Formula 1 2021

[Bulleidboy100]

32 minutes ago, Andrew P said:

A bit sour.

 

 

Hamilton 'should be suspended' for Verstappen incident - Marko.

https://www.gpfans.com/en/f1-news/67584/hamilton-should-be-suspended-for-verstappen-incident-marko/?fbclid=IwAR0ouCy4fAuPS44zhewJGatDS72qUqQt24S5rp3SNwpa7J-2KFFIIEjI4IU

 

You forgot to add "Helmut Marko - Hamilton ‘destroyed Alex Albon’s career".  

I recall that was a right hand corner - with a Red Bull going round the outside - they never learn!

Edited July 18, 2021 by Bulleidboy100
amendment

[Harlequin]

Great race! Great to see the Union Flag being held aloft from the cockpit at the end but I would have been happy and cheered almost as loudly, and I think everyone there would have done the same, if Leclerc had won.

 

10 sec penalty for Lewis exactly right, IMHO. He didn't intend to crash into Max but it wasn't very clever to be half way alongside at that point on the track with uncertain grip levels.

 

Bring on the next race (even if not live for those of use who don't subscribe to the Sky and the evil Murdoch empire for live coverage)!

 

Edited July 18, 2021 by Harlequin

[Pete the Elaner]

3 hours ago, Steadfast said:

I'm sorry but if someone is found at blame for an incident and is thus penalised, the penalty should be in proportion to the incident and it's result. Send someone into a 51G race ending crash and it demands more than 10 seconds. Pitch him into a spin off onto the tarmac and he recovers, 10 seconds seems fair.

If Lewis was found culpable by the stewards of a crash of that severity and thus penalised, there's no way in hell he should have been able to win. 

Just goes to show how even in the final year of the current formula Mercedes are head and shoulders above the rest, albeit with Red Bull on a par. I reckon the same result would've happened had it been reversed, and Verstappen stayed in with a penalty and Hamilton retired.

I'm not saying penalising Hamilton for that crash was right or wrong (racing incident anyone?), however I think the penalty rules need a shake up in my book.

 

Jo

 

I agree with you about the rules.

In the previous race, Norris was adjudged to have been at fault when Perez went off. If he had backed out, he would have lost the place. Because he fought, he was penalised & that lost him 1 place, so the penalty did not really mean anything.

Perez was knocked back 6-8 places though. Once Norris was considered at fault, how is penalising him 1 place fair when the driver he 'pushed off' has been pushed 6 places back?

 

If there is 1 thing which has been proven today it is that Red Bull are a 1 driver team. Perez was in 10th place before he was pitted for a late tyre change to set the fastest lap, so he & the team lost the only point they were going to score today because they didn't get the fastest lap point because he didn't score any race points. They obviously did this just to make sure Hamilton didn't get it & the points difference between the teams remained the same.

 

As for the Verstappen/Hamilton incident, Hamilton was about 1/4 of a wheel behind at the braking zone & both drivers were obviously trying to out-brake each other. I am not sure Verstappen would have made the corner without going wide at the exit.

It is very rare that a drivers or riders gets to the top of their sport without pulling off risky overtake moves. Those who don't will fail to make it to the top.

Like Senna & Schumacher, Verstappen has built himself a reputation of preferring to crash rather than give any room. Drivers usually give him more space because of this.

Their crash has sent him a message that Hamilton will not concede in this way. Whether this is right or wrong is a matter of opinion.

Hamilton stated after the race that he was angry with Verstappen for not leaving any racing room. I could not see anything wrong on the first lap before their crash, so I think this stems back from previous races & probably over several seasons.

Edited July 18, 2021 by Pete the Elaner
Couple of grammar errors.

[PaulRhB]

Max has kinda relied on his hard image to scare people off, it worked yesterday but not today. I respect the opinions of DC and Webber who clearly said it was Lewis’ fault from their perspective but the cockpit view is a foot or so further back and higher than Lewis’ so he may have not had that crucial half second warning and that’s why the contact was so marginal. Lewis was a bit wide trying to outbrake Max and Max assumed he was right on the apex. Lewis had to push to the limit as the cars are overall so closely matched so I’d call it a racing incident. 

[Darius43]

Max Verstappen labels Lewis Hamilton 'disrespectful' and 'unsportsmanlike'

 

Well, he ought to know...

 

Cheers

 

Darius

[LNERandBR]

So Lewis isn't allowed to celebrate his victory? I'm pretty sure Max would be celebrating if the roles were reversed. As Toto is quoted there, it takes two to tango. 

[ELTEL]

Never been a fan of Verstappen or Red Bull 

 

Is there anything in the rules that says you can not overtake at Copse 

 

No

 

Move on……

[Dunsignalling]

Max has become accustomed to other drivers backing off when exposed to his intimidatory driving style.

 

Today he tangled with one who doesn't and the encounter could have ended the race for either or both of them. It just happened that the chips fell in Hamilton's favour this time.

 

John 

[Pete the Elaner]

14 minutes ago, LNERandBR said:

So Lewis isn't allowed to celebrate his victory? I'm pretty sure Max would be celebrating if the roles were reversed. As Toto is quoted there, it takes two to tango. 

 

Also, if the roles were reversed, Verstappen would be moaning like crazy about getting a penalty because he can never accept that anything he does is wrong.

Horner would have accepted it as racing but complained about another similar incident being treated differently.

 

I am pleased no injuries have been reported for Verstappen & I hope he recovers soon & is back to full fitness in time for the next race.

[Hroth]

I hope Max doesn't pick up Covid in hospital and has to isolate for the next fortnight....

[friscopete]

2 minutes ago, Hroth said:

I hope Max doesn't pick up Covid in hospital and has to isolate for the next fortnight....

Different rules for racing teams .Take it from me .A world of their own fuelled by money

[Pete the Elaner]

2 minutes ago, Hroth said:

I hope Max doesn't pick up Covid in hospital and has to isolate for the next fortnight....

If he has gone to Milton Keynes, that will be unlikely.

I was out running with a nurse & the husband of another nurse on Friday. The mentioned that MK's Covid ward currently has no patients.

[woodenhead]

It's all mind games, given equal machinery that the RB and the Mercedes was at Silverstone (unlike the previous two races) then Hamilton had to be more agressive otherwise he would not be able to pass Verstappen, yesterday they came very close and perhaps Hamilton backed off as it was only a point difference, today the points haul was much greater and having got a measure of where he would be most likely to pass he got his car into a position where Verstappen should yield but didn't.

 

Now as a team RB are going to town in the impact, talking up how amateur Hamilton is and how mature Verstappen is, how he should not be celebrating etc. 

 

It's possible that they recognise this might be the moment when Hamilton comes alive again, like the season when Vettel went to pieces despite being ahead - if Hamilton gets the upper hand pyschologically then he becomes unbeatable, get into his head and you get Nico Rosberg.

 

Red Bull have a fast car, an excellent driver, but not every course suits the car, they made hay whilst the sun shone and wanted to keep the momentum going, Hamilton gave a clear statement today, that he will not be bullied and Verstappen will need to consider the fact he will not be the only want not willing to yield

[PaulRhB]

Karun has a similar view that it was a 50/50

 

 

[Andrew P]

5 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

Karun has a similar view that it was a 50/50

 

 

I don't watch Sky, but that is a good well balanced analysis, 

[Oldddudders]

9 hours ago, Pete the Elaner said:

If he has gone to Milton Keynes, that will be unlikely.

I was out running with a nurse & the husband of another nurse on Friday. The mentioned that MK's Covid ward currently has no patients.

On the Covid thread, a resident of that locale is forever pronouncing doom and despondency. I increasingly wonder why. 

[Hroth]

9 hours ago, friscopete said:

Different rules for racing teams .Take it from me .A world of their own fuelled by money

 

9 hours ago, Pete the Elaner said:

If he has gone to Milton Keynes, that will be unlikely.

I was out running with a nurse & the husband of another nurse on Friday. The mentioned that MK's Covid ward currently has no patients.

 

My mind was free-running on what situation would really wind Verstappen up after yesterday.

 

5 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

Karun has a similar view that it was a 50/50

 

Given Horners post-race rants and Verstappens contribution too, there's a whiff of "protesting too much" from the Red Bull camp. 

[Oldddudders]

14 minutes ago, Hroth said:

Given Horners post-race rants and Verstappens contribution too, there's a whiff of "protesting too much" from the Red Bull camp. 

It fits with the extraordinarily high-profile the team takes, despite having no championships to boast about for many years. Horner is a tart for the media, which laps him up, despite the certainty that no team boss is ever, ever, ever going to tell the world anything that might be remotely useful to a competitor. I find interviews and 'from the pitwall' stuff offensive any time there are cars on the track. Ditto the interview with a driver who just fell off/broke down explaining what happened - wait until the race is over.

[Jol Wilkinson]

BBC Sport News have posted that LH has been racially abused on social media. F1's attempts to widen the popularity of the sport has clearly attracted the lower quality football fans.

 

[friscopete]

Max was /is always heading for the big one even in F3 days .He is very aggressive  and in the end like the gunslingers of fame  a bullet is waiting .They  always used to end up in Northampton general  where  it seems they are used to mangled racing drivers.

[didcot]

My son and I were at Silverstone. My Father's day present, bless him. They played Horners rant to Michael Massi over the tannoy and the booing was very loud. Max got a good cheer when he got out the car.

RB do seem to have media tantrums when it doest go their way.

I think it has been on the cards for some time. Lewis has deferred to Max on occasions as he gets his elbows out. But in front of the home crowd I don't think that was ever going to happen. 

Still a fantastic recovery and the place went nuts. Shame Lando's pit stop cost him a potential second place.

 

[The Lurker]

I was at Silverstone too - only two of the four of the family could make it because of a school bubble isolations - and I would echo the comments about Horner being roundly booed. Verstappen going off into the gravel was loudly cheered before the crowd realised the impact. And then he was cheered/applauded when he got out of the car.

 

Apparently he went to Coventry hospital.

 

I think Max has nearly caused a number of lap 1 collisions this year - Hamilton was forced wide over the curbs earlier in the season - but this time Hamilton did not give way. I suspect Max needs to learn the little calm that Lewis displayed earlier in the season; he probably had faster race pace so could have bided his time.

 

Leclerc drove well and the Mercedes could not make an impression on him for a long period of the race.

 

I did enjoy Michael Masi's straight bat. "I'm sorry Toto. I make it my practice never to read my e-mails during the race." 

[didcot]

19 minutes ago, The Lurker said:

I was at Silverstone too - only two of the four of the family could make it because of a school bubble isolations

Have you managed to roll tickets over for next year.

[Reorte]

1 hour ago, Oldddudders said:

I find interviews and 'from the pitwall' stuff offensive any time there are cars on the track. Ditto the interview with a driver who just fell off/broke down explaining what happened - wait until the race is over.

On the latter point though we used to get that quite often back when I regularly watched F1, drivers who had failed for whatever reason would often wander in to the commentary box (can't imagine it happening now). One in particular I remember was Johnny Herbert, can't recall exactly which race (think it was Spa or Hockenheim), where he mentioned it was raining so he ran for cover after getting out of the broken car before realising that it was the first time he'd run since his bad F3000 crash.

[Bill Radford]

Well...

 

I had lost interest in F1 this season prefering TOCA & BSB but got back some enjoyment yesterday. I felt that unless Max was winning that Horner was in full moan mode for the full weekend - Mercs were using slimstreaming for sprint pole - Lewis 200% blame for collision...

 

I'm sure Max showed disrespect celebrating his first win - wasn't that the Spanish where Nico took out Lewis on lap 1?