Which diesel locomotives had great performance and bad within their classes?

[SouthernBlue80s]

Being involved with cars for years, race and road, some engines are built better than others.

 

So when it came to diesel locomotives which ones within there classes were known to be as tough as old boots and could pull more than they should or go faster than they should? Which ones were known to be the unreliable dogs?

 

What prompted me to post this is that I saw a post on Facebook about 47555. It hit 114mph at some point, one driver said he had to start a heavy train on a bank and he thought the thing was going to blow up but it moved. It was a brilliant loco a real tough one.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/39670739@N05/5653185181/in/photolist-8QPkMo-FJCvCi-gBi21D-fD6Dyy-bfsf9z-8Pb5JC-9By412-9UjujS-fKDJjH-raVr4W-qrxXjM-9UgGcT-eE8uXu-a8oQj6-oV9UfY-c2LceE-oH5PkF-roe259-kF4HUx-aE45Yv-eEsrCf-7FZaGY-kcnE4v-bz3SsT-9PfKyv-23n6zSK-jGYQPG-fpbAyr-fpst8W-fKWms7-7cAL5K-rRe8Uj-jDt7VM-nLLeTr-bLC2tP-VGxtbP-aCDGqA-9RBMe4-bBRH5Z-dBPKjK-b1pXiM-9UjuTq-dNPdRn-9BAYrq-9igsZ5-dxKR1L-6Vwqcx-aZmuUZ-bAjf3X-qK61Ff

 

Conversely Stratford´s 47006 was known to be a right dog for years.

 

Any of you foot plate men and bashers remember what was tough or not.

How about class 50s or class 33s? Or any thing else for that matter?

 

Cheers

Steve

Edited August 5, 2018 by SouthernBlue80s

[Titan]

Class 55 tended to vary quite a bit.  Because the power units were substantially down rated for rail use, if the governors were not adjusted correctly the usual result was that they would develop more power than they should. There was a time when the power units were accidentally being set to deliver 1,800bhp each, due to someone looking up the wrong figures from the Napier specifications.  When the error was discovered it was decided that they would just let the affected locos run with it since it did not appear to be having an impact on reliability!

 

This even occurred into preservation, 55019 was nick named 'rocket ship' as it pulled noticeably harder than 55009. When the DPS built their own load bank out of a spare class 86 brake resistor bank and were able to measure the hp accurately, they discovered that the power units were developing nearly 2,000bhp each... Funnily enough despite this it was the more reliable of the two. However,  as the societies main aim is preservation, it was decided to adjust them back down to 1,650bhp each, and from then on it was a bit more "normal" in performance!

[Rugd1022]

50 024 and 50 033 were both excellent performers when I had them in the early '80s, it's quite strange really when you consider the EE lumps were moved from one class member to another. 50 039 was by far the worst of the Old Oak batch, it was forever sat outside the Factory awaiting parts or attention. 47 484 'IKB' was always on good form, as were most of the WR named batch. 

[SouthernBlue80s]

50 024 and 50 033 were both excellent performers when I had them in the early '80s, it's quite strange really when you consider the EE lumps were moved from one class member to another. 50 039 was by far the worst of the Old Oak batch, it was forever sat outside the Factory awaiting parts or attention. 47 484 'IKB' was always on good form, as were most of the WR named batch. 

 

Thanks. Very interesting.

I had heard previously that engines in 50s were moved about a bit. I wonder if this happened with other larger classes?

Edited August 5, 2018 by SouthernBlue80s

[black and decker boy]

Once BR adopted CEM overhauls in the mid 80s then all

Major components were swapped at F, G & H exam. The old components being refurbed for use in a subsequent loco. It reduced downtime.

 

The same approach is used today, eg. Freightliner took a class 90 out if traffic to surrender spares including bogies so the rest of he class could be overhauled with minimum fosnykme. That last loco though was the one stored at the start.

 

HST power units have been swapped around for a long time as level 5 depots did the swaps even though the PU work was still outsourced (eg Crewe works).

Edited August 5, 2018 by black and decker boy

[Rugd1022]

It was common practice across most classes really, the larger workshops were geared up for component overhaul to allow a freshly overhauled engine to be dropped into a loco as soon as possible.

[Titan]

Thanks. Very interesting.

I had heard previously that engines in 50s were moved about a bit. I wonder if this happened with other larger classes?

 

The policy changed over the years. To begin with the large medium speed engines tended to be kept with their respective locos. The whole locomotive was overhauled, during which time the engine would be removed, overhauled and returned to the loco. The high speed engines - Deltics and presumably Maybachs too, had a much shorter working life so engine swaps with an overhauled unit were the norm, to get the loco back in service quickly.

 

Later on CEM (Component Exchange Maintenance) became the norm, and when a locomotive needed an overhauled engine the next available was fitted irrespective of what it came out of.

[PM47079]

The same approach is used today, eg. Freightliner took a class 90 out if traffic to surrender spares including bogies so the rest of he class could be overhauled with minimum fosnykme. That last loco though was the one stored at the start.

 

It was just the bogies that had the overhaul. Not the loco. That's why 90041 was kept at Leeds midland Road. So it wasn't robbed while out of traffic.

I have noticed with some 66s that some go better than others. The shanks one and 66540 are reckoned by many to be weak locos.

[Rugd1022]

The same approach is used today, eg. Freightliner took a class 90 out if traffic to surrender spares including bogies so the rest of he class could be overhauled with minimum fosnykme. That last loco though was the one stored at the start.

 

It was just the bogies that had the overhaul. Not the loco. That's why 90041 was kept at Leeds midland Road. So it wasn't robbed while out of traffic.

I have noticed with some 66s that some go better than others. The shanks one and 66540 are reckoned by many to be weak locos.

 

I've noticed this with 66s too - some are woefully bad while others are as strong as an ox - I had 66 958 this morning on a ballast turn and it performed fantastically well going up Desborough bank on the Midland. It also had excellent suspension compared to most of the others I've driven.

[Phil Bullock]

The WR selected a "Golden Stud" of Westerns when it introduced the Golden Hind - IIRC D1010 was one of them, always had a reputation for being a good un.

 

Quite why that should be when she will have been the equivalent of Triggers broom throughout her life - many engine and transmission swaps

 

Cheers

 

Phil

[Davexoc]

What prompted me to post this is that I saw a post on Facebook about 47555. It hit 114mph at some point, one driver said he had to start a heavy train on a bank and he thought the thing was going to blow up but it moved. It was a brilliant loco a real tough one.

I would question the speedo there. We had a 47 that had a history of low power in it's book. A trial run uncovered normal enough readings on charge air, fuel pressure and main generator amps, with all stages of field diversion working. A check of the wheel wear compensator revealed that the indicated 85MPH was nearer an actual 105MPH.

Won't go over 85MPH wasn't the full story, it was never late on arrival.

 

Dave

[russ p]

I think most of the 47s I've been on the speedo only goes to 100mph apparently some will go beyond this not that I would know about this! but can't think they are too accurate where the scale stops

[Dunsignalling]

50 046 Ajax was widely reckoned to be the best of the Hoovers, certainly in their last few years.

 

A good rule of thumb was that the tatty looking ones got that way because they were seldom stopped for anything major and the bright shiny ones got regular repaints/touch-ups because they were in and out of works like a fiddler's elbow.

 

John

[Dunsignalling]

I think most of the 47s I've been on the speedo only goes to 100mph apparently some will go beyond this not that I would know about this! but can't think they are too accurate where the scale stops

A late pal of mine stop-watched one coming down Mallard's old stamping ground at 117mph and he wasn't usually too far out.

 

John.

[russ p]

A late pal of mine stop-watched one coming down Mallard's old stamping ground at 117mph and he wasn't usually too far out.

 

John.

How long ago was that? he says nervously!!!

[Dunsignalling]

How long ago was that? he says nervously!!!

 

1980s, it was on one of the Honiton Round Table long-distance excursions, but It would take me a fair bit of digging through my notes to identify the tour and loco.

 

John

Edited August 5, 2018 by Dunsignalling

[russ p]

Breathing easier again!

[Zomboid]

I remember reading somewhere that D403 and D426 were pretty poor back when they were running on the WCML. Using them as a pair was asking for trouble.

 

Can't recall the source now, so could be nonsense.

[russ p]

We still have loco's that are better than others ,37419 is a very good loco and shouts very loudly about its performance, closely followed by 409 which is a superb loco

[great central]

The same with units, we had one, went like the proverbial off the shovel, always waiting time with it. After it had a replacement engine, having blown the other up, it was one of the worst performers couldn't keep time.

[The Johnster]

Canton's Hymeks were noticeably dividable into the early D7030 series that had been thrashed to death in their early years trying to replicate King performances on the Paddingtons with 13 coach loads, and the D7090 series that were much better!  

 

I once timed a 50 at 114mph continuously between Cholsey and Moulsford and Pangbourne, with 8 on, the fastest run I ever had with loco hauled stock; this was in the 80s.  Can't remember which one it was, now.

Edited August 6, 2018 by The Johnster

[guzzler17]

I think most of the 47s I've been on the speedo only goes to 100mph apparently some will go beyond this not that I would know about this! but can't think they are too accurate where the scale stops

 

In 1983 I was on a late running Brighton - Manchester service, a fairly full load 8, hauled by 47436 and it racked up miles of +100mph running along the GWML.

 

Around 1986/87 47602 was always worth a trip behind.  From a standing start at Totnes with a summer Saturday load 12 ex-Newquay the minimum at Dainton was 37.5mph.  I've got all of the data so I suppose I should work out the horsepower it produced.

[Chris M]

The Western Loco Association guys reckon Ranger was much stronger than Courier, but not at the moment. It will be interesting to see how Ranger runs when back in action.

[Chris M]

There is certainly a lot of variation with cars. Back in the eighties our office had two identical cars. One went like a rocket but the other was very tame. The tame one had a much better heater though.

Some years later I handed in a one year old diesel and replaced it with another of the same model. A few miles down the road I had to stop to check it was the right car as I couldn’t believe it was a diesel. This one always ran like the wind and had to be held back to somewhere near the speed limits.

Edited August 6, 2018 by Chris M

[Hinckley_Wolf]

An old friend who drove for RES always rated 47471 as a rocket ship despite being a little worn