The Night Mail

[SM42]

Mrs SM42 has just told me that PKP Intercity are selling 23 EU/EP07s. 

 

I asked how much. 

 

She pulled a face. 

 

Andy

[pH]

55 minutes ago, SM42 said:

I  suspect that there will be a request demand for some Deltics to be sacrificed. 

 Class 17s would be easier - they self-immolate.

[Oldddudders]

25 minutes ago, Dave Hunt said:

 

There are, though, many people who are excellent at their jobs, work very hard and are very smart and could rise very high but choose not to. There are several reasons such as not wanting to get into a purely office environment, not wanting to get involved in the hiring and firing regime (which my No. 1 son hated and chose to go back to being a team leader), not wanting to get deeply involved in corporate politics, genuinely wanting to achieve a better work/life balance than high flying may well require and others. In my experience, such people tend to be the rocks on which successful organisations are built, which is something I can vouch for in the armed forces and which I have heard propounded by others in different walks of life. 

 

Dave   

In the late '80s I had an interview in another part of NSE where I thought I did ok, but didn't get the job. Not a problem. The job was not close to where I then worked, although I did meet the appointee, and to the best of my knowledge he was a success at it. Roll forward a decade, and I was at a retirement dinner at the LT Museum, sharing a table with, inter alia, the Network Manager I would have worked for. I mentioned to someone that I'd had an interview with him but not got the job - whereupon said former-NM says "Oh, you were far and away the best candidate but XXXX [Deputy Director] said 'You're not having him - you're too similar!' " Management Development and organisational dynamics do matter. 

[Mike Bellamy]

28 minutes ago, Dave Hunt said:

There are, though, many people who are excellent at their jobs, work very hard and are very smart and could rise very high but choose not to. There are several reasons such as not wanting to get into a purely office environment, not wanting to get involved in the hiring and firing regime (which my No. 1 son hated and chose to go back to being a team leader), not wanting to get deeply involved in corporate politics, genuinely wanting to achieve a better work/life balance than high flying may well require and others. In my experience, such people tend to be the rocks on which successful organisations are built, which is something I can vouch for in the armed forces and which I have heard propounded by others in different walks of life. 

 

In my situation at Lloyds back in the late 70s / early 80s, after an intensive training course I was offered promotion to assistant manager in 3 or 4 months if I moved to London - or 3 or 4 years if I stayed in the East Midlands. I chose to stay. My promotion prospects were knocked back when visiting Head Office Inspectors said my lending (all personal customers not business) had been 'over generous at times, and had put the Bank at risk'. I moved to Financial Advice but they then appointed 'salesmen' to Black Horse Life who had company car, worked evenings and got commission so much of my branch based business disappeared, except for sorting out the mess they left behind with most policies cancelled after a month or two. The take over of Cheltenham and Gloucester Building Society took away all my mortgage business and the merger with the Trustee Savings Bank was the final straw. My last 12 months were spent answering the phone - great for customers as by then I had 25 years experience and could answer all their questions. However the Bank could pay someone half my age half the salary to do the same job - and of course call centres then went off-shore. Offered redundancy in 1997 and was glad to get out.

.

[figworthy]

32 minutes ago, Dave Hunt said:

 

There are, though, many people who are excellent at their jobs, work very hard and are very smart and could rise very high but choose not to. There are several reasons such as not wanting to get into a purely office environment, not wanting to get involved in the hiring and firing regime (which my No. 1 son hated and chose to go back to being a team leader), not wanting to get deeply involved in corporate politics, genuinely wanting to achieve a better work/life balance than high flying may well require and others. In my experience, such people tend to be the rocks on which successful organisations are built, which is something I can vouch for in the armed forces and which I have heard propounded by others in different walks of life. 

 

Dave   

 

Or they knew that it would be far better for all concerned if they stuck to doing "stuff", rather than going into manglement.

 

And yet, there would have been people higher up the manglement chains who took the view that as those staff members were doing a very good job, they ought to be "rewarded" with a promotion.

 

Adrian

[Oldddudders]

5 minutes ago, figworthy said:

 

Or they knew that it would be far better for all concerned if they stuck to doing "stuff", rather than going into manglement.

 

And yet, there would have been people higher up the manglement chains who took the view that as those staff members were doing a very good job, they ought to be "rewarded" with a promotion.

 

Definitely the case for BR engineers, where rewards for competence and thus contribution were limited by salary ranges, and a few good years in post probably meant hitting the ceiling. So the only promotion would mean leaving the drawing board and being saddled with budgets and headcount, in an industry where HM Treasury were determined to cut, cut, cut. Sad. 

[pH]

I once worked in a part of the UK civil service where the organizational structure was very pyramidal. There was a tradition(?) or directive (?) that people being promoted were moved out of the section in which they were working. That made some sense, as it meant that they would not be supervising people with whom they had been working on the same level - there would be less chance of any resentment causing problems.

 

However, this could be used, and was used, to move awkward/incompetent employees onwards. I knew of one person who managed to be promoted 4 grades in this structure in this way. (He did have to have promotions confirmed in interviews, but he was very proficient in BS, so that was no problem.)

 

As an aside, he once applied for a job in a different organization. By pure coincidence, the person who interviewed him was a good friend of mine. My friend couldn’t understand how the interviewee had risen to the level he had in his current organization till I explained the mechanism involved.

[PhilJ W]

3 minutes ago, pH said:

I once worked in a part of the UK civil service where the organizational structure was very pyramidal. There was a tradition(?) or directive (?) that people being promoted were moved out of the section in which they were working. That made some sense, as it meant that they would not be supervising people with whom they had been working on the same level - there would be less chance of any resentment causing problems.

 

However, this could be used, and was used, to move awkward/incompetent employees onwards. I knew of one person who managed to be promoted 4 grades in this structure in this way. (He did have to have promotions confirmed in interviews, but he was very proficient in BS, so that was no problem.)

 

As an aside, he once applied for a job in a different organization. By pure coincidence, the person who interviewed him was a good friend of mine. My friend couldn’t understand how the interviewee had risen to the level he had in his current organization till I explained the mechanism involved.

The same in local government if not worse. Incompetents were moved sideways and upwards until senior management was overloaded with them. Then when it hit the fan they always looked for someone further down the line to carry the can.

[pH]

1 minute ago, PhilJ W said:

The same in local government if not worse. Incompetents were moved sideways and upwards until senior management was overloaded with them. Then when it hit the fan they always looked for someone further down the line to carry the can.

As they say - sh1t flows downhill!

[pH]

46 minutes ago, Oldddudders said:

Definitely the case for BR engineers, where rewards for competence and thus contribution were limited by salary ranges, and a few good years in post probably meant hitting the ceiling. So the only promotion would mean leaving the drawing board and being saddled with budgets and headcount …

Happens in many organizations. Unless you’re lucky and manage to stay in a specialized technical hierarchy, most people top out in their technical area and, if they want promotion, have to move out into supervisory/management positions, as you describe. 

[Northmoor]

1 hour ago, Dave Hunt said:

 

There are, though, many people who are excellent at their jobs, work very hard and are very smart and could rise very high but choose not to. There are several reasons such as not wanting to get into a purely office environment, not wanting to get involved in the hiring and firing regime (which my No. 1 son hated and chose to go back to being a team leader), not wanting to get deeply involved in corporate politics, genuinely wanting to achieve a better work/life balance than high flying may well require and others. In my experience, such people tend to be the rocks on which successful organisations are built, which is something I can vouch for in the armed forces and which I have heard propounded by others in different walks of life. 

 

Dave   

Hear hear.

10 years I managed to get away from the US corporate culture of the private sector defence industry.  I saw so many people doing a good job but not appreciated because they weren't being seen doing long hours for nothing.  These people often did 75% of the work but were described as "coasting" just because they weren't interested in climbing the corporate ladder.  Sometimes they left on time because they wanted to sometimes actually be at home when their children were young, or had an elderly relative they dropped in to see most days.  Their managers knew none of this because they couldn't relate to anyone not driven by career, salary and status, so therefore took absolutely no interest in them..

[pH]

14 minutes ago, Northmoor said:

… I saw so many people doing a good job but not appreciated because they weren't being seen doing long hours …

It’s called ‘face time’.

 

I know a Brit in the oil industry who moved to work in that industry in the US. He was accused of not pulling his weight based on the time (the required hours) he was visible in the office. He replied that the person accusing him should look at the amount and quality of the work he was accomplishing, compared with what was being done by people spending 50% more time in the office. Nothing more was ever said about it.

Edited January 31 by pH

[newbryford]

22 hours ago, newbryford said:

Some of you may recall we had a feline visitor just before Christmas.

He started to appear on a more regular basis, so we put out a message on the local facebook group if anybody was missing a cat.

Despite a few replies, nobody has claimed him.

And his visits have become even more common.

So Mrs NB and I hatched a plan to take him to the local vets and have him scanned for an ID chip when convenient.

That was done this evening and despite a couple of checks, he has no ID, so it looks like we may have (at least partially)  adopted him.

 

Welcome to "Blue". (He needs his own food dish!)

 

 

 

 

I have been informed that Junior NB's cousin (our niece) is disgruntled at the name Blue, as her cat is so called.

So - a quick rethink and as our new potential adoptee shares many of the traits of our departed Barney, he has been renamed to something similar.

 

 

So - meet Barry.

 

 

 

 

 

[SM42]

Mrs SM42 has issued orders up until the 1st September. 

 

I have a lot to do over the next few days in preparation. 

 

Mrs SM42 has not been allowed to get off scot free as  I have given her several tasks, the outcome of which affect my ability to complete my orders. 

 

Hopefully, by the weekend it will all be sorted and more exciting things can be done.  

 

I've got a class 37 and a CCT kit to finish. 

 

I did have a rash thought about those PKP locos. 

 

Reopening of Woodhead anyone?

3kv OLE all the way. 

 

Andy

[J. S. Bach]

4 hours ago, newbryford said:

So - meet Barry.

 

Barry is a beautiful creature, maybe also post him in the "On Cats" subforum? Anyway, Night Owl from the Piedmont.

[jamie92208]

We had many senior officers who spent a lot of their office tome, networking.. They then had to work late to do the work needed for their day job.  I worked odd hours due to shift work but never got into the long hours culture and also didn't socialise much with my colleagues as family and other interests were more important to me.  This behaviour probably held me back but saved my liver from damage and I remained married.  The big problem with the senior officers was that though most of their time was spent managing, the rank they held meant that they sometimes had to start leading and commanding in an operational role.  The results could be disastrous, though usually they could themselves be 'managed' by people around them.

 

Jamie

Edited February 1 by jamie92208

[jjb1970]

I have been a bit of a journeyman engineer and been carried along in life, having worked for several organisations (including HMG when I worked for British Antarctic Survey). Overall I have had a good career up to now, I am not rich or a star but I really can't complain about my lot in life. I have always valued finding roles I enjoy over salary, not only because work is a big part of life but my view is that if you have a job you enjoy you're more likely to perform well, and if you perform well the careerist stuff will look after itself. 

 

On managers, I still say the best manager I had was a young lady who was a complete hard ass and who took no prisoners. We were sent to a power plant at the same time, she as plant manager and me as ops manager. I was taken aside by the country managing director and told to ignore the job spec, my job would be to keep relations between the new plant manager and staff functioning. She had a brilliant mind but would happily start a fight in an empty room. Yet for all her faults I learned an awful lot from her and I discovered that underneath the hard super b exterior she was actually a very caring person. Even though the staff hated her with a passion initially they were all very sad when she was moved onward and upwards as she turned a failing plant around and gave them a future. She was very output focused, she made it clear what she expected from me but also made clear if I could do it in the first hour of the day then she wasn't bothered how I used the rest of the day.

 

That industry struggled to get people to go for promotion to managerial roles. As a shift charge engineer about a third of my income was shift pay and allowances, and if I had to extra hours I got overtime. When I went to ops manager my pay remained the same even though in theory it was a big increase relative to base pay as they just consolidated my previous monthly pay into a salary. And it was straight salary,  no additional payments.  The result was more workload and responsibility for the same net pay (less for those who chased overtime). It was one of those things where I looked at it as a more interesting job and a gate to better long term opportunities but many saw it as being taken advantage of and refused to consider it. I didn't blame people for having that view as it was a reasonable one, but what did and still annoys me are those who wore that position as a badge and now whinge about why they plateaued at shift charge engineer or maintenance supervisor and have a huge chip on their shoulder about management. 

[Oldddudders]

9 hours ago, newbryford said:

I have been informed that Junior NB's cousin (our niece) is disgruntled at the name Blue, as her cat is so called.

So - a quick rethink and as our new potential adoptee shares many of the traits of our departed Barney, he has been renamed to something similar.

 

So - meet Barry.

"Send him victorious

Tabby and glorious"

 

Do I not recall a singer called Barry Blue?

[newbryford]

45 minutes ago, Oldddudders said:

"Send him victorious

Tabby and glorious"

 

Do I not recall a singer called Barry Blue?

 

You do.

Barry's middle name is Blue, so he hasn't been totally renamed!

[Happy Hippo]

I woke up this morning feeling rather light headed, then I remembered I'd had a haircut yesterday morning.

 

After a brief team briefing, where I listened and kept nodding my head, I found out we are going to the Cheshire Oaks outlet village.

 

I can't complain too much as I do need a new pair of socks.

 

 

[SM42]

The rather odd system, that seems to be endemic   where managers are paid less than the staff they manage does seem to hold a lot of good people back in the rank and file. 

 

No responsibility, leave the job at work and a better end of year bottom line is quite attractive. 

 

We do after all work to live, not live to work.

 

There seems to be a culture nowadays that if your managers aren't under stress and worked to a pulp,then you aren't getting the best out of them.  

 

As far a I'm concerned, tired and frazzled staff are less productive  than happy and well rested staff. 

 

There a lot to be said for a home by five culture. 

 

Unfortunately it seems that  the attitude is that if the person is unable to cope and breaks /  can't keep up,  then you have the wrong person rather than the wrong expectations.

 

Andy

[Happy Hippo]

4 minutes ago, newbryford said:

 

You do.

Barry's middle name is Blue, so he hasn't been totally renamed!

Didn't Joan Baez sing about Baby Blue?

[Hroth]

6 minutes ago, Happy Hippo said:

I woke up this morning feeling rather light headed, then I remembered I'd had a haircut yesterday morning.

 

After a brief team briefing, where I listened and kept nodding my head, I found out we are going to the Cheshire Oaks outlet village.

 

I can't complain too much as I do need a new pair of socks.

 

 

 

Cheshire Oaks is the outlet village from hell, a circular array of "fashion" shops around a car park.  It shares many of the design features of the M25, mentioned in the Pratchett/Gaiman "Good Omens". I loathe being dragged around the place.

 

Socks?  Are you really after a pair of black lurex interwoven with golden threads knee-hi sox?

 

Thats all you'll get there!

 

 

 

[Happy Hippo]

I call it Acquired Mrs Hunt Syndrome (AMHS) to which the good Staffelfuhrer can attest to.

 

I merely go to buy, but Nyda has to go shopping.

 

 

[skipepsi]

47 minutes ago, Happy Hippo said:

I woke up this morning feeling rather light headed, then I remembered I'd had a haircut yesterday morning.

 

After a brief team briefing, where I listened and kept nodding my head, I found out we are going to the Cheshire Oaks outlet village.

 

I can't complain too much as I do need a new pair of socks.

 

 

I thought you would need a minimum of two pairs.