ESP Ψ Aegis 5 Amp Wireless System for PowerCab

[Tallpaul69]

46 minutes ago, melmerby said:

We are  an anti-iOS household. 😁

 

There's nothing wrong with that in my book!. Each to their own, I say? 

[Tallpaul69]

40 minutes ago, jaym481 said:

If you like your NCE handset you can connect it to a Z21 through the sniffer input.

True, I just need to use the correct cable!

[WIMorrison]

1 hour ago, jaym481 said:

If you like your NCE handset you can connect it to a Z21 through the sniffer input.

 

But remember that this is a one way process - the Z21 will see that you have done something with your NCE set, but the NCE will not be aware of anything being undertaken by the Z21, any throttles, or control systems attached to the Z21.

Edited October 15, 2023 by WIMorrison
grammar

[Tallpaul69]

2 minutes ago, WIMorrison said:

 

But remember that this is a one way process - the Z21 will see that you have done something with your NCE set, but the NCE will not be aware of anything that any controls undertaken by the Z21, any handsets, or any control systems attached to the Z21.

True, but as the Z21 will only be controlling locos, this should be ok?

Points, signals and uncouplers will be independent of the Z21 through a conventional Mimic diagram.

 

Or am I missing something?

Cheers

Paul 

[jaym481]

On 15/10/2023 at 12:16, WIMorrison said:

 

But remember that this is a one way process - the Z21 will see that you have done something with your NCE set, but the NCE will not be aware of anything being undertaken by the Z21, any throttles, or control systems attached to the Z21.

If just using it for controlling a single locomotive it doesn't really matter if it can't receive any Z21 information back. It saves splashing out on a Maus if all he wants is a thumbwheel-type of throttle control. Points etc can be controlled through the Z21 diagram on a tablet.

[jamesed]

On 15/10/2023 at 17:23, Tallpaul69 said:

True, but as the Z21 will only be controlling locos, this should be ok?

Points, signals and uncouplers will be independent of the Z21 through a conventional Mimic diagram.

 

Or am I missing something?

Cheers

Paul 

 

If you are using a Z21 then the mimic screen which comes as part of the app is perfect for controlling points and other accessories. No need to build a separate mimic panel. That's one of the big plus reasons to have a Z21.  Just control it all on a tablet. There's a good argument to having an extra tablet which you use just for this. 

[WIMorrison]

2 minutes ago, jamesed said:

 

If you are using a Z21 then the mimic screen which comes as part of the app is perfect for controlling points and other accessories. No need to build a separate mimic panel. That's one of the big plus reasons to have a Z21.  Just control it all on a tablet. There's a good argument to having an extra tablet which you use just for this. 

 

This is correct, plus if you do go for automation as you suggest in another thread then by using a Z21 (or iTrain) controlled, soft mimic screen then everything will be in sync all the time ;)

[dj_efk]

Hi all,

 

First post - I am building a 10 x 6 layout for my sons (and me!). I'm considering the DCC Concepts Aegis system to give them wireless capability of control, BUT like many of you here I am very conscious that their NCE Powercab is pretty clunky - so I don't want to invest half a "bag of sand" on a piece of tech that may well limit their enjoyment.

 

To the OP @Tallpaul69 - did you have any further conclusions as to what system you might go for? I'm wondering if I should sell the PowerCab and invest in something else, I would ideally like both a physical knob to turn and to not have multiple presses of buttons to access some loco sounds / features like the NCE setup imposes. The thumbwheel on it is a nice feature that just about satisfies the former want but the latter is a pain.

 

Reading what has been written so far, I do like the ESU system very much now that I've seen THIS VIDEO - Anyone have an update on availability in the UK?

Edited November 17, 2023 by dj_efk

[Ron Ron Ron]

A new video promoting the Aegis system.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

[Nigelcliffe]

1 hour ago, dj_efk said:

Hi all,

 

First post - I am building a 10 x 6 layout for my sons (and me!). I'm considering the DCC Concepts Aegis system to give them wireless capability of control, BUT like many of you here I am very conscious that their NCE Powercab is pretty clunky - so I don't want to invest half a "bag of sand" on a piece of tech that may well limit their enjoyment.

.....

 

"Sons"  - what would they choose to use ?   A smart phone ?    If so, what about PowerCab (you already own) and the WiFiTrax unit ? (latter is an interface to smartphone Apps, which are then alternative throttles).   If using Android phones and the Engine Driver App, then the volume keys act as speed up/down, as well as touch screen.  

 

The ESU Cab Control you mentioned might be OK, but it's going to date very rapidly as it is, essentially, a very old Android Phone with a rather well engineered knob added.   But, a few years time and it will be an extremely ancient Android phone....     You can get close to it with any Android Phone, the free "Engine Driver" App, a "USB OTG" cable, and a £20 USB volume control knob from Amazon/Ebay.  Result = physical knob, plus touch screen,  just lacking a common case.    

 

 

[Tallpaul69]

3 hours ago, dj_efk said:

Hi all,

 

First post - I am building a 10 x 6 layout for my sons (and me!). I'm considering the DCC Concepts Aegis system to give them wireless capability of control, BUT like many of you here I am very conscious that their NCE Powercab is pretty clunky - so I don't want to invest half a "bag of sand" on a piece of tech that may well limit their enjoyment.

 

To the OP @Tallpaul69 - did you have any further conclusions as to what system you might go for? I'm wondering if I should sell the PowerCab and invest in something else, I would ideally like both a physical knob to turn and to not have multiple presses of buttons to access some loco sounds / features like the NCE setup imposes. The thumbwheel on it is a nice feature that just about satisfies the former want but the latter is a pain.

 

Reading what has been written so far, I do like the ESU system very much now that I've seen THIS VIDEO - Anyone have an update on availability in the UK?

Best of luck with your endeavours!

 

My current thinking is in the direction of Roco and the  black Z21 (not the white z21!).

Be careful, you really need the Z21(coloured Black) for its features and your layout's future. Purchase of a z21 would  IMHO be short sighted.

Unless finance is tight, you could keep the Powercab for a separate testing/setting up track.

Cheers

Paul

 

[Nigelcliffe]

12 minutes ago, Tallpaul69 said:

Best of luck with your endeavours!

 

My current thinking is in the direction of Roco and the  black Z21 (not the white z21!).

Be careful, you really need the Z21(coloured Black) for its features and your layout's future. Purchase of a z21 would  IMHO be short sighted.

Unless finance is tight, you could keep the Powercab for a separate testing/setting up track.

Cheers

Paul

 

 

I would agree with looking seriously at the Z21, if budget goes that far.  Has option of "conventional" Roco WiFiMaus handsets (with knob), or smartphone/tablet apps (and several other options as well).   

 

If someone really wanted, they could use the PowerCab with the Z21, using the "sniffer" port into the Z21 to accept commands from the PowerCab.  It would work (its what the "sniffer" connection is for), but the PowerCab wouldn't be fully integrated with the Z21's setup (PowerCab doesn't get any information back from the Z21).   

 

The WiFiTrax option I suggested is a lot cheaper than a Z21.  And in this case, price does equate to features, the Z21 can do much more.  But, its possible that a PowerCab plus WiFiTrax will do all that is needed, and if "all that is needed" is achieved, then it's cheaper.

 

 

- Nigel

 

 

[young37215]

6 hours ago, Nigelcliffe said:

 

"Sons"  - what would they choose to use ?   A smart phone ?    If so, what about PowerCab (you already own) and the WiFiTrax unit ? (latter is an interface to smartphone Apps, which are then alternative throttles).   If using Android phones and the Engine Driver App, then the volume keys act as speed up/down, as well as touch screen.  

 

The ESU Cab Control you mentioned might be OK, but it's going to date very rapidly as it is, essentially, a very old Android Phone with a rather well engineered knob added.   But, a few years time and it will be an extremely ancient Android phone....     You can get close to it with any Android Phone, the free "Engine Driver" App, a "USB OTG" cable, and a £20 USB volume control knob from Amazon/Ebay.  Result = physical knob, plus touch screen,  just lacking a common case.    

 

 

 

As an owner of CC I am quite comfortable with the fact that it will date over time, all tech does, because it does what I want. I went through quite an extensive process to decide what controller best met my requirements and am glad that I did. My advice to anyone looking for a new controller is do the same, be clear on what it is you are after. 

 

Importing from the USA was easy, I bought mine from Iron Planet Hobbies where DHL managed to lose the first package that was sent. The chap at Iron Planet sent a second unit within a few days which turned up in the UK less than 48 hours after despatch. All in all it was less than 10 days from purchase to getting my hands on CC. There are several sellers in the USA if you Google 'ESU Cab Control', all seem to be around the same USD price. Bare in mind that duty is payable on any import, this works out at around 20% of the purchase price and will be collected by the courier company before they deliver. 

 

https://www.ironplanethobbies.com/product/esu-50310-cabcontrol-dcc-command-staion-wifi-throttle-7a-power-supply/

 

[dj_efk]

It sounds like there is no easy answer that I can point to and say "aha - that fits my needs". 

 

The Aegis is expensive and relies on the NCE, which is not that user friendly for kids - but does allow them to be mobile around the layout. I also already have the NCE but the Aegis adds the cost of a whole another control system so no real cost-advantage to going this route for me.

 

The black Z21 relies on a smart phone, which to me is not ideal (I do prefer a physical control knob).

 

The ESU system looks great but if not available as a UK version I'm reluctant - it looks like it's been 6 or 7 years in the running so it rather looks like it's never coming.

 

 

 

All of these are an investment of £500 or so, give or take - I can understand why so many go with the Hornby HM7000: Perhaps I should just either sell the Powercab and go with that or else buy the HM7040 Legacy Dongle must be plugged into the RJ12 socket of the Powercab panel and be done with it - Then the ability to move around the layout is then covered via a smart phone, whereas the thumbwheel can be retained via the Powercab's throttle.

 

Has anyone done this who could share their experiences?

Edited January 30 by dj_efk

[WIMorrison]

22 minutes ago, dj_efk said:

The black Z21 relies on a smart phone, which to me is not ideal (I do prefer a physical control knob).

 

The Z21 (or z21) do not rely on smart phones in any way. There are dozens or wired, or wireless controllers that it can be used with a Z21 and they can have glass screens or traditional control knobs - entirely depends on what you want to use.

[melmerby]

33 minutes ago, dj_efk said:

The black Z21 relies on a smart phone, which to me is not ideal (I do prefer a physical control knob).

It is an option, not a necessity

I use a Roco Wireless Maus, you can also use various other plug in handsets as Iain has mentioned

[jamesed]

In reply to @dj_efk . . .

 

As the previous two posts have pointed out, there are plenty of options for controlling a Z21 with a handset that has a knob. The wireless Maus is the obvious option but not the only one. However, you mentioned in your first post that you are building your layout for you and your children; I suggest that they would be more than pleased to operate a train using a phone app. That technology seems to be second nature to anyone aged 8 up.  Who knows you might find, in due course, that you come to like it too.  When I bought my Z21 system I bought it as a package with a wifi Maus supplied too. I can honestly say that my Mause hasn't been used for the last 18 months. I use a combination of 10" tablets and phones and don't yearn for anything else. The tablets are very useful but for mobility I can control a single train very easily one handed with a phone. If you have, like most of us do, old phones lying around then simply do a factory reset, connect to your home wifi and download the Z21 app. For your children you only need to load into the app the trains that you want to allow them to drive. They won't be able to do anything else with the correct settings.

 

I suggest you download the app (free) and play with it. It works without being connected to a Z21, except for the programming screens, so you can see what it's all about. 

 

If you really want something with a knob, and cost isn't the driving force, then have a look at the LoDi-Con which is a great and fully up to date bit of kit. It works with a Z21 too. 

Edited January 30 by jamesed

[Nigelcliffe]

4 hours ago, dj_efk said:

The black Z21 relies on a smart phone, which to me is not ideal (I do prefer a physical control knob).

 

As others have said, you can have a conventional handset.   From the Roco Z21 product pages, the Z21 supports: 

 

Roco Maus (numerous types, including the old basic LokMaus devices), 
Lenz LH30/LH100 (and I'd expect LH101), 
Digitrax DT402, DT300, UT4 (and I expect DT500, DT600, UT6), 
Uhlenbrock Daisy II and Fred (and the Piko badged DaisyII version),     
And a few others...   

 

You should be able to find an acceptable handset in that lot. 

 

 

[4firstimes]

With the ESP Aegis 5 amp wireless system for use with NCE powercab now commercially available, I am really interested in finding the views of users. Various posts have commented on the cost of the system, as a “fan” of the DCC concepts style there is no doubt the layout and the ability to fit to one of your baseboards does make it cosmeticially appealing for hands free operation . On both of my layouts which have appeared at exhibitions I have used the Wfi Trax module, the later module allows a direct connection with The NCE PCP without requiring the need for lead and socket, simple replacement of the NCE pcp with the WiFitrax module. The WiFi Trax module wfd-30/31 sourced for under £100 and using Wifithrottle or Enginedriver certainly makes a cheap option for WiFi control and mobility for controlling the layout. With numerous old IPhones available, they have served as a well addition to operating the layout and user friendly for operators. Leaving the powercab handset in the holder on the layout and roaming with a iPad mini or iPhone certainly provides the opportunity for handsfee operation and not necessarily from the rear of the layout. On my layouts I use the DCC power alpha 5 amps which is similar to the Aegis power rated system. Inclusion a WiFi controlled wireless control for approx £100 compared with the ESP Aegis I am interested in fellow modellers views . Using the ESP system for wireless control panels works well with the WifiTrax set up also as I use this for an LED schematic for block occupancy and point /signal states.

[amdaley]

On 17/11/2023 at 14:01, Tallpaul69 said:

Best of luck with your endeavours!

 

My current thinking is in the direction of Roco and the  black Z21 (not the white z21!).

Be careful, you really need the Z21(coloured Black) for its features and your layout's future. Purchase of a z21 would  IMHO be short sighted.

Unless finance is tight, you could keep the Powercab for a separate testing/setting up track.

Cheers

Paul

 

I was reading through this thread today & I was wondering did you ever get sorted with a system ?

Tony.

[Tallpaul69]

1 hour ago, amdaley said:

I was reading through this thread today & I was wondering did you ever get sorted with a system ?

Tony.

Hi Tony, for various reasons, mainly outside the railway, that I won't bore you with, this problem has been parked for some time while other matters are resolved. I hope to get back to railway matters after Easter.

Cheers

Paul