Formula 1 2023

[Andrew P]

[Hroth]

10 minutes ago, Andrew P said:

 

"Being nice to Lance" is a bit on the light side...

 

[didcot]

Lance doesn't get anywhere near Fernando. 

[OnTheBranchline]

Fun fact #1: Perez is 4-4 head-to-head in qualifying this season against Hulkenberg, Norris, Piastri and Ocon. And Perez is in one of the most dominant cars ever made…

 

Fun fact #2: As of round 9, only three drivers have completed every single racing lap of the season and finished in the points. Max Verstappen, Fernando Alonso, and Lewis Hamilton.

Edited June 22, 2023 by OnTheBranchline

[Pete the Elaner]

5 hours ago, OnTheBranchline said:

Fun fact #1: Perez is 4-4 head-to-head in qualifying this season against Hulkenberg, Norris, Piastri and Ocon. And Perez is in one of the most dominant cars ever made…

 

Fun fact #2: As of round 9, only three drivers have completed every single racing lap of the season and finished in the points. Max Verstappen, Fernando Alonso, and Lewis Hamilton.

 

Perez has been shocking this season. Maybe putting him in a decent car puts him under pressure to perform?

 

So the 3 drivers to not DNF are not only in decent cars but also the only WCs in the field? That says quite a lot.

[OnTheBranchline]

3 hours ago, Pete the Elaner said:

 

Perez has been shocking this season. Maybe putting him in a decent car puts him under pressure to perform?

 

So the 3 drivers to not DNF are not only in decent cars but also the only WCs in the field? That says quite a lot.

He thinks this is his shot at the title but he’s nowhere in the same league as Max, talent wise.

[woodenhead]

3 hours ago, Pete the Elaner said:

 

Perez has been shocking this season. Maybe putting him in a decent car puts him under pressure to perform?

 

So the 3 drivers to not DNF are not only in decent cars but also the only WCs in the field? That says quite a lot.

The whole Red Bull set up forces the 'other' drivers to perform or lose their seat, only Max gets a pass on that option.  Perez had to over perform to justify not having team orders go against him, as long as he was within a few points of Max then he could argue his case, but now he is firmly in back up position.  The pressure to keep up must be immense and slipping back will have heaped more pressure onto him (self inflicted), Helmut Marko was correct that he needs to just accept where he is and let performance come back to him otherwise he will buckle.

37 minutes ago, OnTheBranchline said:

He thinks this is his shot at the title but he’s nowhere in the same league as Max, talent wise.

Probably not, but given the preferential treatment Max gets then Perez had to work even harder than him to justify them not invoking team orders.  But that moment has passed for this season, so he needs to focus on second place as Alonso and Hamilton are now racking up points.

 

I see it as Verstappen, Hamilton, Alonso for the top three drivers by the season end, I expect Mercedes development to overtake Aston Martin as the season progresses.

[OnTheBranchline]

Max receives no more preferential treatment than Schumacher did with Barrichello, Alonso with Massa, Lewis with Bottas, Vettel with Webber (after 2010), etc etc. 

Edited June 22, 2023 by OnTheBranchline

[Hobby]

I'm not convinced about that at all. "In theory" (ie what the teams tell us) that may be true but Max will ensure that he does get preferential treatment, same as Schumacher, by force of character, neither of those two take/took prisoners. Alonso and Hamilton, though, are less nasty, though even they will ensure their needs came first. You don't get to that level by being nice.

[Pete the Elaner]

33 minutes ago, Hobby said:

I'm not convinced about that at all. "In theory" (ie what the teams tell us) that may be true but Max will ensure that he does get preferential treatment, same as Schumacher, by force of character, neither of those two take/took prisoners. Alonso and Hamilton, though, are less nasty, though even they will ensure their needs came first. You don't get to that level by being nice.

 

Their was the "Fernando is faster than you" radio call from Ferrari while team orders were banned. I felt that was more Ferrari than Alonso.
There was also crashgate. Alonso claimed he was not aware of the plans & there was no evidence to suggest he was lying.

The team knew though. Piquet practised it on the out lap.
Although he was not directly involved with either of these, he did pit at an unusual time just before Piquet's crash & this would have severely compromised his race unless a safety car had been needed exactly when it was. He knew that but didn't argue about being pitted. That was completely against his character.

[OnTheBranchline]

12 hours ago, Hobby said:

I'm not convinced about that at all. "In theory" (ie what the teams tell us) that may be true but Max will ensure that he does get preferential treatment, same as Schumacher, by force of character, neither of those two take/took prisoners. Alonso and Hamilton, though, are less nasty, though even they will ensure their needs came first. You don't get to that level by being nice.

 

During Spygate, Alonso tried to blackmail Ron Dennis into giving Alonso #1 status over Lewis Hamilton. Let's not forget that. 

[Hobby]

I'm not forgetting anything, as I said you don't get to that level by being nice. But I'd still say Max and Shumacher take things to a much higher level. 

[Andrew P]

Hitech seek to enter F1 from 2026 season with Kazakh backing.

 

https://www.espn.co.uk/f1/story/_/id/37918753/hitech-seek-enter-f1-2026-season-kazakh-backing

[didcot]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/motorsport/66076074

 

Another young life lost at Spa today in appalling conditions. 

[njee20]

Not a single post about qualifying or the sprint race in Austria. Bit of a damning indictment!

 

Quali was ridiculous with all the track limits infractions. Just stick some gravel there to stop them doing it. Must have been an uncomfortable debrief for Perez. Best sprint race I've seen I think, the wet-dry conditions giving a chance for some interest. Fair play to Russell, great job by him to make up ground after gambling on the slicks.

[Hroth]

Conventional practice/qualifying is just about bearable this season.

Foreshortening it and tacking a "sprint race" on to determine positions for the GP is essentially fatuous. Its as bad as the silly street circuits that the racing calender is stuffed with.

 

I may watch the highlights on C4 tomorrow, but as I keep an eye on the BBC online report, if it looks like a dull race, I might not.

 

 

 

[SR71]

Had forgotten there was even a race this weekend. Watched the highlights this morning. Sprint race was actually quite good. All the qualifying a little pointless.

 

How come Max had noticeably more mid range punch off the corners at the beginning? Checko should have come out of that battle much closer but twice lost out on torque off the corner once they were both straight. I think they are being given different engine maps.

[298]

28 minutes ago, SR71 said:

How come Max had noticeably more mid range punch off the corners at the beginning? Checko should have come out of that battle much closer but twice lost out on torque off the corner once they were both straight. I think they are being given different engine maps.

 

He certainly didn't during SQ1 when he deliberately impeded Hamilton in a revenge move for something Toto has admitted was a failure in communication on the teams part to notify their driver. I'm surprised the Stewards took no notice of either incident...

[SR71]

Ch4 didn't have enough on that (or I skipped through it). They probably figured they cancelled each other out. But that itself could be an issue if drivers start taking discipline into their own hands.

[Darius43]

13 hours ago, Hroth said:

Conventional practice/qualifying is just about bearable this season.

Foreshortening it and tacking a "sprint race" on to determine positions for the GP is essentially fatuous. Its as bad as the silly street circuits that the racing calender is stuffed with.

 

I may watch the highlights on C4 tomorrow, but as I keep an eye on the BBC online report, if it looks like a dull race, I might not.

 

 

 

Qualifying for the Sunday F1 race was on Friday.  The sprint race on Saturday was a stand alone race with the positions determined by a mini “sprint shootout” qualifying session a few hours before the race.  The results of the sprint race did not set the grid for Sunday.

 

Cheers

 

Darius

[Obi-Jiff Kenobi]

Despite the changes (i.e. sprint qually & race now having no influence on grid for main race) I still find the sprint races a pointless waste of time.

[Pete the Elaner]

20 hours ago, njee20 said:

Not a single post about qualifying or the sprint race in Austria. Bit of a damning indictment!

 

Quali was ridiculous with all the track limits infractions. Just stick some gravel there to stop them doing it. Must have been an uncomfortable debrief for Perez. Best sprint race I've seen I think, the wet-dry conditions giving a chance for some interest. Fair play to Russell, great job by him to make up ground after gambling on the slicks.

 

They've been through all that.

Gravel causes cars to get stuck, which requires safety cars while the stricken cars are retrieved.

Barriers cause damage, requiring safety cars while the damage is cleared away. They may also cause driver's safety cells to be compromised. A heavy collision will also require the race to be stopped while repairs are carried out.

Abrasive run off areas look awful (Paul Ricard) & if they are very abrasive, they cause cars to spin out of control. Safety cars again.

 

Penalties are the next best option but they will only work as a deterrent is they are severe enough & applied firmly.

[The Lurker]

1 hour ago, Pete the Elaner said:

 

They've been through all that.

Gravel causes cars to get stuck, which requires safety cars while the stricken cars are retrieved.

Barriers cause damage, requiring safety cars while the damage is cleared away. They may also cause driver's safety cells to be compromised. A heavy collision will also require the race to be stopped while repairs are carried out.

Abrasive run off areas look awful (Paul Ricard) & if they are very abrasive, they cause cars to spin out of control. Safety cars again.

 

Penalties are the next best option but they will only work as a deterrent is they are severe enough & applied firmly.

And now the FIA have upheld an Aston Martin protest that track limit penalties have not been consistently applied; there were more than 1200 deleted laps over the course of the race.(Motorsport.com)

[Andrew P]

Twelve post-race penalties mix up Austrian GP result.

 

https://www.espn.co.uk/f1/story/_/id/37950062/twelve-post-race-penalties-mix-austrian-gp-result

[njee20]

3 hours ago, Pete the Elaner said:

Penalties are the next best option but they will only work as a deterrent is they are severe enough & applied firmly.

Half the field getting penalties is essentially the best option? Including 12 (edited) applied after the race. We’ll have to agree to disagree on that, that’s ridiculous. There’s gravel on the outside of other corners in Austria, 4 catches a few out, but you don’t get track limit infractions there. 

Edited July 2, 2023 by njee20