Hornby announce TT:120

[J-Lewis]

I’ve always loved modelling in underdog scales, so I will probably always have a soft spot for my old Triang TT collection, but TT:120 has definitely caught my interest now.  Just need a tank engine for my new layout, and some more blue diesels for my next plan.  A modern replacement for my old Green Class 31 by the end of next year perhaps?  :)

[Covkid]

On 29/10/2023 at 18:42, The Stationmaster said:

Why is a front end coupling redundant on an 08?  The front end was the end that spent far more time than the cab end coupled to something.   I wouldn't mind betting that coupling at the front end probably occurred for well over 80%, and probably even as much as 90%, of the total hours these locos spent working.  Hint - they were best used for shunting with the nose end towards what was being shunted hence you'd find Up & Down yard etc pilots the opposite way round from each other in a yard.

 

Very much so Mike. Our "targets" at Bescot were all arranged to go to work on Sunday night with "radiator north" or"radiator south" depending on what they were working.  The Down hump loco target 1 was a radio fitted loco and was always nose first shunting trains over the hump - simply because the driver wasn't at risk from stuff hitting the rear of the cab. 

   

On 29/10/2023 at 20:21, Les1952 said:

It is not the coupling that is redundant but the kinematic mechanism - the two air tanks mean it hardly moves at all.

 

Les

 

Usefully explained

[TT-Pete]

13 hours ago, J-Lewis said:

Perhaps Triang TT 3mm is the laser disc and TT:120 is the DVD replacement?  😀

 

Or Betamax v.s VHS?

 

Does anyone know where we are up to with the phases? Feels like I've been waiting for the BR blue HST set for a long time now, I thought it was supposed to be Summer?

 

[J-Lewis]

52 minutes ago, TT-Pete said:

es anyone know where we are up to with the phases?

 

 

We are just entering phase 2 now.  So running late.  There is a GWR HST set due April but the Blue & Grey is only available as separate items.

 

Currently it looks like the phases are shaking out as one per year, so phase 3 due thru 2025 and phase 4 in 2026?

 

A lot will become clearer when we see the new catalogue updates (possibly at Warley?)

[TT-Pete]

15 minutes ago, J-Lewis said:

We are just entering phase 2 now.  So running late. 

 

Hmm. I put so much on the Hornby pre-order that I was afraid it would bankrupt me if it all turned up at once, doesn't look like I need to worry about that then. Hope it doesn't lose momentum.

 

[Hroth]

I've already spent my "personal" Christmas Present money, and its not been on anything from Hornby, either OO or TT120.  Even if a "christmas surprise" item or two is announced at Warley, and its the sort of thing I might like, I'm afraid they've missed the boat.

 

[dunnyrail]

On 06/11/2023 at 19:18, Gatesheadgeek said:

Given that phase 3 models are being developed now, that may explain why they’re not showing up even as pre-orders. Compare that to phase 2 models that were available 12 months ago and sone won’t be delivered for another 9 months.
 

That may also be due to the legacy club discount though, now that all members going forward will just get the standard 10% in rewards 

I had been considering letting my TT120 membership lapse, but does this mean that 10% discount plus club point discount will still apply going forwards for membership?

[Johan DC]

1 hour ago, dunnyrail said:

I had been considering letting my TT120 membership lapse, but does this mean that 10% discount plus club point discount will still apply going forwards for membership?

It's free, but no discount. For that you'll have to join the (also free) Hornby rewards.

 

[The Stationmaster]

12 hours ago, Covkid said:

 

Very much so Mike. Our "targets" at Bescot were all arranged to go to work on Sunday night with "radiator north" or"radiator south" depending on what they were working.  The Down hump loco target 1 was a radio fitted loco and was always nose first shunting trains over the hump - simply because the driver wasn't at risk from stuff hitting the rear of the cab. 

   

 

Usefully explained

Apropos of being very OT we had a lot of moans from one of my Drivers about spotting wagons on a particular weighbridge so the LCD S saff sid and I duly piad a site visit hoping to shut him up - mainly because the bloke was a known moaner.  The 360 was the right way rou nd for the job - radiator end nearest the weighbridge and sitghting was really good.   But still he moaned so i said 'Alright I'll bl**dy well do it'. withe the LDCstaff side secretary  whispering in my ear 'Don't Mike, it'll only show what he wants'.

 

Admittedly I was more used to shunting with a steam braked engine but the  technque wasn't much different so I duly spotted the remaining 4 otr 5 wagons in the raft  one-by-one to be weighed.  Good visibility and a useful'mark' from a building to stop spot on every time.  End of moans; Driver getting a right telling off from the LDC staff side for moaning about nothing (and being shown up by the boss).  And that year, and subsequently, I got an invite to the LDC staff side Christmas time day out to Boulogne.

[andrewshimmin]

Since a lot of this thread is speculating on what Hornby "should" produce, I was wondering whimsically about what the chances are of Hornby producing a Class 90 or Class 91 in TT:120?

I still have my 1988 Hornby catalogue with the (OO of course) Class 90, Pacer and LNER apple green pacific circled... Santa sadly didn't have that kind of budget in mind, and I had to wait until 2022 for the LNER pacific - but at least it was 12mm gauge, and so compatible with the TT3 I'd inherited in the meantime!

[BachelorBoy]

On 08/11/2023 at 02:26, Jeff Smith said:

The resurgence of interest in vinyl records is interesting though - perhaps because analogue sound is considered superior to the CD format.....!

 

Some analogue or mechanical technologies don't die out completely when they are superseded. They survive by going upmarket and/or being picked up by people who want to express that they are outside the mainstream.

 

Eg, mechanical watches, fountain pens, horses, vinyl records.

 

 

 

[BachelorBoy]

On 08/11/2023 at 01:52, Porfuera said:

 

If you look on social media you will find that Hornby have attracted quite a number of new people to the hobby, which from the beginning was their stated aim and they should be congratulated for that.

 

How many? Hundreds? Thousands? Tens of thousands?

[HExpressD]

4 minutes ago, BachelorBoy said:

How many? Hundreds? Thousands? Tens of thousands?

The outer protector box for my Scotsman set (the first run) seems to suggest there were 800 odd sets in that delivery, plus another set and another delivery of both since (not to mention the digital ones!) Probably thousands, maybe pushing ten thousand sets sold. Not all will be new to the hobby of course, but decent numbers I would appear. 

[Porfuera]

59 minutes ago, BachelorBoy said:

How many? Hundreds? Thousands? Tens of thousands?

 

Fairly obviously there are no actual numbers of new railway modellers in TT:120 but surely attracting any new people to the hobby must be a good thing?

 

And for each person that posts on social media then there are almost certainly many more that don't, whether they're new modellers or existing modellers.

[J-Lewis]

My carton was the same.  It looks like 700+ of each set per run.  Anecdotally we know of at least six deliveries so approximately 4000-5000 sets sold in twelve months?  Possibly a lot more.  Then there are the various bundles and individual locos, several of which are also out of stock.  So sales seem healthy so far, and judging from forum posts there seems to be a lot of pent up demand for new models too.

 

[Trainnoob]

I think Hornby would go far with TT if it's going to be any more affordable than 00.

[BachelorBoy]

1 hour ago, J-Lewis said:

My carton was the same.  It looks like 700+ of each set per run.  Anecdotally we know of at least six deliveries so approximately 4000-5000 sets sold in twelve months?  Possibly a lot more.  Then there are the various bundles and individual locos, several of which are also out of stock.  So sales seem healthy so far, and judging from forum posts there seems to be a lot of pent up demand for new models too.

 

Thanks. Encouraging signs.

[philsandy]

Anyone know when the BR 9F is likely to be available?

 

Edit: Just seen  an earlier post, apparently dropped from Phase 3/4.

Edited November 10, 2023 by philsandy

[Porfuera]

1 hour ago, philsandy said:

Anyone know when the BR 9F is likely to be available?

 

It was going to be Phase 3 or 4 but the 9F and the Class 60 have been pushed back in favour of the J94 and the 57xx, or (alternative explanation) development of the 0-6-0s have overtaken the 9F and the Class 60 and so the 0-6-0s have replaced the 9F and the Class 60 in Phases 3 and 4.

 

Either way it looks like it will be Phase 5 or later i.e. after the Class 37 and 47 (Phase 3) and then the Castle, J94 and 57xx and the Class 31 (Phase 4) assuming development of these locos remains as planned. This was mentioned a couple of pages back.

 

At current rates of production that will be 3 or 4 years away, given that the consensus is that Hornby are managing one Phase per year at the present time and we are just about starting Phase 2. 

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by Porfuera

[J-Lewis]

1 hour ago, philsandy said:

Anyone know when the BR 9F is likely to be available?

It was mentioned as just finishing the design phase in an interview from two or three months ago.  Still seems to be in Phase 4 but no dates given yet.  If the phases are indeed each lasting twelve months then that would put the 9F as late 2026.

 

Hopefully it’s not too far away as I’m also very keen to get one :)

[Porfuera]

37 minutes ago, J-Lewis said:

It was mentioned as just finishing the design phase in an interview from two or three months ago.  Still seems to be in Phase 4 but no dates given yet.  If the phases are indeed each lasting twelve months then that would put the 9F as late 2026.

 

Hopefully it’s not too far away as I’m also very keen to get one :)

 

It is in the catalogue as being in Phase 3 or 4 but the more recent "future phases" announcement (from 25th July) doesn't mention either the 9F or the Class 60 and instead has the J94 and 57xx:

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/hornbytt120/future

[Les1952]

5 hours ago, Porfuera said:

 

It is in the catalogue as being in Phase 3 or 4 but the more recent "future phases" announcement (from 25th July) doesn't mention either the 9F or the Class 60 and instead has the J94 and 57xx:

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/hornbytt120/future

 

I don't think we can necessarily read too much into the "what is in which phase" argument.  What we DO know is that there was a starting list, and a lot of the items on that list are at various stages of development.

We ALSO know that each different model produces its own difficulties which mean each progresses at a different rate.

And that production slots have been used up meeting unexpected demand for more of the earlier models

AND China is still having Covid closedowns, skill shortages and other problems we know little about

AND there is still a shortage of shipping containers

and so on....

 

What we DON'T know because Hornby are not about to give out commercial information that might help possible competitors is how many additional production slots are being shifted to TT:120 rather than potentially less profitable OO or other items- we DO know that TT:120 is generating a healthy profit despite the nay-sayers.

 

We just need to wait for announcements - and learn that virtue which huge numbers of RMWebbers lack - patience.

 

Les

 

[Porfuera]

2 hours ago, Les1952 said:

I don't think we can necessarily read too much into the "what is in which phase" argument.  What we DO know is that there was a starting list, and a lot of the items on that list are at various stages of development.

We ALSO know that each different model produces its own difficulties which mean each progresses at a different rate.

And that production slots have been used up meeting unexpected demand for more of the earlier models

AND China is still having Covid closedowns, skill shortages and other problems we know little about

AND there is still a shortage of shipping containers

and so on....

 

What we DON'T know because Hornby are not about to give out commercial information that might help possible competitors is how many additional production slots are being shifted to TT:120 rather than potentially less profitable OO or other items- we DO know that TT:120 is generating a healthy profit despite the nay-sayers.

 

We just need to wait for announcements - and learn that virtue which huge numbers of RMWebbers lack - patience.

 

Les

 

And surely that is exactly what this was - an announcement - and to date it is the only one they've made in writing AFAIAA so they presumably took the time to make sure it was as correct as it could be before they released the information.

 

Yes things are going to change over time and that is what seems to have happened here - the 9F and Class 60 are listed in the catalogue as being in Phases 3/4 and the J94 and 57xx were shown as being later and now they've been swapped around. Whether it is because Hornby were actually listening to people that were asking for 0-6-0 steam shunters and so they brought those forward or whether it is because the development/production of the 9F and the Class 60 are taking longer than expected we'll probably never know.

 

As for putting release items into phases, this is probably better than having a single monolithic list of upcoming items because a single list would have to be chopped and changed quite frequently and people would forever be complaining that loco X was supposed to be released before loco Y and now it isn't. By grouping items into a phases it gives Hornby a bit of wriggle room to adjust the order in which individual items are released within a given phase without having to announce that they've made a change, which is something they get slated for quite a lot. And the steam and diesel phases don't seem to be directly connected either so that gives them a bit more flexibility.

 

However they do appear to have made a change here and I think it is good that they've let people know - there have been a lot of complaints about the lack of information and now we have some. I'm sure they'll let us know of future changes once they are confident that the new information is correct.

 

As for this particular change, I'm not bothered about it - I won't be buying a steam 0-6-0 or a 9F. A Class 60 might be a possibility but I'd rather have the Class 37, 47 and 31 and at the moment those seem to be as originally planned, and even if those change then it is something we will have to live with.

Edited November 11, 2023 by Porfuera

[J-Lewis]

I expect the new changes at the top of marketing and the new manager will be at least part of the reason why the information has been scarce.  The Hornby website, and particularly the TT section hasn’t been updated for quite some time (it’s still promoting the diorama competition that ended a month ago).

 

I suspect there are changes going behind the scenes and we are about to see the results.  It’s already been hinted at by the new head of marketing.  My money is on a Lego style release schedule, shorter ‘seasons’ and less lead time.  So we get a lot more hype around whichever model is ‘current’ and then move on to the next one.

 

We may already be seeing this with the marketing focus on the Class 50, but because it had been teased so much since launch it feel like repetition rather than hype?

[teletougos]

I do wish Hornby would send me my paid-for 66 so I can put the block in place and never get another email from them again :)