise, which would again reflect on that very large sum.

 

Maybe someone from Magnet Insurance - who specialises in model railway insurance - might have read this thread and give us their thoughts on all of this.

 

Insurance premiums are like the government spending on defence.  You have to pay out in the hope you will never need to call on it.

 

A couple of points I would like to comment on, when I brought my new car for the first year it was a complete replacement if stolen.

 

As to replacement items, most insurance will base there payout on market values. But it is specificity mention in my policy that it is insured for actual purchased cost. This includes everything from grass scatters to rolling stock. I have a spread sheet with everything on it in fact it's quite frightening what things cost certainty an eye opener.

 

Andy

[yelrow]

Are you able to reveal annual cost/ value. As this cover is not cheap. John