BWsTrains Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 (edited) These have been around for ages, recently supplied in new Parkside packaging and recommended for use with the Ratio/ Parkside Coach Kits GWR 4 wheel Coach kits PA610, 612, 613. The picture of the pack cover shows the seat backs topping out at 73% of the interior height of the compartment, whereas the actual measurements tell a different story. Seat Height 21mm vs interior height 25mm (84%). The other issue with this kit is the Back-to-back (literally in this case) of the seats excluding any inter-compartment wall this is 4.4mm. As there are occasional upload issues I'm continuing in a 2nd post Edited February 17, 2021 by BWsTrains Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWsTrains Posted February 17, 2021 Author Share Posted February 17, 2021 Continuing.... Turning to a preserved GWR 31' four wheel coach (GWR 416, Didcot) for some help with seating dimensions in 3rd Class, the seat backs can clearly be seen to fit totally within the inter-compartmental framing (i.e. they don't extend into the window space). This makes them no wider than 8.5in at any point or ~2.8 mm at 1:76 scale. My Ratio kit has inter-compartmental framing bars of 2.35mm and the discrepancy probably reflects my measurements of GWR 416 from a photo. Regarding seat height, the GWR 416 Didcot photo shows the seat tops at 67% of floor to roof edge height leaving me with seats far too wide and far too tall for my kits. A search here has not turned up this issue which surprised me given the longevity and popularity of these coach kits. All that remains is to turn to radical surgery to fix this lot up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 I don't think they were originally meant for the GWR four wheel coaches. There's enough in a pack for a bogie coach. This pack contains enough seating for an 8 compartment coach - 520mm. I think you are really looking at them being made to fit this rather than anything GWR. https://www.hattons.co.uk/80825/parkside_models_pc710_midland_lms_48_suburban_third_non_corridor_coach_plastic_kit/stockdetail.aspx Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWsTrains Posted February 17, 2021 Author Share Posted February 17, 2021 OK, perhaps I was misled somewhere or by someone along the way. Would those coaches you quote be that much taller to accommodate the extra height implied by these seats, allow room for the photos /advertisments and luggage rack above? I found a pic on here of a GWR 4 wheel brake alongside a more modern coach and they looked to be much the same running height. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PMP Posted February 17, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 17, 2021 They were introduced possibly as far back as the early 1970’s as a generic seat strip for their coach range including the Midland (as mentioned above) and LNWR vehicles, rather than for specific models. By aggressive sanding you can take away a large element of the seat moulding thickness, then fix them back to back as in your picture and add any partition profile to the tops of the seat. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PeterStiles Posted February 17, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 17, 2021 Due to the World Wide Shortage of peco-sourced products before xmas I ended up trying my hand at 3d designing some seats to pimp a couple of 4-wheelers I wanted my terrier to pull without feeling completely embarrassed. Yes it does require access to a 3d printer (thanks to the lovely lady for a 50th birthday present) and I'm pretty amateur at this, but I was able to produce something just as seat-like as the aforementioned seating kits, which I could customise to the width of my coaches rather than slicing as you do with the kit. Please don't hate me for my crimes against modelling (or the use of a Hornby 4-wheeler), but applaud instead the vaguely creative use of modern techniques! Pictures show that I built the 3d models in the freebee software you get with Windows10 and then the resulting unpainted bits just resting in a "coach" before painting/gluing. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold phil_sutters Posted February 17, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 17, 2021 Why all the technology? Pre-grouping seating seems to have been less curvaceous. Cardboard or plastic card partitions, with seats and seat backs from more of the same or balsa wood can be made easily to fit your model. If you are able to use a computer and standard paper printer, you can make patterned seat coverings and also the adverts or maps found on the walls above. 6 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted February 17, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 17, 2021 Curvaceousness (of seats, stop that giggling at the back, there) depended on class, and the more curvaceous classes had thicker window separation to hide it behind, which the one size fits all (or not, sometimes) Ratio/Parkside strip does not cater for; if, like me, you model a lot of kits of non-gangwayed compartment stock you will be well aware of this. PMP’s solution of taking material from the back of the strip is as easy and effective as any other, but seating is easily folded out of card for situations where this is not suitable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWsTrains Posted February 17, 2021 Author Share Posted February 17, 2021 Thanks everyone for help and comments, interesting options but as I have just a couple of the kits to hand and just 2 Compartmented 31" coaches to complete, shaving and cutting is clearly the order of the day. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 21 minutes ago, BWsTrains said: ... shaving and cutting is clearly the order of the day. I think that it's called modelling. John Isherwood. 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 The new issue of Model Rail (284) has an article on building and basic detailing of the MR coaches as a generic colliery coach. It includes building an interior using the seats and a method of making the body removable. Regarding the GWR coaches. When I built mine years ago I just put partitions in. ISTR that you can't really see if there are seats or not. I probably would fit them now, but as a skint teenager I wasn't spending money on things like seats if I could get away with it. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold phil_sutters Posted February 18, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 18, 2021 Once upon a time, I think that there were ready-printed carriage interiors, around the time of the original Kitmaster coaches perhaps. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Andy W Posted February 18, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 18, 2021 Yes there were, a Peco product. with separate designs for each of the Kitmaster Mk1 types. (maybe not for the RFO which I seem to remember had tables etc in the Kitmaster kit). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold tomparryharry Posted February 18, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 18, 2021 (edited) The Ratio-Parkside 3rd class 4-wheeler is similar to its Taff Vale Railway equivalent. In this case, however, the seat backs only came as high as the middle of the door window. Above that, it was an open carriage, for the length of the vehicle. I would also be inclined to make the seats out of card, with overlays to give you the contours and a degree of strength. Dolls house material for seat coverings, perhaps? Edit:- Dolls House Emporium. Wallpaper MD41180 & MD41181 might do the trick. Edited February 18, 2021 by tomparryharry Information Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 1 hour ago, phil_sutters said: Once upon a time, I think that there were ready-printed carriage interiors, around the time of the original Kitmaster coaches perhaps. I've a feeling that they may still be available - if not, I've seen plenty on Ebay. Regards, John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 I gave up on the Ratio seating a long time ago. I think there is some of my original pack somewhere, still cluttering the place up. The Peco printed sheets were introduced at roughly the same time as the Kitmaster kits and duplicate the uneven 1st class seating in the CK. These are quite reasonable, but need the seats to be curved and the compartment windows glazed (avoid any sort of acetate!) The printed mesh in the BSK also requires replacing with something see-through (I use mosquito netting). IIRC the GWR 3rd class seating was wooden. (Ferrovie dello Stato was keen on this (the dreaded 'centoporte'). I can testify to the comfort (or rather lack of) of these horrors. They were originally 3rd class, but were 'upgraded' to 2nd by the simple procedure of sticking a '2' on the doors.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWsTrains Posted February 18, 2021 Author Share Posted February 18, 2021 (edited) My various Ratio GWR Coach kits are being bashed (slowly) into Weston, Clevedon & Portishead Railway Company (ex-LSWR) 4 wheelers. This has involved a lot of cut and shut to recreate the Saloon and other compartment combinations favoured by LSWR, as I'm sure those of you following my Blog will already know. I believe wooden seats were not used on the LSWR, even in third so that's not an issue. WC&PR Coaches were noted for their comfort of ride in both 1st and 2nd Class (ex LSWR 3rd). Second Class was upholstered in Red / Black moquette. (quotes from Peter Strange's book) Edited February 18, 2021 by BWsTrains Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 8 hours ago, cctransuk said: I've a feeling that they may still be available - if not, I've seen plenty on Ebay. Regards, John Isherwood. You can print your own. They are on the Kitmaster website. ISTR that Peco gave permission to use them as long as it's for personal use and not commercial. http://www.kitmaster.org.uk/pecocoachint.htm Jason 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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