Blacker Lane D.P.

[cctransuk]

10 minutes ago, Nick C said:

How about this stuff? https://www.eezyloads.co.uk/online-shop/artificial-coal-oo-ho-gauge/

 

No idea if it's any good, but it's a fraction of the price of the more well known brands...

 

If you zoom in, it's evident that it is crushed beads of some substance.

 

Lots of partial spherical surfaces, which don't appear in coal.

 

CJI.

[Ruston]

7 hours ago, Nick C said:

How about this stuff? https://www.eezyloads.co.uk/online-shop/artificial-coal-oo-ho-gauge/

 

No idea if it's any good, but it's a fraction of the price of the more well known brands...

The problem with any of this stuff is that you have no idea what it's made from. All it says is that it's mineral-based and non flammable. If it's got iron in it, like some black sands, shotblasting material and even aquarium gravel, then it's not something I want on my layout. If that stuff gets loose in a derailment it could play havoc with motors and DCC speakers. It wouldn't be any use in the hoppers either as they and the staithe use magnets to operate the doors.

 

Not that it matters now anyway. The end-tippers can use real coal because it won't get spread on the rails.

 

19 hours ago, GWR57xx said:

It’s a nice, simple engineering solution, but…

don’t you think you’ll quickly get fed up winding three revolutions up then three back down for each wagon? Did you say each train has 22 loaded wagons? How many trains a session? Seems like a lot of winding.

Wouldn’t something like a signal servo controller work? You could possibly drive the shaft directly off the servo shaft, or via a pushrod. The servo could be programmed to operate as slow as you want, and the signal bounce effect could be used at the end of the up stroke to rattle the last grains out. Then it would just be a single button press or flick of a switch for up and another for down for each wagon.

 

The 22 wagons are two trains that are loaded for the main run. There will be only 4 or 5  internal users running to and from the staithe, which isn't a lot of winding. I got the maths with the gearing wrong and also forgot that the tipper doesn't even do a single rotation. It only moves through 45 degrees, which is enough to completely empty a wagon, and so the manual input is only around a third of a revolution. I can probably get away with a lever and not a winding handle at all.

 

 

[Ruston]

Gearbox.

I could install it as is but working on the tipper house in situ will be a right PITA. I'll cut the shaft short and make a spring-loaded dog clutch, which will allow the shaft and operating handle to be installed in the baseboard yet allow the gearbox and tipper house to be removed until it's proven to work and is also finished cosmetically. That gearbox is better than fancy electronics.

 

Where would your fancy electronics get you if you fell down 'ole? Stuck down 'ole. In the FOG. In the middle of the NIGHT. With an OWL? It could happen.

[Ruston]

The first of the wagons for the tipper is under construction.

I was pleased to find that the Parkside PC69 is designed in such a way that the sides are full length and the door end fits between them instead of the end being full width and with chamfered edges, as on the opposite end. This meant all I had to do to get a complete door was to separate it from the headstock. The headstock is now fixed to the rest of the wagon and so next comes the er... "fun" part of trying to get the door to work.

[Ruston]

Not forgetting the tipper house itself. It's not quite finished and isn't fixed in place yet. It isn't based at all on the one that was at British Oak as that one was open-ended and constructed from wood. I suppose it's generic and based on various such buildings that I have seen in photographs. I didn't want one with an open end as this would mean modelling the complicated stuff inside and would also give stray coal the opportunity to go where I don't want it to go e.g. the canal. With an enclosed building it can't go anywhere that it shouldn't.

 

The railings need finish painting and weathering, before being permanently fixed in place.

 

The dog clutch that allows the building to be removed and refitted. Once it's all sorted the building will be glued down anyway.

 

 

[Ruston]

Tipper now fixed in place.

Coal chute added. Work is still to be done to enclose the gearbox and to generally bed the building into the terrain. There will be a ladder fitted to the wall, in front of the grounded van body.

 

Operating handle.

It only needs about a third of a turn and has stops built in, both ways. I need to get on with the Parkside wagon now.

[Sweet pea]

You have done a lovely job on the tipper house.👍

[Ruston]

The old Hornby 'Prime Pork' van, from page 6.

I didn't give it a corrugated iron roof but I did think the plastic roof looked too pristine for something that may have spent decades in the elements since it was in service and received works attention, so it's had new roof felt at some time since it was grounded. It looks rough deliberately. I filed off the moulded roof vents and cut a rectangle of tissue and dabbed at it with a paintbrush and MEKpak, until it become welded into the roof.

[Ruston]

Just minutes ago I slapped some shiny stuff onto the canal surface.

[Ruston]

I built the Parkside kit up and got the end door to work but I couldn't come up with a way of automating a catch, so it has a length of brass rod running under it. At one end it is bent up to form a stop to the door. At the other end the bend becomes a lever that can be operated using the same pole used for the 3-link couplings. The fixed end of the wagon doesn't go right into the building, so this can be operated when the wagon is on the tipper.

The hinges are a bit rough, but it was all a bit experimental and now that I know what I'm doing I can improve on that for the batch build.

 

These will all be painted in NCB internal use black. It seems a shame to get rid of the ready painted liveries but I found it impossible to obtain any more unpainted kits. Every shop in the country appears to be out of stock of PC69, so I had to go on ebay to find even these few.

Edited October 15, 2023 by Ruston

[03060]

1 hour ago, Ruston said:

I built the Parkside kit up and got the end door to work but I couldn't come up with a way of automating a catch, so it has a length of brass rod running under it. At one end it is bent up to form a stop to the door. At the other end the bend becomes a lever that can be operated using the same pole used for the 3-link couplings. The fixed end of the wagon doesn't go right into the building, so this can be operated when the wagon is on the tipper.

The hinges are a bit rough, but it was all a bit experimental and now that I know what I'm doing I can improve on that for the batch build.

 

These will all be painted in NCB internal use black. It seems a shame to get rid of the ready painted liveries but I found it impossible to obtain any more unpainted kits. Every shop in the country appears to be out of stock of PC69, so I had to go on ebay to find even these few.

 

Hello Dave,

 

I'm enjoying all of this wagon coal extraction process that's been researched and developed over the last few weeks.

 

I'll be very interested to see some photos of it all in action when you've finalised on your design as I feel that this way of getting coal out of wagons is probably more achievable (to me) than say a full motorised wagon tippler which I know can be done as I've operated one on Mike Edge's Cwmafon (?) layout and probably more of a likely prototype other than 2 men with shovels to have been employed at a smaller industrial type location that I'm hoping to build a small layout for ..... in my dreams !

 

Great progress, as ever.

Regards,

Ian.

Edited October 15, 2023 by 03060

[Ruston]

2 minutes ago, 03060 said:

 

Hello Dave,

 

I'm enjoying all of this wagon coal extraction process that's been researched and developed over the last few weeks.

 

I'll be very interested to see some photos of it all in action when you've finalised on your design as I feel that this way of getting coal out of wagons is probably more achievable (to me) than say a full motorised wagon tippler which I know can be done as I've operated one on Mike Edge's Cwmafon (?) layout and probably more of a likely prototype other than 2 men with shovels to have been employed at a smaller industrial type location that I'm hoping to build a small layout for ..... in my dreams !

 

Great progress, as ever.

Regards,

Ian.

Hi Ian,

 

I have built a tippler for a previous layout and I think it may have been someone on here that suggested one for Blacker Lane. I didn't go for it because it would be getting too far away from the British Oak basis and because the track being at 90 degrees to the canal, with the available space, doesn't lend itself for the placement of a tippler. If I didn't have these problems then a rotary tippler is what I would go for as you make the tippler and that's that. You don't need to faff around with altering the wagons that run on it and if you're going to build a mechanism for an end tipper then you may as well build it for a tippler.

 

But, as you say, a tippler may be too much for a small concern so end-tipping may be better suited. I was already stuck with the situation of the layout and had already set it all up for a staithe with hoppers but if I had a clean sheet and could build a tipper with no restrictions then I wouldn't build one like I have. There was a recent issue of Industrial Railway Record (249) that showed Waller hydraulic tippers where a ram raised between the rails and pushed the wagon end up by engaging with an axle - this is the sort I would build and instead of real hydraulic power I would use a screw thread and electric motor/gearbox. I think it would be far easier to build than what I have done.

[03060]

4 hours ago, Ruston said:

 There was a recent issue of Industrial Railway Record (249) that showed Waller hydraulic tippers where a ram raised between the rails and pushed the wagon end up by engaging with an axle - this is the sort I would build and instead of real hydraulic power I would use a screw thread and electric motor/gearbox. I think it would be far easier to build than what I have done.

 

That was the sort of thing that I was thinking of although I haven't seen the IRR issue I've mentally noted these either on here (RM Web) or more probably in a Bylines magazine. I take your point though regarding possibly less work overall by building a rotary tippler .... all food for thought. As usual I have most items already in stock for this and several other potential layouts I just need to stop working as much and build one or two of them !

 

Anyway thanks for the reply, I'll check my IRR collection again and maybe have a trip up to Ingrow if I haven't got No.249.

 

Regards,

Ian.

[tractionman]

On 11/10/2023 at 14:57, Kevin Johnson said:

You have done a lovely job on the tipper house.👍

 

the way the ground falls away in the foreground with the viaduct in the background looks fantastic, great modelling and realism.

[Ruston]

Here's how it looks at the moment.

[Ruston]

And looking in the opposite direction...

In reality, at British Oak, you'd have been looking across the canal at some fields and then across the river Calder, where you would see in the distance Horbury Junction (the place, not the railway junction itself), Charles Roberts wagon works and the sewage works. I would like to have had a photo backscene of all of that but things would look so different now, even if I could get up onto the viaduct and take a photo. Not that anyone can get on the viaduct these days what with all of the Safety Nazis fencing everything off. Instead, I've brought British Jeffrey Diamond further out from Wakefield and across the railway, river and canal. For those that don't know, BJD made coal cutters and other mining machinery. My mother used to work in the offices there.

 

There will be a chain link fence added and some trees to help hide the hole in the backscene before its finished.

[Ruston]

The wagon door being released by a lever on a shaft running under the wagon wasn't working too well. It worked but in practice was awkward to use and required a very steady hand so as not to derail the wagon. The catch sticking up at the end of the wagon didn't look good either, so I had a rethink and have now come up with a semi-automatic catch that is fitted to the non viewed side.

As the wagon tips, the length of wire that sticks out of the side of the lever hits a fixed catch inside the building and the lever stays in position whilst the rest of the wagon tips, thus releasing the door. I say that it's semi automatic because the lever drops before the door closes and so must be lifted manually to once again hold the door closed. There is a short piece of iron wire glued to the lever, so it can be lifted by the magnet on the uncoupling pole. Lifting the lever allows the door to close fully and the magnet is pulled away to allow the lever to fall and lock the door.

 

All that can be seen of the lever from the operating side is the very end that locks over the wire that is fitted in the side of the door.

[Ruston]

[Ruston]

I was thinking that those wagons in the above photo just needed numbers and lettering to complete, after I had got the door release catches fitted and working to all five. And then I did a test run with them loaded with coal.

 

I knew that they weren't as free-running as a RTR mineral wagon but loading them with coal and attempting to propel them from that area where the screens are yet to be built to the staithe showed that some of the smaller engines literally could not move the train on the curves and gradients. I'll have to buy some Bachmann wagons and use the doors from the kit-built ones because I simply cannot get the kit-built ones to run freely enough. I'm getting cheesed off with this staithe and its wagons now.

[cctransuk]

3 hours ago, Ruston said:

I was thinking that those wagons in the above photo just needed numbers and lettering to complete, after I had got the door release catches fitted and working to all five. And then I did a test run with them loaded with coal.

 

I knew that they weren't as free-running as a RTR mineral wagon but loading them with coal and attempting to propel them from that area where the screens are yet to be built to the staithe showed that some of the smaller engines literally could not move the train on the curves and gradients. I'll have to buy some Bachmann wagons and use the doors from the kit-built ones because I simply cannot get the kit-built ones to run freely enough. I'm getting cheesed off with this staithe and its wagons now.

 

I'm assuming pinpoint bearings and metal wheelsets?

 

I can't think why such models shouldn't roll away on anything other than billiard-table baseboards.

 

Are the brakeshoes well clear of the wheel treads/ flanges?

 

CJI.

[Ruston]

20 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

I'm assuming pinpoint bearings and metal wheelsets?

 

I can't think why such models shouldn't roll away on anything other than billiard-table baseboards.

 

Are the brakeshoes well clear of the wheel treads/ flanges?

 

CJI.

Yes and yes. I think it's a result of putting them together using MEK. They were alright when built but the axleguards seem to be turning inward and putting pressure on the axle ends. I've bent them outward with extreme violence  and now they are all running freely but for long is anyone's guess. I should have used ordinary polystyrene cement to fit the axleguards.

Edited October 25, 2023 by Ruston

[cctransuk]

9 minutes ago, Ruston said:

Yes and yes. I think it's a result of putting them together using MEK. They were alright when built but the axleguards seem to be turning inward and putting pressure on the axle ends. I've bent them outward with extreme violence  and now they are all running freely but for long is anyone's guess. I should have used ordinary polystyrene cement to fit the axleguards.

 

I have found that spreading the axleguards with a temporary prop - a couple of millimetres longer than the pinpoint axle - whilst the Mekpak dries, will counteract the 'spring inwards' tendency.

 

When you get it right, the wheels / axles are a perfect fit.

 

CJI.

[Ruston]

They are still running freely and the axleguards haven't turned in - yet. Although 5 is the maximum number of wagons that can be accommodated in the siding next to the staithe I am thinking of having some more internal user wagons. They may or may not have working end doors but the idea behind running them is that there is a landsale yard or coal stocking area off-scene. They will just run to and from the FY, as with all the main line trains. There was no separate landsale yard at British Oak, so this is a bit of modeller's licence being used as an excuse to run some different wagons.

 

Meanwhile...

I think this Peckett looks right at home here, so it will be transferred from the Charlie Strong scrapyard fleet. I would like to put some PEPPER lettering on the tank but my usual printer of decals can no longer print them.

Edited October 27, 2023 by Ruston

[Ruston]

Back on page 6 I showed some pictures of the car hoarder's house, with a laser-cut wooden fence kit atop the retaining wall. I decided that it looked far too neat, orderly and probably expensive to construct. I mean why would you spend good money on a fancy fence when you could buy more knackered motors with the cash instead?

 

The new idea is to have the fence made of old house doors and corrugated iron panels. I was going to buy a pack or two of Wills doors and window frames but my local model shop is out of stock, so I have made my own.

 

They'll look alright with a bit of paint slapped on.

[doilum]

2 hours ago, Ruston said:

Back on page 6 I showed some pictures of the car hoarder's house, with a laser-cut wooden fence kit atop the retaining wall. I decided that it looked far too neat, orderly and probably expensive to construct. I mean why would you spend good money on a fancy fence when you could buy more knackered motors with the cash instead?

 

The new idea is to have the fence made of old house doors and corrugated iron panels. I was going to buy a pack or two of Wills doors and window frames but my local model shop is out of stock, so I have made my own.

 

They'll look alright with a bit of paint slapped on.

I took the same approach for the allotment on Houghton Street. My only regret dwas not using black plastikard for the core of the door. Despite several layers from the rattle can they always looked translucent. They are period perfect.