Helston Revisited

[Andy Keane]

The bridge is now finished and wanting detail painting. I have primed it and then gloss varnished before I set to work on the pointing and stone colours.

[Andy Keane]

I am soon to embark on decorating the baseboards and an early task will be painting and ballasting the track. So I have made up a short length to test different approaches and styles of ballast.

Here we have a range of colours and sizes, some stuck with PVA, some with "Ballast Magic" and in once case a mixture. The PVA either having washing-up liquid or IPA or both added. I have found that all work but that the ballast magic is by far the tidiest but equally way more expensive.

 

I think along with many who have commented earlier I have found what is sold as "OO" gauge ballast is too coarse. But equally the finest sand is too fine and "N" gauge ballast is the way to go.

 

In the first photo we have Gaugemaster N gauge (GM115), Gaugemaster OO gauge brown (GM111), Busch fine black quartz sand, and Rail-Road Scenics Exhibitions of Bradford extra fine grey granite chippings (no longer available but I have five bags from my first attempts in 1974 - I have being carrying this stuff around through 50 years of life and moves). The second photo is from the other end.

 

As to colours I am still mulling it over and in the end I may mix up some of these as I quite like the idea of a little of the brown mixed in. And I will dirty up the result in a number of areas around the station.

 

All comments most welcome.

[Gilbert]

Andy

Test pieces are certainly the way to go.

Its all personal to the modeller but FWIW my preference is to paint and lightly weather the track prior to ballasting. I tend to use Phoenix "weathered sleepers" which is a pleasing light grey/brown which brings out the track detail. I find unpainted track too dark. When everything is done (including a gentle wash coat of PP"Rusty Rails" on the rails) I do a light dusting of "weathered sleepers" to blend everything.

Before

After

My ballast preference is for Woodland scenics a they tend to retain the original colour better than real stone products which seem to darken.

When I look at trackwork in the real world or photos it is often lighter looking to the eye than the brain expects..this is Bishops Lydeard.

 

These are some of my test pieces from Penmaenbach - viewed under the same lighting as I'll use on the layout - ignore the quality of the track it self it was done with spare bits to trial painting and ballasting!

Chris

Edited August 28, 2022 by Gilbert

[Andy Keane]

2 hours ago, Gilbert said:

Andy

Test pieces are certainly the way to go.

Its all personal to the modeller but FWIW my preference is to paint and lightly weather the track prior to ballasting. I tend to use Phoenix "weathered sleepers" which is a pleasing light grey/brown which brings out the track detail. I find unpainted track too dark. When everything is done (including a gentle wash coat of PP"Rusty Rails" on the rails) I do a light dusting of "weathered sleepers" to blend everything.

Before

After

My ballast preference is for Woodland scenics a they tend to retain the original colour better than real stone products which seem to darken.

When I look at trackwork in the real world or photos it is often lighter looking to the eye than the brain expects..this is Bishops Lydeard.

 

These are some of my test pieces from Penmaenbach - viewed under the same lighting as I'll use on the layout - ignore the quality of the track it self it was done with spare bits to trial painting and ballasting!

Chris

Chris

That is really very helpful, many thanks.

I have various of the phoenix paints to hand and the test piece had rusty rails and then sleeper grime on the sleepers before ballasting. I have some of the weathered sleeper paint but have not yet tried it out. Your post has encouraged me to have a go and see, but one thing that I worry about is my layout is essentially all in the station and the photos show really very dirty ballast with sleepers sometimes not even visible, which is why I started with the grime. I also find that all of the above leaves things a tad shiny so I plan to spray the lot with matt when its done and ballasted. But before I get too carried away I have a little bit of point rodding to insert too.

Andy

Edited August 28, 2022 by Andy Keane

[Gilbert]

17 minutes ago, Andy Keane said:

Chris

That is really very helpful, many thanks.

I have various of the phoenix paints to hand and the test piece had rusty rails and then sleeper grime on the sleepers before ballasting. I have some of the weathered sleeper paint but have not yet tried it out. Your post has encouraged me to have a go and see, but one thing that I worry about is my layout is essentially all in the station and the photos show really very dirty ballast with sleepers sometimes not even visible, which is why I started with the grime. I also find that all of the above leaves things a tad shiny so I plan to spray the lot with matt when its done and ballasted. But before I get too carried away I have a little bit of point rodding to insert too.

Andy

Cheers Andy - my only other comment is that dark colours often look lighter in sunshine (the tarmac conundrum) so its worth having a good look at photos if you can..

Chris

[Andy Keane]

4 hours ago, Gilbert said:

Cheers Andy - my only other comment is that dark colours often look lighter in sunshine (the tarmac conundrum) so its worth having a good look at photos if you can..

Chris

Chris

This is a typical colour image when it was still worked by Prairie tanks:

http://www.cornwallrailwaysociety.org.uk/uploads/7/6/8/3/7683812/6460739_orig.jpg

What would you think the best sleeper paint would be to get to that?

regards

Andy

[Gilbert]

29 minutes ago, Andy Keane said:

Chris

This is a typical colour image when it was still worked by Prairie tanks:

http://www.cornwallrailwaysociety.org.uk/uploads/7/6/8/3/7683812/6460739_orig.jpg

What would you think the best sleeper paint would be to get to that?

regards

Andy

Certainly a scarey amount of greenery as well! I'd start light anyway and darken on my test pieces - too dark can be overpowering?}

Pigments may be more manageable than paint after the first layer(s) given the opportunity for variations in that photo?

Chris

 

Edited August 28, 2022 by Gilbert

[Gilbert]

I think its also important to put everything in perspective......

I often spend a lot of time fussing over track and ballast colours etc .....once the layout is beyond that stage I rarely notice it much again as long as it is not obviously "wrong" ...

Chris

[Andy Keane]

4 minutes ago, Gilbert said:

I think its also important to put everything in perspective......

I often spend a lot of time fussing over track and ballast colours etc .....once the layout is beyond that stage I rarely notice it much again as long as it is not obviously "wrong" ...

Chris

Yes as you say it is easy to obsess over every detail as it goes in but once there its the overall effect that the eye sees. Until of course you take a photo and post in on RMweb when all is laid bare.

And that photo is around 1958 by which time I suspect all maintenance was pretty sketch as compared to the 1920s and 30s which is the period I am trying to capture.

Anyway I have another bit of test track underway which will use the weather sleeper paint. I will report back soon.

Edited August 28, 2022 by Andy Keane

[Gilbert]

2 minutes ago, Andy Keane said:

Yes as you say it is easy to obsess over every detail as it goes in but once there its the overall effect that the eye sees. Until of course you take a photo and post in on RMweb when all is laid bare.

And that photo is around 1958 by which time I suspect all maintenance was pretty sketch as compared to the 1920s and 30s which is the period I am trying to capture.

Anyway I have another bit of test track underway which will use the weather sleeper paint. I will report back soon.

Good photo though..the level and condition of the ballast is very un-modelrailway like!

[Andy Keane]

This is my next attempt. The sleepers on the lower track have been painted with Phoenix weathered grey on the right and a 50:50 mix of weathered grey and sleeper grime on the left which makes them a bit darker. The rails and chairs were first painted with "rusty rails". Then there is a patch in the middle where I have over-painted with some track grime. The ballast is Gaugemaster N scale ballast (GM115) with some of my old granite chippings mixed in to add a slightly green edge.

I am now pretty happy with the ballast but not yet decided on the sleeper colour.

 

[Graham T]

I prefer the lighter coloured sleepers myself, but it's your train set 🥸

[Gilbert]

14 minutes ago, Graham T said:

I prefer the lighter coloured sleepers myself, but it's your train set 🥸

Me too...and its a lot easier to darken light stuff if you're not happy with it later...

[Andy Keane]

14 minutes ago, Gilbert said:

Me too...and its a lot easier to darken light stuff if you're not happy with it later...

So the lower right corner of the test board rather than the lower left?

[Gilbert]

Yes Andy - as far as I'm  concerned - although its marginal - and its your train set...

[Mulgabill]

As you might expect, I will come in from a different angle.

 

When starting on Helstonish, I happened to see some comments from Jeff of Gill Head fame here.

 

He used a certain Dulux sort of coffee coloured emulsion, as base for his greenery.

 

Having followed suit, I realised that it was quite close to my recollection of rusty rail colour

in the late 50s / early 60s. i.e. a dull dark brown, rather than the redish brown usually

found in rust paints now.

 

Therefore I now lay the track, and paint it all with said paint. This takes away the plastic look

of the trackwork, and gives the basic rust to the rails.

 

Ballast then gives the definition to the track.

 

This can the be followed with some dry brushing of sleeper, and washes of black/brown.

 

For my money too many layouts are spoiled by over enthusiastic detailing of the track parts.

 

I'll hang my devils advocate hat up now........

 

All the best

TONY

[Gilbert]

1 minute ago, Mulgabill said:

For my money too many layouts are spoiled by over enthusiastic detailing of the track parts.

 

I'll hang my devils advocate hat up now........

 

All the best

TONY

I concur......this is from an earlier post...

 

I think its also important to put everything in perspective......

I often spend a lot of time fussing over track and ballast colours etc .....once the layout is beyond that stage I rarely notice it much again as long as it is not obviously "wrong" ...

 

Chris H

 

[Neal Ball]

On 28/08/2022 at 16:44, Andy Keane said:

Chris

This is a typical colour image when it was still worked by Prairie tanks:

http://www.cornwallrailwaysociety.org.uk/uploads/7/6/8/3/7683812/6460739_orig.jpg

What would you think the best sleeper paint would be to get to that?

regards

Andy

 

Thats an interesting photo Andy. How do you propose to put the wooden boards down in front of the Signal box.

 

At Henley-on-Thames there is a wooden walkway running across the top of the rods - as per Helston, you cant see the crank angles. But every time I look at it, I'm stumped about how to replicate it. 

 

By doing so, int will help to "plant" the signal box.

[Andy Keane]

48 minutes ago, Mulgabill said:

As you might expect, I will come in from a different angle.

 

When starting on Helstonish, I happened to see some comments from Jeff of Gill Head fame here.

 

He used a certain Dulux sort of coffee coloured emulsion, as base for his greenery.

 

Having followed suit, I realised that it was quite close to my recollection of rusty rail colour

in the late 50s / early 60s. i.e. a dull dark brown, rather than the redish brown usually

found in rust paints now.

 

Therefore I now lay the track, and paint it all with said paint. This takes away the plastic look

of the trackwork, and gives the basic rust to the rails.

 

Ballast then gives the definition to the track.

 

This can the be followed with some dry brushing of sleeper, and washes of black/brown.

 

For my money too many layouts are spoiled by over enthusiastic detailing of the track parts.

 

I'll hang my devils advocate hat up now........

 

All the best

TONY

Tony

thanks for this - I have been and looked again at Helstonish and see what you mean.

But then I also saw your photo https://content-eu.invisioncic.com/y320084/monthly_2022_04/1510618673_DSC_1280(4).JPG.f5b5df94782e36ca1007d0b9c2cd4015.JPG

and there I think my "lower left" colour is closer to the track colour under the Manor?

But by the time I have added track grime, cinders and oil I guess it will not matter much.

Andy

[Andy Keane]

Just now, Neal Ball said:

 

Thats an interesting photo Andy. How do you propose to put the wooden boards down in front of the Signal box.

 

At Henley-on-Thames there is a wooden walkway running across the top of the rods - as per Helston, you cant see the crank angles. But every time I look at it, I'm stumped about how to replicate it. 

 

By doing so, int will help to "plant" the signal box.

 

I plan a sheet of plasticard that is scribed deeply for the individual boards and lightly for the wood grain. At least the boards save me the trouble of detailing all the cranks that are under there.

I have a bunch of ModelU rodding to go in from there too.

Andy

[Graham T]

1 minute ago, Andy Keane said:

 

I plan a sheet of plasticard that is scribed deeply for the individual boards and lightly for the wood grain. At least the boards save me the trouble of detailing all the cranks that are under there.

I have a bunch of ModelU rodding to go in from there too.

Andy

 

Have you thought of trying coffee stirrers?  You've got your wood grain then.

[Andy Keane]

2 minutes ago, Graham T said:

 

Have you thought of trying coffee stirrers?  You've got your wood grain then.

Yes I have thought of using real wood and might give it a whorl along with plasticard. As you say you then can get the joints and the grain. But its a bit more long winded. But some time before that at the pace I make progress.

[Neal Ball]

edit: To my comments above 😎

 

I have just checked a photo and found that the walkway is only at the bottom of the SB steps. The area in front of the box shows the rods and the cranks 😕

 

Oh well - save that one for a rainy day 😄

[Graham T]

3 minutes ago, Andy Keane said:

Yes I have thought of using real wood and might give it a whorl along with plasticard. As you say you then can get the joints and the grain. But its a bit more long winded. But some time before that at the pace I make progress.

 

I think I used a thin sheet of plasticard as the base for the boards in front of the Chuffnell R signal box, and then glued the stirrers onto that, which made things a little easier.

Edited August 29, 2022 by Graham T

[Andy Keane]

I have spent a happy hour looking through my books of colour images of the western region from the late fifties and early sixties. I conclude that literally every colour scheme on my test track could be found somewhere on the region. So I just have to pick one and go for it. Then I will dirty it around the various parts of the station like the engine shed and goods yard.