Small Metro builds 2023

[longchap]

Several modellers share an interest in these small 4-coupled tank engines, available currently only as kits and following the excellent suggestion from Phil @Harlequin and shared with @Neal Ball @MrWolf @Andy Keane , I’ve started this thread for us and others  to record our comments, thoughts, hints and hopefully builds of these delightful engines.

 

Let the fun commennce  .  .  .

 

[longchap]

A bit of a long introduction, apologies

 

I started building a Clifton Downs set some years ago and realised that there was not a suitable RTR loco available to work it, so following a flurry of research and eBay bidding, before I knew it, I had acquired two 517s and a small Metro .  .  .  that’s the easy bit, but producing a good working model was another thing and after failing to get to the Pendon chassis building course for three consecutive years, was beginning to think I would never get the expert help needed, until was very fortunate to secure a place at Missenden Abbey in March and understand that Andy Keane is also attending and building the same loco kit!

 

By no means an expert or very experienced railway modeller, I would describe myself as reasonably competent with a logical approach to model making, however, this is  my personal list of the major points with the build which give me cause for concern due to lack of experience:

 

        ·        Etched chassis construction ! ! ! !

 

Yep, that’s it, including of course working with very small parts, mastering sprung / compensated chassis, installing hornblocks, soldering brass really neatly, assembling motor / gearbox / wiring, fixing wheelsets, etc and etc!

 

Anyway, no good worrying, so I’ve been collecting information, parts, materials and tools ready for the Missenden course, so don’t expect much from me until March, after the course.

 

Missenden provide a well hidded downloadable pdf of suggested tools 

https://www.missendenrailwaymodellers.org.uk/index.php/what-should-i-bring-2/ , which I assume @Andy Keanehas perused and which I will revisit again before travelling to the UK next weekend for a model railway show.

 

BFN

 

Edited January 21, 2023 by longchap

[Andy Keane]

I too am assembling lots of bits for the course and also as many photos as I can find. In my case there is a specific loco I want to model and I even have a couple of photos of it so I know the variant I need to build. I have had quite a lot of chat with @t-b-g who will be our course tutor at Missenden and he has been very helpful to my planning.

As yet I am undecided about compensation on the main drivers - I have three of the Korean built brass 45xx locos with compensated chassis set ups and one of them is rather troublesome in use.

I worry that with my skills I might create more problems than I solve.

The Autumn 1992 edition of the GWR Journal has a nice article on Metros with a good GA drawing and there is also the very good web site at http://www.gwr.org.uk/no4-coup-tanks.html

Andy

 

[longchap]

Good that you already know the course tutor Andy and why don't you also bring the troublesome running 45xx in case there is time for @t-b-g to help with advice?

 

As the Metro chassis is designed for compensation, has pivot holes drilled in the frames and has all the parts needed, it may probably be a straightforward task to fit it and there are still options on how many axles to fit it to. For example, the rear driver could be fixed with the beam attached and resting on the central driver, for which you would need hornblocks and to cut out the pre-marked hornblock gap on the fret with a piercing saw.

 

I'm keeping an open mind on compensation until the course.

 

You should be able to get hornblocks at Eastleigh.

 

 

Edited January 21, 2023 by longchap

[Harlequin]

I bought a Small Metro kit from South Eastern Finecast at Warley 2018 (2019?) and then visited the Highlevel stand for a motor and gearbox and the Gibson stand for wheels, axles and coupling rods (just to be sure). So in theory, I have all the major parts, although it turns out that the driving wheels are not quite right. I think I'll live with that.

 

This is my first kit build and I started it with enthusiasm. I got so far with it, reached a point where I wasn't sure of the best way forward and that's where it has stayed ever since. Here it is today at the back of my workbench, mostly in an old ice-cream tub:

 

Just one of many projects started but never finished. ☹️

 

I'm hoping to get some pointers and some impetus from this topic to get it going again. My plan is to keep mine as simple as possible: No compensation, no fancy variations, just a clean simple typical example of the class in the mid 1930s (specific identity to be decided). It will have to be DCC controlled but I don't foresee any problems there.

 

Edited January 21, 2023 by Harlequin

[Andy Keane]

I have a DCC set-up from John Gymer at YouChoos ready to fit with a 14xx sound file. I am not sure if it will be possible to squeeze much stay-alive in but plan to try either with plain supercaps or a STACO1 system.

For me a less obvious thing is couplings - I use Kadees normally and so will need to see how best to fit those as well.

[Andy Keane]

44 minutes ago, Harlequin said:

I bought a Small Metro kit from South Eastern Finecast at Warley 2018 (2019?) and then visited the Highlevel stand for a motor and gearbox and the Gibson stand for wheels, axles and coupling rods (just to be sure). So in theory, I have all the major parts, although it turns out that the driving wheels are not quite right. I think I'll live with that.

 

This is my first kit build and I started it with enthusiasm. I got so far with it, reached a point where I wasn't sure of the best way forward and that's where it has stayed ever since. Here it is today at the back of my workbench, mostly in an old ice-cream tub:

 

Just one of many projects started but never finished. ☹️

 

I'm hoping to get some pointers and some impetus from this topic to get it going again. My plan is to keep mine as simple as possible: No compensation, no fancy variations, just a clean simple typical example of the class in the mid 1930s (specific identity to be decided). It will have to be DCC controlled but I don't foresee any problems there.

 

Phil - on another topic where did you get that 3D (?) printed grey  square vent block from please? I need to build a stable block and needs just such a thing on its roof!

[Harlequin]

3 minutes ago, Andy Keane said:

Phil - on another topic where did you get that 3D (?) printed grey  square vent block from please? I need to build a stable block and needs just such a thing on its roof!

I made it for @Schooner. Designed it in Sketchup from a photo he posted, printed it, Bob's your uncle. 3D printing isn't always that easy but in this case it worked really well. I'm happy to print one for you if you want.

 

3D printing might come in useful with the Metros too. For instance, maybe to create NEM pockets that mount to the frames somehow for our different chosen types of couplings.

 

[melmerby]

50 minutes ago, Harlequin said:

I bought a Small Metro kit from South Eastern Finecast at Warley 2018 (2019?) and then visited the Highlevel stand for a motor and gearbox and the Gibson stand for wheels, axles and coupling rods

I've got one as well.

It is on the pile (6), of to do loco kits☹️.

It's number 4 with 1 & 2 nearly finished, 3 body done but chassis part built and 4, 5 & 6 still in the boxes.

[melmerby]

1 minute ago, Harlequin said:

3D printing might come in useful with the Metros too. For instance, maybe to create NEM pockets that mount to the frames somehow for our different chosen types of couplings.

Dapol pockets are available as spares and consist of a pocket with a screw mounting and a centering spring assembly. (no dovetails)

I bought a pack of 50 (?)

[Andy Keane]

1 hour ago, Harlequin said:

I made it for @Schooner. Designed it in Sketchup from a photo he posted, printed it, Bob's your uncle. 3D printing isn't always that easy but in this case it worked really well. I'm happy to print one for you if you want.

 

3D printing might come in useful with the Metros too. For instance, maybe to create NEM pockets that mount to the frames somehow for our different chosen types of couplings.

 

Phil

thats very kind - do you have a few dimensions? this is what I am basing my building on

regards

Andy

 

[Neal Ball]

2 minutes ago, Andy Keane said:

Phil

thats very kind - do you have a few dimensions? this is what I am basing my building on

regards

Andy

 

 

There is supposed to be a stable block at Henley-on-Thames as well .... but just like the stationmasters house, its going to be a No from me 🤣

[Andy Keane]

1 minute ago, Neal Ball said:

 

There is supposed to be a stable block at Henley-on-Thames as well .... but just like the stationmasters house, its going to be a No from me 🤣

There is a whole book on stable blocks and one of our number who builds spectacular ones:

[russell price]

I shall be  following with interest too, i have an unbuilt finecast kit and the S E etched chassis kit and a mashima motor. I have built plenty of loco kits but nothing compensated so will see how you get on. I think the Metro is a prototype  that needs a compensated  chassis. 

[Neal Ball]

Thank you for setting this project page up Bill @longchap, I am late to this particular party having been soldering all afternoon and then dealing with Urbanisation "stuff" since coming upstairs.

 

I acquired my small Metro tank from eBay probably about 10 years ago when we still lived in the UK.

 

The body is already built, although shewing its age with split pins for the handrail knobs.. they have been taken off and replaced with proper handrail knobs. The purchase also came with a white metal chassis and an Xo4 motor. It was however missing its connector rods.

 

Something needed to give, so I have decided to replace the chassis with an etched chassis from Squires / Finecast and a motor / gearbox from Comet models / Wizard. I looked at the Highline alternative, but as I needed other Comet items, it makes sense to get it all together.

 

 

The above photo was taken a week or so ago and is pretty much as it was when I bought it from eBay.

 

This will start to change over the course of the next month or so.

 

In the meantime, I have bought GW engines vol 1 which covers the Dean era of locos. In which are a set of very nice small Metro tanks, covering the Finecast model. Including loco 615 which I also have photos from the Henley-on-Thames branch. My loco therefore will be no 615.

 

This is 615 in 1925 at Reading.

 

 

So very much work in progress, but it will shortly be on the bench being worked on.

 

Which decoder? I am very impressed that @Andy Keane has the sound decoder already! I think I will need to see what space I have left after the motor is fitted, hopefully I too can get a Youchoos sound project in there....

 

 

I should add that I have never built a loco before - wish me luck!

 

To be continued....

Edited January 21, 2023 by Neal Ball
loco novice

[longchap]

37 minutes ago, Neal Ball said:

 

There is supposed to be a stable block at Henley-on-Thames as well .... but just like the stationmasters house, its going to be a No from me 🤣

 

It looks as if several of us should have stable blocks to build. My prototype is the one at Moreton in Marsh and the only tricky part will of course be those roof vents!

 

I still hope that you can find the space for the station master's house Neal, if not the stable block.

 

 

[russell price]

2 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

Thank you for setting this project page up Bill @longchap, I am late to this particular party having been soldering all afternoon and then dealing with Urbanisation "stuff" since coming upstairs.

 

I acquired my small Metro tank from eBay probably about 10 years ago when we still lived in the UK.

 

The body is already built, although shewing its age with split pins for the handrail knobs.. they have been taken off and replaced with proper handrail knobs. The purchase also came with a white metal chassis and an Xo4 motor. It was however missing its connector rods.

 

Something needed to give, so I have decided to replace the chassis with an etched chassis from Squires / Finecast and a motor / gearbox from Comet models / Wizard. I looked at the Highline alternative, but as I needed other Comet items, it makes sense to get it all together.

 

 

The above photo was taken a week or so ago and is pretty much as it was when I bought it from eBay.

 

This will start to change over the course of the next month or so.

 

In the meantime, I have bought GW engines vol 1 which covers the Dean era of locos. In which are a set of very nice small Metro tanks, covering the Finecast model. Including loco 615 which I also have photos from the Henley-on-Thames branch. My loco therefore will be no 615.

 

This is 615 in 1925 at Reading.

 

 

So very much work in progress, but it will shortly be on the bench being worked on.

 

Which decoder? I am very impressed that @Andy Keane has the sound decoder already! I think I will need to see what space I have left after the motor is fitted, hopefully I too can get a Youchoos sound project in there....

 

 

I should add that I have never built a loco before - wish me luck!

 

To be continued....

Having seen your coach building. i think you will be fine. My bugbear is getting the pick ups to look tidy and above all work reliably. The metro is a good little starter loco to do, that said after seeing some of your coach building i have also dug out my BSL autocoach which i do wonder about. mind i have no instructions with it either so not too sure if its all there or not.

[Schooner]

8 hours ago, Harlequin said:

...but in this case it worked really well.

Can confirm! A really nice print, plenty strong enough and the detail is gorgeous :)

 

...I just need to have a final measure and fettle to get back to you with an update...!

 

EDIT: Sorry, only got background pics of the vents for now, but FYI @Andy Keane

Not an ideal pic on any level, but hopefully it gives an idea of what they're like in context.

Edited January 22, 2023 by Schooner
Big fan of the Metros (and stables), following along with glee

[Neal Ball]

10 hours ago, longchap said:

 

It looks as if several of us should have stable blocks to build. My prototype is the one at Moreton in Marsh and the only tricky part will of course be those roof vents!

 

I still hope that you can find the space for the station master's house Neal, if not the stable block.

 

 

 

Space is obviously a consideration, but its more having the time to make them, which would divert attention away from other areas of the railway. 

 

In a spare 5 minutes yesterday, I was looking at the goods shed again. It needs more work to finish it off. Then the platform canopy, still needs finishing! 

 

I was hoping to tackle both shortly.... but the Metro build will divert attention for a while.

 

7 hours ago, russell price said:

Having seen your coach building. i think you will be fine. My bugbear is getting the pick ups to look tidy and above all work reliably. The metro is a good little starter loco to do, that said after seeing some of your coach building i have also dug out my BSL autocoach which i do wonder about. mind i have no instructions with it either so not too sure if its all there or not.

 

Thanks Russell. 

 

I also have some incomplete carriages which I have had for a while, that one day need to be finished.

 

Somewhere is a Mallard models Clerestory sleeping carriage, which is a lovely model if I could finish it off. It will be for the well known daily sleeper Henley-on-Thames to Penzance service!

 

Sourcing parts I would have thought would be a straightforward proposition, starting maybe with the Comet pages to see what you could get and go from there.

 

Good luck!

[Andy Keane]

I think there is some law of thermodynamics that says the rate that model railway kits get completed is always less than the rate at which they get purchased.

[longchap]

7 minutes ago, Andy Keane said:

I think there is some law of thermodynamics that says the rate that model railway kits get completed is always less than the rate at which they get purchased.

 

Yes, but we am taking steps to reverse that situation !

 

I think that Ian, an LMS modeller here, is also attending Missenden.

 

 

[Gilbert]

17 hours ago, longchap said:

Good that you already know the course tutor Andy and why don't you also bring the troublesome running 45xx in case there is time for @t-b-g to help with advice?

Good morning Longchap- everyone on the Missenden Spring Weekend courses will get a contact form with questions etc a few weeks before the course which is returned to the relevant tutor. Until then if there's anything you specifically want to know in advance I suggest you use the contact form:

https://www.missendenrailwaymodellers.org.uk/index.php/contact-us/

and we'll get it to the tutors?

I've noted your comments about the tool list - we'll see what we can do to make it easier to find!

https://www.missendenrailwaymodellers.org.uk/index.php/what-should-i-bring-2/

Which show are you travelling to?

Chris H

 

[longchap]

3 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

 

Sourcing parts I would have thought would be a straightforward proposition, starting maybe with the Comet pages to see what you could get and go from there.

 

 

Yes, Comet provide excellent products and I have one of their chassis kits to build for a now topless fed split chassis Pannier.

 

It is also worth looking at High Level Kits, who have a most useful website with downloadable resources to help with selecting gearboxes and motors from their range for use in their chassis kits as well as from other manufacturers. Their service and telephone help is first class. No other connection.

 

 

[Andy Keane]

14 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

Thank you for setting this project page up Bill @longchap, I am late to this particular party having been soldering all afternoon and then dealing with Urbanisation "stuff" since coming upstairs.

 

I acquired my small Metro tank from eBay probably about 10 years ago when we still lived in the UK.

 

The body is already built, although shewing its age with split pins for the handrail knobs.. they have been taken off and replaced with proper handrail knobs. The purchase also came with a white metal chassis and an Xo4 motor. It was however missing its connector rods.

 

Something needed to give, so I have decided to replace the chassis with an etched chassis from Squires / Finecast and a motor / gearbox from Comet models / Wizard. I looked at the Highline alternative, but as I needed other Comet items, it makes sense to get it all together.

 

 

The above photo was taken a week or so ago and is pretty much as it was when I bought it from eBay.

 

This will start to change over the course of the next month or so.

 

In the meantime, I have bought GW engines vol 1 which covers the Dean era of locos. In which are a set of very nice small Metro tanks, covering the Finecast model. Including loco 615 which I also have photos from the Henley-on-Thames branch. My loco therefore will be no 615.

 

This is 615 in 1925 at Reading.

 

 

So very much work in progress, but it will shortly be on the bench being worked on.

 

Which decoder? I am very impressed that @Andy Keane has the sound decoder already! I think I will need to see what space I have left after the motor is fitted, hopefully I too can get a Youchoos sound project in there....

 

 

I should add that I have never built a loco before - wish me luck!

 

To be continued....

I suspect several of us will bring copies of JH Russell's volumes along with us to the course. They are lovely books.

[longchap]

5 minutes ago, Gilbert said:

Good morning Longchap- everyone on the Missenden Spring Weekend courses will get a contact form with questions etc a few weeks before the course which is returned to the relevant tutor. Until then if there's anything you specifically want to know in advance I suggest you use the contact form:

https://www.missendenrailwaymodellers.org.uk/index.php/contact-us/

and we'll get it to the tutors?

I've noted your comments about the tool list - we'll see what we can do to make it easier to find!

https://www.missendenrailwaymodellers.org.uk/index.php/what-should-i-bring-2/

Which show are you travelling to?

Chris H

 

 

Hi Chris,

 

Thanks for your support and I'm getting a travelling toolbox up together for Missenden and will get a few other items from the SMRS exhibition at Barton Peveril College at Eastleigh, this next weekend.

 

It's a favourite of mine and a good sized event, which has been missing from the circuit for three years due to Covid and has a very good trade representation, including Roxey Mouldings and Squires.

 

https://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=17118&forum_id=65

 

My principal concern with chassis building is particularly with fold up hornblocks, where the successful making of them is so far eluding me! High Level's are highly recommended, although I have some alternatives just in case I find myself incapable!

 

Bill