Self-driving cars?

[APOLLO]

Space Savers ? - What a disaster. Quite a few years ago I had an Audi 90 - nice car. I had a puncture one Saturday afternoon, upon fitting the skinny spacesaver I found the road wheel would not fit the space saver tray. Lots of stuff in the boot so road wheel had to go on the back seat !!. I live in Wigan and was on standby in Warrington / Widnes / Runcorn that weekend - That space saver meant 50mph on the M6 / M62 etc the rest of the weekend. (nowhere to get puncture done then). The car drove oddly also. I vowed never again a car with a space saver, but my Seat Leon has one - in the garage after I bought a proper wheel from the scrappie - and yes it fits the wheel well !!!!!

 

As to self driving cars - well, as per electric cars, just not for me. Too many idiots around, we all need 100% concentration when driving as it is. I'm not a fan of all the electronickery in modern cars. 

 

Brit15

[30801]

2 hours ago, kevinlms said:

Is it a good idea to drive on the motorway with a space saver spare wheel? Not saying that it's illegal, just asking whether it is poor practice to do so.

 

Never mind driving on it. You're in danger putting it on. More so on a 'smart' motorway.

[Michael Hodgson]

12 hours ago, black and decker boy said:

 

but who reads the manual???

Tesla owners, whilst the car is doing the driving.

If you've got self-driving technology, why not just get a bit of shut-eye so that you'll be alert when/if you get to your destination.

There's no point in having a dog and barking yourself.

[Chrisr40]

Computer controlled cars...given how often microsoft windows crashes I dont think I would want to give it control

[APOLLO]

Airliners have several computers and backup systems constantly running, cross validating etc. multiple redundancy, yet we had the 737 max incidents and subsequent grounding. 

 

If I ever drove a self driving car (which I doubt) my hands would always be hovering over the wheel, eyes 100% on the road, foot near the brake !!!!

 

Brit15

[kevinlms]

7 minutes ago, Chrisr40 said:

Computer controlled cars...given how often microsoft windows crashes I dont think I would want to give it control

Crash is an important word!

[jonny777]

6 minutes ago, APOLLO said:

Airliners have several computers and backup systems constantly running, cross validating etc. multiple redundancy, yet we had the 737 max incidents and subsequent grounding. 

 

If I ever drove a self driving car (which I doubt) my hands would always be hovering over the wheel, eyes 100% on the road, foot near the brake !!!!

 

Brit15

 

The last time I hired a people carrier for a family occasion, the only one they had was automatic transmission, and had all manner of electronic gadgets.

 

After an hour or so, I grew to hate it. There was virtually nothing for me to do on motorways and dual carriageways, and I found my concentration drifting away from the road. 

 

I was glad to get back to my car with a manual gear box. 

 

Presumably, if I flash my headlights to allow an auto-drive vehicle out of a side street (pedants will rush to remind me this is not allowed in the highway code), it will ignore my unselfishness?  

 

[black and decker boy]

10 minutes ago, jonny777 said:

 

The last time I hired a people carrier for a family occasion, the only one they had was automatic transmission, and had all manner of electronic gadgets.

 

After an hour or so, I grew to hate it. There was virtually nothing for me to do on motorways and dual carriageways, and I found my concentration drifting away from the road. 

 

I was glad to get back to my car with a manual gear box. 

 

Presumably, if I flash my headlights to allow an auto-drive vehicle out of a side street (pedants will rush to remind me this is not allowed in the highway code), it will ignore my unselfishness?  

 

there are no full autonomous drive vehicles legally allowed in UK.

 

The system being consulted on will not pull out of a junction. It will maintain speed, gap & lane control on plain road.

 

I'm not sure what a manual would give you to do over an auto when cruising along on a motorway in 6th gear? Its one advantage of the driver assist systems in that the car is alert and will slow in traffic etc whereas a human may be checking texts / make up / kids and not spot something in front until too late.

[Reorte]

31 minutes ago, APOLLO said:

Airliners have several computers and backup systems constantly running, cross validating etc. multiple redundancy, yet we had the 737 max incidents and subsequent grounding. 

 

If I ever drove a self driving car (which I doubt) my hands would always be hovering over the wheel, eyes 100% on the road, foot near the brake !!!!

You assume you'll be allowed, that they won't be removed...

[30801]

Fully competent self driving in all situations is a long way off but automatic systems are coming thick and fast.

The latest Euro NCAP results give the new Dacia Sandero a mere two stars which is odd as it's actually a very safe car. The reason is that it doesn't have enough driver aids to prevent it crashing into something if you don't bother to steer or brake.

 

[30801]

1 minute ago, Reorte said:

You assume you'll be allowed, that they won't be removed...

 

It's a good point. In a crash the things that are going to damage you are the pedals and steering wheel...

[APOLLO]

1 minute ago, 30801 said:

 

It's a good point. In a crash the things that are going to damage you are the pedals and steering wheel...

 

No pedals or steering wheel I'll be sat in the back telling the car where to go !!!!!!!!!!!

 

What a crazy world we live in !!!!!!!!!!!

 

Brit15

[Michael Hodgson]

1 minute ago, APOLLO said:

 

No pedals or steering wheel I'll be sat in the back telling the car where to go !!!!!!!!!!!

 

What a crazy world we live in !!!!!!!!!!!

 

Brit15

The car will be swearing about back seat drivers!!

[woodyfox]

Driverless cars should save thousands of lives a year. 

Brilliant idea - at least i'll be safer on my cycle too! 

Mr Toad was always going to have to be dragged kicking and screaming from his motor car. 

[Reorte]

13 minutes ago, woodyfox said:

Driverless cars should save thousands of lives a year. 

Brilliant idea - at least i'll be safer on my cycle too! 

Mr Toad was always going to have to be dragged kicking and screaming from his motor car. 

If it's safety you're worried about then you shouldn't be on your bike.

[woodyfox]

6 minutes ago, Reorte said:

If it's safety you're worried about then you shouldn't be on your bike.

That makes no sense? 

Because the motorist knocks me off due to carelessness or recklessness then i should desist??? 

[Canal Digger]

Why not take self-driving cars/ trucks/ buses on a few steps, link them together in convoys on special lanes, with some guidance system. At intervals there could be stops to allow individual vehicles to disengage and form into other convoys until destination reached. Would only require one control system at front and a safety link front to back. Idea might need (as idea catches on) various loops around stops, with a control system, so that faster convoys can pass. Idea could develop so that we would not need our own car but share a compartment with others going the same direction and get on/ off at stops. At these stops there would be other self-driving compartments so that your journey can continue.

Anyone want to help patent this idea? What would we call it?

[Chrisr40]

13 minutes ago, woodyfox said:

That makes no sense? 

Because the motorist knocks me off due to carelessness or recklessness then i should desist??? 

For every careless motorist there is a reckless cyclist with no lights  wearing dark colours when riding at night, ignoring traffic lights, riding on the path when there is a perfectly good cycle lane, riding 2 wide on narrow roads etc. Motorists are not the only villains.

[Reorte]

11 minutes ago, woodyfox said:

That makes no sense? 

Because the motorist knocks me off due to carelessness or recklessness then i should desist??? 

 

Being knocked off by a motorist isn't the only way you can get hurt cycling - "About 16% of fatal or serious reported bike accidents do not involve a collision with another vehicle." (ROSPA) And some of the ones that do will be the fault of the cyclist and unavoidable even with the most effective automatic vehicle, even if most aren't.

[Nearholmer]

If you want an overall, balanced, picture of cycling safety stats, read this https://www.cyclinguk.org/blog/road-casualties-2018-vital-statistics-cycle-campaigning

 

If not, carry on believing what you fancy, or cherry-picking individual statistics in isolation from others, thereby failing to achieve a balanced picture.

 

In the context of this discussion, the issue is whether auto-driven cars can (a) detect cyclists, and (b) follow the Highway Code. I’d be optimistic that on both points they’d do better than people taken as a whole, especially on the latter point.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 29, 2021 by Nearholmer

[Reorte]

3 minutes ago, Chrisr40 said:

For every careless motorist there is a reckless cyclist with no lights  wearing dark colours when riding at night, ignoring traffic lights, riding on the path when there is a perfectly good cycle lane, riding 2 wide on narrow roads etc. Motorists are not the only villains.

Similarly just how widespread amongst different drivers are the ones who cause serious accidents? No-one's perfect so there's always a chance anyone might be responsible for one, but the idea that things should change for everyone due to the behaviour of a very, very much worse than average small group is something I find disturbing.

[Titan]

13 minutes ago, woodyfox said:

That makes no sense? 

Because the motorist knocks me off due to carelessness or recklessness then i should desist??? 

 

That's a bit like saying that because a crocodile eats me due to hunger is no reason not to swim in the crocodile infested river...

[Reorte]

4 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

If you want an overall, balanced, picture of cycling safety stats, read this https://www.cyclinguk.org/blog/road-casualties-2018-vital-statistics-cycle-campaigning

 

If not, carry on believing what you fancy, or cherry-picking individual statistics in isolation from others, thereby failing to achieve a balanced picture.

That doesn't start of at all sounding balanced - "we believe no injury or death on Britain’s roads should be tolerated." The only way you can have that is to have no traffic at all. Any time anyone says "the risk should be zero" - sure, would be nice, but the world will never be that ideal - I have my doubts about their ability to have a balanced picture and get the impression of someone who looks at the world in black and white extremes.

Edited April 29, 2021 by Reorte

[Nearholmer]

Read it, then decide whether it presents the stats in a balanced way.

 

Telling people to stay off bikes because cycling is ‘unsafe’ is frankly ....... well, it’s best i stop there.

 

 

[Reorte]

6 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

Read it, then decide whether it presents the stats in a balanced way.

 

Telling people to stay off bikes because cycling is ‘unsafe’ is frankly ....... well, it’s best i stop there.

I'm not telling people to stay off bikes because cycling's unsafe. I'm pointing out the problems and contradictions that start appearing if you get too black and white about safety. That also means I'm not saying "everything's fine now, don't bother trying to do more" by the way.

 

Cycling could and should be safer than it is. But it'll always pose more danger than travelling by car, whatever sorts of cars we've got.

Edited April 29, 2021 by Reorte