The J67/68/69 ‘Buckjumper’, By Accurascale

[Wickham Green too]

19 minutes ago, Jol Wilkinson said:

... increasingly people don't want to actually make the models they desire.

Alternately, people are reluctant to commit to actually building the the kits in theirs stash when the RTR market might well save them the bother ........... AND permit them the time to get on with something that isn't likely to appear*.

 

* though, chances are, that'll come along first !

[Jol Wilkinson]

5 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

Alternately, people are reluctant to commit to actually building the the kits in theirs stash when the RTR market might well save them the bother ........... AND permit them the time to get on with something that isn't likely to appear*.

 

* though, chances are, that'll come along first !

 

 

Isn't that rather contradictory? How do you know what isn't likely to appear, so how do choose what not to build?

 

There are, for example, getting on for ninety J prefix locos in the LNER Encyclopedia Locomotives listing. How may are available in RTR form compared to available kits and how long, at the current rate of new model introductions will it be before all the kit versions are duplicated.

 

Perhaps the realistic approach is to sit, wait and hope that what you want will be produced, but don't be expect that you will get everything you desire, or even a significant proportion of it. Or choose to simply base your modelling around whatever the manufacturers opt to produce.

 

[Wickham Green too]

1 hour ago, Jol Wilkinson said:

Isn't that rather contradictory? How do you know what isn't likely to appear, so how do choose what not to build?

Of course it's contradictory in the absence of a reliable crystal ball ........... I just know that I have half a dozen unfinished loco kits - and, I think, seven un-started - which have been or soon will be duplicated by RTR ( not to mention rolling stock ). The number of not-yet-duplicated is rather less than that, though one has already been suggested in this thread, and I suspect three of the others might pop up to follow two of their brethren in due course. 

[Synch]

2 hours ago, Jol Wilkinson said:

How much would you be willing to pay? There are two 4mm kits on the market and several very good professional builders and painters who would undertake such a commission.

 

Likewise J68 and J69 kits have been available for decades, but it seems that increasingly people don't want to actually make the models they desire.

 

I now have to derail this thread.

 

I understand people repeatedly saying "Why not just build a kit", but isn't it entirely possible that people will enjoy their model railway in different ways?  That perhaps some folks don't want to spend a 3 figure sum on something that they may cock up the first time around instead of simply just wanting to enjoy their train set?

Everyone gets something different out of the hobby, I build wagons from kits and it's what I enjoy, but I don't think I'd ever be all that inclined to build a loco kit as it's beyond my skill level, something that I could easily get wrong and have all that money go right down the drain; this is something that can put a lot of people off, and to have this kind of attitude towards people who perhaps have a set budget for their hobby just boggles my mind at times, I don't find it fair or tactful to quite a number of folks posting on here.

I get so tired of seeing this sort of attitude being flaunted around, don't get snippy with people who don't have the money and time to spend on a kit that they can get wrong, if people want to learn those specific aspects they will do so without such commentary, but otherwise leave your grievances at the door.

[Islesy]

7 hours ago, Synch said:

 

I understand people repeatedly saying "Why not just build a kit", but isn't it entirely possible that people will enjoy their model railway in different ways?  That perhaps some folks don't want to spend a 3 figure sum on something that they may cock up the first time around instead of simply just wanting to enjoy their train set?

I agree with all your sentiments @Synch and it very much mirrors my own approach to railway modelling.

So folks, can we draw a line under this latest elitist ‘Kit vs RTR’ thread drift please, and concentrate on the subject, namely the Buckjumpers?

[NHY 581]

10 hours ago, Jol Wilkinson said:

How much would you be willing to pay? There are two 4mm kits on the market and several very good professional builders and painters who would undertake such a commission.

 

Likewise J68 and J69 kits have been available for decades, but it seems that increasingly people don't want to actually make the models they desire.

 

A couple of points there Jol. 

I'm relatively new to East Anglian modelling and my interest is quite focused. Weedy, decrepit backwaters basically. 

I wanted a J67/68/69 for quite a while and looked at the kits and also the 3D body kit. I dismissed the later as too crude as was the need to use a chassis that was dubious when new. 

Kits. Time. Time to research. Time to build. In addition, I know I would not end up with something built to a standard that I'd be happy with and possibly not finish. Given the investment, both financially and chronologically,  neither outcome is acceptable.  

However, despite knowing this, I almost  bought a kit for a Buckjumper last year. 

 

9 hours ago, Jol Wilkinson said:

Or choose to simply base your modelling around whatever the manufacturers opt to produce.

 

 

I'm happy with that. Quite a few of my layouts have been built to 'house' specific rtr locos. 

 

 

7 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

Of course it's contradictory in the absence of a reliable crystal ball ........... I just know that I have half a dozen unfinished loco kits - and, I think, seven un-started - which have been or soon will be duplicated by RTR ( not to mention rolling stock ). The number of not-yet-duplicated is rather less than that, though one has already been suggested in this thread, and I suspect three of the others might pop up to follow two of their brethren in due course. 

 

There is the issue in a nutshell. I like to start and finish something before moving on as I know how hard I find it to restart a stalled project......so in my case, this is best avoided....And when I'm about to forget this, I open the drawer to see the started but not finished Comet chassis for a Bachmann Jinty to remind me. 

 

7 hours ago, Synch said:

 

I now have to derail this thread.

 

I understand people repeatedly saying "Why not just build a kit", but isn't it entirely possible that people will enjoy their model railway in different ways?  That perhaps some folks don't want to spend a 3 figure sum on something that they may cock up the first time around instead of simply just wanting to enjoy their train set?

Everyone gets something different out of the hobby, I build wagons from kits and it's what I enjoy, but I don't think I'd ever be all that inclined to build a loco kit as it's beyond my skill level, something that I could easily get wrong and have all that money go right down the drain; this is something that can put a lot of people off, and to have this kind of attitude towards people who perhaps have a set budget for their hobby just boggles my mind at times, I don't find it fair or tactful to quite a number of folks posting on here.

I get so tired of seeing this sort of attitude being flaunted around, don't get snippy with people who don't have the money and time to spend on a kit that they can get wrong, if people want to learn those specific aspects they will do so without such commentary, but otherwise leave your grievances at the door.

 

 

And finally.........yes. My sentiments exactly. 

 

For those who wish to build kits, fine. Carry on but respect those who don't want to follow that route. We know our own minds. 

 

AS are at the fore front of creating highly accurate, detailed scale models. The clues in the name for goodness sake ! 

Here, for less than the cost of a kit, wheels, gears, motor and other gubbins is an accurate ( that word again) model of my chosen loco.....and they'll paint it for me as well. Bargain. No stress. No frustration. 

It does look like I'll have to wait for them to produce a variant applicable to my BR bucolic  backwater needs but I'm prepared to wait. I'll make do with the GER version for now ! 

 

Am I glad I didn't give in and buy that kit ? 

 

Not 'arf ! 

 

 

Rob. 

Edited March 24, 2023 by NHY 581

[NHY 581]

1 minute ago, Islesy said:

I agree with all your sentiments @Synch and it very much mirrors my own approach to railway modelling.

So folks, can we draw a line under this latest elitist ‘Kit vs RTR’ thread drift please, and concentrate on the subject, namely the Buckjumpers?

 

 

Sorry, Islesy. Our posts crossed. Happy to delete my ramble. 

 

Rob

Edited March 24, 2023 by NHY 581

[Islesy]

1 minute ago, NHY 581 said:

 

 

Sorry, Islesy. Our posts crossed. Happy to delete my ramble. 

 

Rob

It’s no problem Rob, leave it in place, a coincidence in timing as you say!

 

I have to tread a fine line here, between my own views, and that of being a representative of Accurascale, but I really do not like any form of elitism, especially when it comes to hobbies and forums.

Railway modelling is a broad church, split across Collectors, Enthusiasts and Modellers, and there are folk involved at every level, in each sphere.

 

So please, let’s just play nice, accept each other’s views and skill levels, and try to stick to the subject in any given thread.

 

Cheers all,

Paul

[Jol Wilkinson]

Having clearly upset some people, I shall depart this thread with one request.

 

Do not define kit builders as elitist. It is often the only way to create the models you want and is also a source of great satisfaction. I know many people whose hobby is creating a layout or model that wouldn't be possible using RTR products, none are elitist or consider themselves special in any way.

[Bernard Lamb]

55 minutes ago, Islesy said:

It’s no problem Rob, leave it in place, a coincidence in timing as you say!

 

I have to tread a fine line here, between my own views, and that of being a representative of Accurascale, but I really do not like any form of elitism, especially when it comes to hobbies and forums.

Railway modelling is a broad church, split across Collectors, Enthusiasts and Modellers, and there are folk involved at every level, in each sphere.

 

So please, let’s just play nice, accept each other’s views and skill levels, and try to stick to the subject in any given thread.

 

Cheers all,

Paul

We can list on your CV comedian and satirist as well.😀

A representative of the company who not only make the best UK outline model trains available but who also have the best pricing structure and ordering system, not to mention the best PR team in the business. Nearly forgot. the best screw couplings available as a spare part.  Do not like elitism? You and your colleagues certainly demonstrate it. But then when you are te best their is no need to shout about it.

Keep up the good work. I hope to see a suitable version for my needs in the next batch. The blue un would almost  do if I repainted it but I feel very reluctant to do that.

Bernard

[Legend]

On 22/03/2023 at 22:27, jools1959 said:

Can I ask, how far north in Scotland did they roam?

 

Aberdeen as previously noted . However for those a little further south , Thomas Middlemass in his excellent book "Mainly Scottish Steam" set in the 20s and 30s LNER days noted that Polmont (just east of Falkirk) had a pair allocated . Nos 7347 and 7368 . He states you could hardly visit Falkirk Grahamston Station  without seeing one pottering about  or heading to Springfield goods . So you could have an LNER one alongside a J36 !   He says they were always nicely maintained .  Unfortunately I don't think I can stretch that to running the GER Blue one I fancy 

Edited March 24, 2023 by Legend

[Accurascale Fran]

1 hour ago, Jol Wilkinson said:

Having clearly upset some people, I shall depart this thread with one request.

 

Do not define kit builders as elitist. It is often the only way to create the models you want and is also a source of great satisfaction. I know many people whose hobby is creating a layout or model that wouldn't be possible using RTR products, none are elitist or consider themselves special in any way.

 

Hi Jol,

 

I don't think all kit builders are being dismissed as "elitist", and we certainly have kitbuilders among our ranks at Accurascale (Isley included, loves a wagon kit as well as the aero variety!) The point is people who wish to buy an RTR model shouldn't be run down for their choice. As we see on the threads here, many will personalise theirs when they arrive, with weathering, renumbering, detailing etc. which will demonstrate their excellent skills as modellers. They perhaps have just decided that the kitbuilding aspect is not for them for a multitude of reasons, none of which are right or wrong, just personal choice.

 

Cheers!

 

Fran 

[NHY 581]

As I said earlier, I'm quite happy to wait for another batch to be announced which will almost certainly include a nice, early crest, East Anglian bucolic branchline applicable example...........or two....................

 

And I can then build a suitably weedy layout about which they can frolic and gamble

 

I have the station building ready to go thereon. 

 

 

 

Rob

 

[BMacdermott]

Well said Paul & Fran!

 

We in The 00 Poll Team regularly had 'kit comments'...so much so that, for 2022, I had to run the request as repeated below. Thankfully, the request was accepted and we heard nothing in that respect.

 

Brian

 

Extract from The 00 Wishlist Poll 2022 Introduction

 

Please avoid comments such as: Why are you listing Loco X when there is a perfectly good kit available. We – as a RTR community – don’t invade kit threads with exhortations to ‘go RTR’, so please don’t invade us!

[Izzy]

I have worked in P4 on and off since the S4 society first arrived, so late ‘70’s. My latest P4 plank only uses converted RTR locos with their original chassis - I don’t see the point in buying a loco and then throwing much of it away. This is both diesel and steam. As it is exGE I’d love a J67/J69 to go with the J15 & N7. This is why I hope these will be ‘convertable’, even if this means machining the wheels.

 

Could I make a kit one. Of course. Would it be as good. Probably. But better? Doubtful. It’s each to their own surely. 
 

Bob

[RAYTHEROCK]

Why do we have to have these arguments kit vs rtr? Can't we just be very grateful that Accurascale are bringing out the models?  I shall change my prayers to an E4.........

[Islesy]

Right, back to matters Buckjumper related 😉

68578 on the Kelvedon and Tollesbury, showing that the front rod was restored to motive power on the line in BR era...

[Keith Turbutt]

11 hours ago, Islesy said:

Right, back to matters Buckjumper 

 

Interesting detail I hadn't noticed before.

The bunker first photo shows the raised top edge of the side tank, around the condensing chamber, to be a separate piece and not part of the rest of the tank side.

The other photo shows quite a large patch where the tank has been repaired.

[Crouchja32]

12 minutes ago, Keith Turbutt said:

 

Interesting detail I hadn't noticed before.

The bunker first photo shows the raised top edge of the side tank, around the condensing chamber, to be a separate piece and not part of the rest of the tank side.

The other photo shows quite a large patch where the tank has been repaired.

That and the Bufferbeam still retains the LNER Font No. and Number. It's a bit hard to spot due to how dirty it is. 

[black and decker boy]

Well, as a EM, P4 and 00 modeller, I can  confess to being a crude builder so finescale loco chassis evade my skill set.

 

I can do wagons,  I can make RTR look fantastic, I can do scenery but brass loco chassis - no.

 

Id never therefore buy a J69 kit. It’s quite niche for our layout anyway but a high quality, great value RTR offering brings it into play and 68535 is perfect for our time & location.

[adriank]

18 hours ago, Accurascale Fran said:

 

As we see on the threads here, many will personalise theirs when they arrive, with weathering, renumbering, detailing etc.

 

And of course, converting to P4 and EM. Have you made provision for this Fran?

 

Adrian

[DL 36]

21 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

 

It does look like I'll have to wait for them to produce a variant applicable to my BR bucolic  backwater needs but I'm prepared to wait. I'll make do with the GER version for now ! 

 

 

The branch lines of East Anglia in the 1950s offer some great modelling opportunities and the J69 fills the biggest gap in the RTR line up for this region. A couple of J69s, a couple of J15s, 2-3 Gresley and/or Thompson non vestibule coaches and some goods vehicles. A grounded coach body for a station building or some laser cut kits from the likes of Intentio or Laser cut model railways. 

Plenty of opportunities for a junction station and backwater branch line as well. I really like the idea of Brittania's, B1s and B17s rushing by while a J69 or J15 trundles along with a branch line train like this one on the Brightlingsea branch.

[Flying Pig]

5 hours ago, DL 36 said:

like this one on the Brightlingsea branch.

 

Hmm - train and track available rtr too...

[Izzy]

22 hours ago, Islesy said:

Right, back to matters Buckjumper related 😉

68578 on the Kelvedon and Tollesbury, showing that the front rod was restored to motive power on the line in BR era...

I think I’m correct in saying that the practice of removing the front rods - to reduce flange wear, was discontinued after the grouping. 
 

My parents were fond of often quoting that in the early ‘50’s, when I was aged around 2-3 and my father was stopped at the Feering crossing in his ‘sit-up-and-beg’ Ford Popular - then on the ‘main’ A12 - I would stand up on the front seat and shout ‘it’s an oosh-oosh’ as the Tollesbury flyer went through. That we were also living at the time in a grounded coach body on the coast while a bungalow was built for my parents probably accounts for my lifelong interest in railways, and especially modelling them…..  
 

So, roll on a J67/69 I can convert to P4. Well, here’s hoping anyway.

 

Bob

 

[Pint of Adnams]

On 24/03/2023 at 07:01, Islesy said:

I agree with all your sentiments @Synch and it very much mirrors my own approach to railway modelling.

So folks, can we draw a line under this latest elitist ‘Kit vs RTR’ thread drift please, and concentrate on the subject, namely the Buckjumpers?

Ah, if only that were so for those who (also) model in 7mm scale... Big Jim's (Jim McGeown - Connoisseur) Buckjumper kits have been off the market for decades.