RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted December 18, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 18, 2012 I wouldn't hold my breath for 'in the next few days' Next month would be the more likely. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Lamb Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 I wouldn't hold my breath for 'in the next few days' Next month would be the more likely. Oh yee of little faith. According to Rails of Sheffield it is due in tomorrow. Late crest so it is a B17/6 with the Thompson boiler. Bernard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted December 18, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 18, 2012 Yes,Bernard,I've just picked up on that,thanks.Faith in 'delivery dates' has been well-tested. Hattons have mine 'on order' Now,to test the faith even further----will I see it before the Great End Of Year Shutdown ? Watch this space....... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium great northern Posted December 18, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 18, 2012 The class is not too complicated actually. B17/1/2/3 were the original "Sandringhams" with the GE tender and Dia 100 boiler(four washout plugs). Only difference between the three parts was in the springs, which matters little on the model. B17/4 was for the "footballers" with the group standard 4200 gallon tender, but again with dia 100 boiler. B17/5 was the two sreamlined engines 2859/70, which became normal B17's post war, and B17/6 covered any engine which was given the Dia 100A boiler (five washout plugs). Conversions to Dia 100A were spread between Jan 1948 right up to Nov/Dec 1957, those being 1637 and 1631, the two Hornby are doing, and three went to their graves still with Dia 100 boilers, 1625/60/67. Ten were converted to Class B2 post war, and became a totally different animal altogether.The small tenders were always with the Sandringhams, except 2847/61647 which exchanged tenders with 2858/61658. All of the 2848-72 series, those named after football clubs, always had group standard tenders, except for 2830/61630 Tottenham Hotspur, which had the small GE type. Livery was always apple green pre war, degenerating to unlined black during the war and for most post war until the advent of BR green. Again there were exceptions, in that a few which were overhauled at Darlington between late '48 and around May '49 got apple green again, with British Railways in full on the tenders. The list of those given in Yeadon's Register by the way is dodgy. it does not include 61648, but there is a photograph of that engine (Arsenal) within the volume, clearly in apple green! In summary, Hornby's Thorpe Hall, and the 2013 release Serlby Hall are Sandringhams with original boilers, and correct until their final overhauls in late 1957. Grimsby Town and the 2013 release Barnsley are B17/6's with group standard tenders, correct for almost all the Footballers at some time during their post war lives, save for 61630. Hope that helps. If anyone is thinking of changing identity to a particular loco at a particular time of its life, the RCTS green book Part 2A will tell you precisely which donor model, or combination of the two, you need. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyrush Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 Thank you Kind Sir, but I already knew that none of the presently announced models can represent a March engine in the autumn of 1956 So my two will just have to run around with the incorrect washout plugs until I feel brave enough to get files and drills out Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Lamb Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 Hope that helps. If anyone is thinking of changing identity to a particular loco at a particular time of its life, the RCTS green book Part 2A will tell you precisely which donor model, or combination of the two, you need. 2B actually, and you left out a comment re the brakes. Complicated enough for my poor brain. Bernard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium great northern Posted December 18, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 18, 2012 2B actually, and you left out a comment re the brakes. Complicated enough for my poor brain. Bernard Sorry, another senior moment, I did mean 2B honest - it is sitting on the desk next to me now! I didn't go into the brake details, as no-one seems to be able to agree on it anyway, or certainly not as to which of the Part 4 engines had Westinghouse fittings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
45568 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Three went to their graves still with Dia 100 boilers, 1625/60/67. Caused me a little flutter for a moment Gilbert! I have plates for 61629, which I had noted as a B17/1 withdrawn in 9/1959. Checking 2B and Yeadon, I was right, this one also never received a 100A. It was however, (according to Yeadon), the first to acquire the new crest, with wrong forward-facing lion. A little more modelling for me then! Also it appears 61601/24 never had 100A either, (RCTS 2B). Awaiting 61637 to become 61629, and 61650 to become 61666! cheers, Peter C. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Of course the B1 was always the better engine. Oops. Anyone want to swap my weathered 61008 'Kudu' for, say, a weathered 'Manchester United'? Rob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium great northern Posted December 19, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 19, 2012 Caused me a little flutter for a moment Gilbert! I have plates for 61629, which I had noted as a B17/1 withdrawn in 9/1959. Checking 2B and Yeadon, I was right, this one also never received a 100A. It was however, (according to Yeadon), the first to acquire the new crest, with wrong forward-facing lion. A little more modelling for me then! Also it appears 61601/24 never had 100A either, (RCTS 2B). Awaiting 61637 to become 61629, and 61650 to become 61666! cheers, Peter C. Oh dear I will write out 1000 times " I must not rush things, particularly when trying to decypher small print." Wrong information is if anything worse than no information at all, so apologies to all. I don't know how I missed 1629, which i did know about, and I forgot the early withdrawals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted December 19, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 19, 2012 .......and I thought the "......what tender type did which particular Bullied Pacific have on such and such a date.....? game was fun! P @ 36E Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obi-Jiff Kenobi Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 ...Hope that helps. If anyone is thinking of changing identity to a particular loco at a particular time of its life, the RCTS green book Part 2B will tell you precisely which donor model, or combination of the two, you need. Certainly does help. I must pick up a copy. Perhaps I'll see one at St Albans next month, if I have any cash left after Christmas! ...All of the 2848-72 series, those named after football clubs, always had group standard tenders, except for 2830/61630 Tottenham Hotspur, which had the small GE type... So, am I right in thinking that (barring small detail differences) I could renumber Hornby's 2800 Sandringham and make all the Spurs fans in my family happy? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
45568 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 So, am I right in thinking that (barring small detail differences) I could renumber Hornby's 2800 Sandringham and make all the Spurs fans in my family happy? Well, sort of! 2830/61630 was renamed in 1/38. However it was vacuum brake only, so you would need to remove the W/house pump and pipework. It was rebuilt to B17/6 in 1950, so if you want a BR example I suggest buying 61637 and 61650, renumber 61650 to 61630, attach to 61637's tender. This leaves you with a B17/4 Footballer with a late crest 4200 gal. tender. I recommend 61667 Bradford, withdrawn 6/58, the only B17/4 survivor without W/house pump and pipework, although that may have had an early crest! Clear as mud?? :scratchhead: Cheers, Peter C. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
45568 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Oh dear I will write out 1000 times " I must not rush things, particularly when trying to decypher small print, and after a couple of warming single malt nightcaps." Wrong information is if anything worse than no information at all, so apologies to all. I don't know how I missed 1629, which i did know about, and I forgot the early withdrawals. I've edited your quote Gilbert, have one for me?!!? Cheers, Peter C. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obi-Jiff Kenobi Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Thanks for the answer, Peter. I should add I'm looking to make a pre-war LNER version of either of the Tottenham Hotspurs, for my eventual 1930s-set layout. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Downer Posted December 19, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 19, 2012 To add to the complexity, the Group Standard tenders given to the footballing B17/6s were themselves divided into riveted and welded versions. Of those that Hornby has announced Grimsby had the riveted, Barnsley and Man U the welded, so it'll be interesting to see if they're producing both variants. As for Tottenham, I'm planning to re-do the washout plugs on Thorpe Hall, and affix new nameplates to an old football+nameplate I picked up on eBay. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted December 19, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 19, 2012 Yes,Bernard,I've just picked up on that,thanks.Faith in 'delivery dates' has been well-tested. Hattons have mine 'on order' Now,to test the faith even further----will I see it before the Great End Of Year Shutdown ? Watch this space....... 'Order processed' from Hattons. Well, I never....... 'Grimsby Town' now a faint wisp of steam in the distance. 'Everybody Loves the Sound of A Train In the Distance' (Apologies to S&G) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Lamb Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Having had a chance to fondle one this morning I am even more impressed. Hornby have actually got the centre left hand splasher correctly spaced out from the others. Now that is attention to detail. Definately weakening, but still inclinded toward a ficticious Danbury Palace. Just read in 2B that 61653 at one time sported an A3 chimney. That would make a good talking point to fool the experts. Bernard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Grimsby Town and an 01 have just turned up. Both are beautiful in their own way. Give me 30 minutes or so and I'll post a few pics. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Here you go..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 A cracker!! I need a Hammers version too !! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 - Livery of LNER apple green with British Railways number and branding, and in this style (no curly 6s) is correct as per 61624 Lumley Castle. - GER Tender correct as per 61624 Lumley Castle. - Intended footballer name with GER tender correct as per 61630 Tottenham Hotspur. - Westinghouse pump on a footballer correct as per West Ham United. - Waiting on smokebox numberplate before fitting the replacement nameplates. 61679 a combination, therefore, of three different engines and their specific details, to create a "unique" B17/1 in British Railways branding. EDIT: should add, I added the lining out on the bufferbeam myself using HMRS transfers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 I too am in the middle of photos and presume that the large guard irons on LNER B17s were progressively replaced through the BR era. Could someone tell me if they were fitted to 'Thorpe Hall' c1957? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted December 21, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 21, 2012 In receipt of 'Grimsby Town' today ( Hattons at their finest---well done,Merseyside ). Excellent rendition of a GE icon.Please Mr. Kohler,can we do something about the tight packaging.? This offering is a health hazard to both model and owner alike.I fear some tragedies over the festive season. Otherwise looks good and moves well. Another winner.No more fiddling with the infernal plug,thanks be. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted December 22, 2012 Share Posted December 22, 2012 No problems with tight packaging on my 'Thorpe Hall'... duly photographed somehere approaching an East Anglian coastal town perhaps... Thompson third and composite leading. What lovely models! Rob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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