Etched wagon kits - where to begin?

[brossard]

If you build enough kits you end up with a large conglomeration of spares.  Don't throw away the fret waste, useful for all sorts of things.

 

John

[ianLMS]

I haven't tried one of these yet, but they look a reasonable source of MR and LNWR wagons which may have lasted into the last years of the LMS. Note that some of them are resin kits but there are a few etched kits as well.

 

https://www.mousa.biz/fourmm/wagons/lnwr_wagons4.html

 

I am sure someone on here can advise if they are god kits, well designed and easy to put together. I might try a couple myself!

Ian

Edited June 11, 2020 by ianLMS

[Paul Cram]

I have built the Dia 352 wagon. The only issue was the 3d printed buffers were 2 deep for the springs so I replaced them with turned brass.

[brossard]

I think Bill said he moved away from etched brass in favour of printed resin.  I built a pair of etched brass GWR Dia P4 ballast wagons ages ago and they came out well:

 

 

BR departmental "livery".

 

John

Edited June 11, 2020 by brossard

[Compound2632]

I have built a number of Bill Bedford / Mousa resin / printed kits. The first resin ones e.g. the LNWR D32 van were superb; the printed resin ones have now reached the same standard. There's really not a great deal of assembly required.

 

I've had a go at a couple of the earlier etched brass kits; both quite fiddly - but that's the nature of the beast - one I've completed and was perfectly happy with apart from one small error in the etch - a minor detail; the other has languished a bit; I really should re-visit it.

 

Bill did make the comment quite recently, I think on my wagon-building thread, that he's given up on etching (except for the etched axleguards etc. for the resin kits, I suppose). He's certainly busy turning out the 3D printed kits.

 

But the bulk of his recent output is pre-Grouping stuff that would have gone to the breakers by the OP's preferred period - which is actually pretty well-served by injection-moulded plastic kits, though there are some notable gaps.

Edited June 11, 2020 by Compound2632

[Nick Holliday]

On 10 June 2020 at 19:56, Compound2632 said:

He's said, last ten years of the grouping era. A high proportion of the etched wagon market has been of pre-grouping types, as the technique is well-suited to small batch production of types that are unlikely to be of mass-market interest. To an increasing extent, this niche is being occupied by 3D printed / resin kits.

What about a Caledonian 6-wheeled NPCS kit.  I expect the chassis will be a bit of a challenge, although I haven't built the one I've got in the pile, but they lasted into BR days, and a CCT or similar might be found anywhere. https://caley.com/npcs.php 

[brossard]

Bill Bedford, again, has a center axle design for 6 wheel vans that is shockingly simple.  A 2mm length of brass tube to match the wheel gauge and a length of 1mm steel rod is all that is required.  The wheels are mounted on the brass rod and the steel rod is threaded into the tube and sits on pin point bearings.

 

John

[Torper]

I thought that this topic would be a fairly easy one to answer, but then I had a look at the rolling stock on my own layout.  Most of it is kit built, almost all the coaches from etched brass.  But I don't think there's a singe etched brass example among all my freight stock.  Most are plastic (usually with a lump of lead secreted somewhere), some are whitemetal, a few are RTR, but there's not a single etched brass one, though there are a few with etched brass underframes that I've substituted for the originals.  So the OP's quest may be just a little bit harder than was initially thought.  Incidentally, the Caley 6-wheel CCT, while a perfectly decent kit, is quite complicated!

 

DT

[SP Steve]

On 09/06/2020 at 22:22, Alex TM said:

Hi folks,

 

One outcome of another thread I started was the suggestion that I begin learning etched kit construction by commencing with a wagon.  Where would those of you knowledgeable in such things suggest would be a good place to start?  If it's of use I would be working in 00, and looking for something that would be running during 1938-1947.

 

[As an aside, I like the look of some of the MR, LNWR, and LYR brake vans as produces by London Road Models - would they be suitable?]

 

Thanks in advance for any pointers.

 

Regards,

 

Alex.

 

 

macgeordie of this here parish came up with a kit for six wheeled Palethorpes Sausage vans to LMS D1955 which also covered two experimental Cream/Milk Vans to D1936 (38550/1).

 

His kits are very well thought out and you have the bonus of being able to contact him via RMweb so might be worth dropping him a PM to check for availability.

 

Relevant thread can be found at:

 

https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/148083-lms-palethorpes-6-wheel-van/

[Guy Rixon]

Rumney models kits are held to be rather good; e.g. 4-wheel steel-carrying wagons. A kit that is well-designed but complex may be easier than one that is simple but of lesser quality.

 

A kit for a 4-wheeled item of NPCS might actually be easier than a wagon as it's less likely to have soldered overlays.

[Torper]

They're good kits but the underframes and assorted gubbins can be extremely complicated and could well put a novice builder off for life.

 

I've been so taken with that Severn Models lineside hut that I referred to earlier that I've gone and ordered one!

 

DT

Edited June 12, 2020 by Torper

[Alex TM]

Hi again,

 

The original question originally came about after I had asked about building a 'High Level Kits' chassis for the Lanky Pug (Aspinall 21 class); the advice I was given was try an etched wagon kit first.

 

The response to my initial post have taken off in quite a different direction from what I had hoped, though it's one that has proved both interesting and extremely helpful.  It's got me looking into things that I would  not otherwise have considered.

 

Once more, thanks for your ideas, insight, and encouragement.

 

Regards,

 

Alex.

 

 

[PenrithBeacon]

My experience is that etched wagons are not the best place to start making etched kits, in fact it's my belief that etched brass is, usually, an inappropriate medium for wagon kits. There are, I think, exceptions to this, but not many. Neither are the HL kits appropriate for a beginner, they're much too complex.

 

I believe Branchlines do a chassis kit for the Aspinall Pug, an email to sales@branchlines.com will help

 

Regards

[MartinWales]

On 09/06/2020 at 23:12, MartinWales said:

Alex- LRM have printed a very useful pamphlet for those about to start in etched brass construction.

 

Well worth obtaining1

I have a copy, if you're having difficulty obtaining one! 

[Steamport Southport]

2 hours ago, PenrithBeacon said:

My experience is that etched wagons are not the best place to start making etched kits, in fact it's my belief that etched brass is, usually, an inappropriate medium for wagon kits. There are, I think, exceptions to this, but not many. Neither are the HL kits appropriate for a beginner, they're much too complex.

 

I believe Branchlines do a chassis kit for the Aspinall Pug, an email to sales@branchlines.com will help

 

Regards

 

I'm afraid the Branchlines chassis is for the Caledonian Pug.

 

 

 

Jason

[brossard]

Just having a think and wondering what the imperative is for etched brass wagons.  Is it because you want to do a brass kit?  A very laudable thing indeed.

 

However, if you are looking for a collection of wagons that are different from the pedestrian RTR fare, there is a wealth of choice in plastic kits such as Parkside, Cambrian and Slater's.  These can be made even better by the addition of etched brass parts from Wizard and Bill Bedford (Eileen's Emporium) and with whitemetal parts from Lanarkshire Models.

 

Even with RTR, you can upgrade them with parts from the above.

 

John

Edited June 13, 2020 by brossard

[Steamport Southport]

I don't want to speak for the OP.

 

But it was when discussing a Hornby Pug someone mentioned getting a High Level chassis rather than using the Hornby one and ISTR someone suggested starting with a wagon kit first.

 

Personally I wouldn't. I would start with something by Comet, either a coach kit or a simpler chassis such as a Jinty or 4F. A simple Comet chassis kit is a bit of a doddle even to an able newcomer. Very little soldering or fettling involved.

 

http://www.cometmodels.co.uk/data/Catalog/pdf/LCP8.pdf

 

Cheap body from somewhere like eBay. Wheels, motor and gears of your choice.

 

Very nearly forgot the mandatory mention of Iain Rice books.

 

Especially Locomotive Kit Chassis Construction In 4mm

 

https://www.titfield.co.uk/Wild-Swan/Model-Locos.htm

 

 

 

Jason

Edited June 13, 2020 by Steamport Southport

[brossard]

I have fond memories of Rice's Chassis Construction book.  I recall my first foray in doing a re chassis was for a Bachmann Pannier (the motor went up in smoke as I recall).  In those days it was Perserverance.  I slavishly obtained all the materials recommended and made the jigs that he illustrated.  Just so happens the book contains a worked example of the very loco I was doing.

 

I was thrilled when it all came together and worked first time.

 

John

[Alex TM]

Hi again,

 

Thanks for the pointers towards both the Iain Rice book, and MRJ 166 (though I now cannot seem to find that post!).  Both have just been ordered.

 

Regards,

 

Alex.

[Torper]

 

Earlier I suggested that one of Severn Models little building kits might be suitable for someone wanting to learn how to solder.  I take it back!  I've just acquired the lineside hut kit, and built it today.  To my surprise I found that it had been designed to be glued together and while it was still possible to build it using solder (as I largely did) gluing using cyano would probably have been easier and effective.  Nice little kit though!

 

DT

[ianLMS]

I built the stables and workshop from Severn and soldered them entirely, using only CA for the tiny details such as door handles etc. Their very small kits are probably better being superglued.

 

 

 

Edited June 22, 2020 by ianLMS

[Torper]

6 hours ago, ianLMS said:

I built the stables and workshop from Severn and soldered them entirely, using only CA for the tiny details such as door handles etc. Their very small kits are probably better being superglued.

 

I soldered the door handle (and lock) on mine.   (Possibly that's why the handle isn't quite as straight as I'd intended it should be).    I used glue ro attach the roof and the lean-to.

 

DT

[nick_bastable]

wrong    right scale but excellent tutorial

 

http://2mm.org.uk/articles/wagonvideo/

 

Nick B