Hugh Flynn Posted November 24, 2010 Share Posted November 24, 2010 hi As a seller with 840 100% feedback i now have a seller giving me where is my item? he said wagons have not been delivered. So what i have done is contacted 4 other seller which sent him items now 3 have come back saying he tried this with them (one giving £100 back) he has now put a claim against me for payment do i say sod him give money back save hastle or any other? Hugh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K Posted November 24, 2010 Share Posted November 24, 2010 Were the goods sent by some sort of recorded delivery? Can you prove he signed for them? As far as I'm aware (possibly unfortunately for you), the contract with the carrier or postal service is the seller's, and so the goods remain your responsibility until safely delivered. It does sound as though the buyer is a chancer, given what other sellers have to say. Scrub that - if what you believe is true, he's not a chancer, he's a thief. If so, I hope you can prove it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RFS Posted November 24, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 24, 2010 Did you send it recorded-signed-for or obtain a certificate of posting? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted November 24, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 24, 2010 Report him to ebay as there is evidence of him doing it before and get him locked out while they investigate. If you send him the money and say sod it he will do it to more people. Unfortunately unless you use signed for delivery you cannot prove he has it, but also contact Royal Mail to see what you need to make a claim. Standard parcels are insured for £35 or so but they will need evidence from you and the other party, an official enquiry from RM might make him suddenly find it arrives Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonB Posted November 24, 2010 Share Posted November 24, 2010 At least put him into ebay's complaint system and ask your fellow "sufferers" to do the same. Tell him that you have done so! I lost out, some years ago when Paypal refunded the purchase price after I had posted the goods. Not used ebay since!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Flynn Posted November 24, 2010 Author Share Posted November 24, 2010 hi thanks all how do i report him and pass on my info (whats best way) no did not do recorded hugh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RFS Posted November 24, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 24, 2010 Compensation is £41 now (ie 100 first-class stamps). I'd tell him to certify that he hasn't received it by completing the Royal Mail form P58. If he makes a false statement he could be in deep trouble. You can get a copy from the Post Office or print out from here. P58 If you didn't do recorded do you have proof of posting? He will have to raise a case via the resolution centre so you should be able to respond to that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K Posted November 24, 2010 Share Posted November 24, 2010 no did not do recorded That's a shame, but there's still nothing to stop you and other sellers reporting a pattern of behaviour to Ebay. And as RFS says, ask him to fill out the form declaring officially that he hasn't received the goods. An honest guy would have no reason not to, but a cheat may start finding excuses, and if he does fill the form in dishonestly, he's committing fraud as well as theft. Also, how long have you waited before the goods were declared missing? If it's only a week or so, try asking for patience, and see where that gets you. Again, a chancer may not have the patience to wait too long. Funnily enough, last year I sold some stuff via RMWeb to an overseas buyer. They went missing (no suspicion of shady busines, I hasten to add). I looked on the Royal Mail site to see when I could claim compensation, and it was many weeks after the posting date. I realise that it's doubtless a shorter period for inland stuff, but you still need to give the post plenty of chance to arrive before you can claim. Like you, I'd be tempted to say "sod him", but if you can't prove wrongdoing, you'd effectively be saying "sod Ebay", too, as they'll probably pay his compensation from your account. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Flynn Posted November 24, 2010 Author Share Posted November 24, 2010 hi i am going to send claim form to him once i recieve this and once i recieve payment from RM i will give his money back? example from one seller Hi . I HAD THE SAME PROBLEM, HE TRYED TO SAY THE ITEMS HAD NOT ARRIVED (WELL OVER £100 I THINK) AND HE HAD SIGNED FOR THEM AND CLAIMED IT WASNT IS SIGNATURE UNTIL I INFORMED HIM, IS SIGNATURE WAS ON THE ROYAL MAIL WEBSITE HE ADMITTED RECEIVING THEM ABOUT 4 DAYS LATER BUT HE HAD ALREADY HAD THEM A WEEK.., I THOUGHT HE WAS A SCAMMER AT THE TIME HE WANTED ME TO SEND CHEAP PARCEL POST BUT I SENT RECORDED POST FOR MY OWN SAFTY. STEVE.. GOOD LUCK WITH HIM... IF YOU NEED AND MORE INFO CONTACT ME ON (e mail)I USE THIS EMAIL MORE, AS SOMETIME DONT CHECK THIS ONE AS CLOSING THIS EBAY/SITE THAT I USED IT FOR.. RECENTLY I HAVE HAD NOTHING BUT PROBLEMS MY SELF JUST HAD 6 CLAIMS FROM THE SAME PERSON FOR £324 HE HAD SIGNED AND LEFT POSITIVE FEEDBACK, I TOLD HIM I WAS GOING TO REPORT HIM TO THE POLICE THEN HE LATER RETRACTED THE CASES AND SAID SORRY WRONG PERSON! THERE ARE SOME BAD ONES OUT THERE BUT EBAY DONT CARE ABOUT THE SELLERS... hugh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K Posted November 24, 2010 Share Posted November 24, 2010 i am going to send claim form to him once i recieve this and once i recieve payment from RM i will give his money back? I wouldn't claim a penny from RM unless and until your buyer confirms in writing that he hasn't received the goods. After all, if your suspicions are true, you're effectively asking RM to pay this guy up front, for something that's not their problem. If and when you've gone through this process, consider paying the buyer back, but don't let yourself be pressured into refunding the money immediately. After all, cheats like this rely on the goodwill, and even feelings of guilt, that an honest guy like you will feel. Stand up to him, take your time to go through the processes carefully - and certainly let Ebay know of a possible pattern of dishonest behaviour - and he may well back right off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RFS Posted November 24, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 24, 2010 I would first of all go through the Ebay resolution centre on this. He will have raised a case and hence you will be asked to respond. If he hasn't raised a case, and is just demanding refund, then tell him to raise a case. If he's done this before I would have expected Ebay to have records of this. I'd also refer to these cases in your reply. I had an item go missing last year. I did send it recorded delivery and indeed it was never signed for. Where it went I've no idea but it was in the midst of the postal strikes. You have to wait 15 working days before RM will entertain a claim. Then they will need time to research. It could be RM tried to deliver, left a card and this guy has lost it. So it might be sitting at the post office, though given what you've said so far that sounds unlikely. In my case I made the buyer wait until I'd got the money back via RM. It wasn't too difficult in my case as I'd used recorded delivery and RM had no delivery signature. Assuming he paid via PayPal then you refund via PayPal as this results in your PayPal fees being refunded as well as the Ebay commission and listing fees. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Flynn Posted November 25, 2010 Author Share Posted November 25, 2010 hi he has tried to raise a case but ebay say its to soon? he said he has given me 2 days to sort but i have tried to ask for email details to send p58 form but he does not want to know? Hugh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wollastonblue Posted November 25, 2010 Share Posted November 25, 2010 Compensation is £41 now (ie 100 first-class stamps). I'd tell him to certify that he hasn't received it by completing the Royal Mail form P58. If he makes a false statement he could be in deep trouble. You can get a copy from the Post Office or print out from here. P58 If you didn't do recorded do you have proof of posting? He will have to raise a case via the resolution centre so you should be able to respond to that. Hugh, I had a similar thing like this last year. A guy said that he had not received an item, when I had sent it. I also made a note of the dimensions of the package. So spoke to the local sorting office, who said they would speak to the relevant person on the round. The called me back and told me where they had left the parcel. So I contacted the buyer and passed all the information to that I had from the Post Office. No as the buyer would not pay for Signed For, I sent it standard First Class, and as the sale of the item was less than the compensation offered by Royal Mail. I contacted the buyer, and told him that I would refund him the money upon receipt of the compensation from Royal Mail, and if they had any issues they would have take it up with eBay. But I also mentioned the form that RFS has mentioned, and he was quite abrupt with me, saying that he shouldn't have to fill one in, so if he had nothing to hide, what's the problem? Funnily enough, I never heard anything from him afterwards, and I never filed for compensation. Hope this helps Alex Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PaulCheffus Posted November 25, 2010 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 25, 2010 hi he has tried to raise a case but ebay say its to soon? he said he has given me 2 days to sort but i have tried to ask for email details to send p58 form but he does not want to know? Hugh Hi In that case I would wait until he raises the case with eBay. Him not wanting to accept the form to fill in is in my mind further strengthing your case. I would stick it out and go through the appropriate eBay channels. Cheers Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RFS Posted November 25, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 25, 2010 The buyer has no choice here - he must raise a case via the Ebay Resolution Centre. They will not allow a case to be raised until sufficient time has elapsed for the carrier (in this case Royal Mail) to deliver the package. RM won't accept a P58 until 15 working days have elapsed. The point of the buyer completing the P58 is that, by so doing, he is certifying non-receipt of the package, so if it's a fraudulent claim he is liable for the consequences. If he goes away I would report him to Ebay. I'd also retain his Ebay id and block him from bidding on any items you put up for sale in future. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted November 25, 2010 Share Posted November 25, 2010 Is the buyer just being impatient? Not quite the same but illustrates the problem: I have been told by our (reliable) decorator that he posted his quote last Thursday first class post. Yesterday it had not arrived and SWMBO is getting impatient. How long does it take for an item of post to travel 3 streets (I know he should of hand delivered) The fact is the item may still be in the system, we are well inside the Xmas postal rush and I expect the posties are as usual taking on temporary untrained staff. There is bound to be delays. I wonder if your buyer has the same erratic postal system as I do. I quite often receive items days or weeks after posting yet others seem to be flown in and arrive withing 24 hours. I also wonder if he will be so quick to let you know it has arrived and the panic is over. On the opposite side of the fence I recently won an item and received no less than 5 emails from the seller telling me to pay up or else - I do not sit on my bids waiting for the exact moment of the win so I can pay. I did pay within 2 days but the somewhat poor communication in the "reminders" will not help the final score. Because ebay give people this unreal impression of instant fix I think we all need to relax a bit and give folk more space, both buyers and sellers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hughes Posted November 25, 2010 Share Posted November 25, 2010 Sadly the message has to be never send anything to an eBay customer unless it's sent Recorded Delivery or equivalent. If a buyer doesn't want to pay for that, then don't deal with them; it's their look-out, not yours! In my experience most customers (and most postal staff) are honest, but there are some pretty unpleasant types out there too who seem to labour under the impression that they can cheat anyone they like with no come-back. Don't feed them! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Flynn Posted November 25, 2010 Author Share Posted November 25, 2010 hi thanks for all your comments i have found all previous sales that railway modellers are a good honest set of lads so i knew one day i would find someone to spoil it. This modeller might even be a member of this site (hopefully not) i have now recieved another e mail from previous sale who has had same problem with him. Hugh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hayfield Posted November 25, 2010 Share Posted November 25, 2010 Hugh Report him to Ebay and their Paypal friends, giving details from the other sellers and the fact that he does not want to fill in a RM form.Pity the other sellers just put up with his antics and did not report him Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K Posted November 26, 2010 Share Posted November 26, 2010 This modeller might even be a member of this site (hopefully not)i have now recieved another e mail from previous sale who has had same problem with him. Hang tight, Hugh - the evidence is starting to stack up, I feel. We must, of course, give the buyer some leeway, and not condemn him out of hand. However, RM will not pay you compensation until a certain amount of time has expired. Therefore, you and he will have to wait until that time is up, then (because recorded delivery was not used) the buyer will need to fill in the form to confirm that he has not received the goods, then you can apply to RM for compensation and then, after you get your money, pay the guy back. Then, of course, there's all the business with Ebay, but I don't have the experience to offer advice on that. If that sounds like telling you what to do, I apologise. You must, in the end, do whatever you feel best. However, you've asked for advice, and the best advice in this sort of case is always to do things by the book. I hop that I and others have been of some use. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Flynn Posted November 26, 2010 Author Share Posted November 26, 2010 hi its good to talk i have reported him to e bay other sellers have also done this, ok i will tell you ebay are not on sellers side?it seems they defend the buyer. i have sent him a e mail stating evidence i have, and willing to contact police ? lets see what happens as i will contact police if its not sorted. hugh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D802 FORMIDABLE Posted November 27, 2010 Share Posted November 27, 2010 Gday Hugh, I have found out the hard way now that I only pay or accept payment via paypal and will only send or recieve via registered/recorded mail as its the only real record/insurance you have against the dodgy ebayers that seem to be on the increase out there.. It is just sad that we have to think like that these days.. i hope things go well for you my friend cheers Anthony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kandc_au Posted November 27, 2010 Share Posted November 27, 2010 hi its good to talk i have reported him to e bay other sellers have also done this, ok i will tell you ebay are not on sellers side?it seems they defend the buyer. i have sent him a e mail stating evidence i have, and willing to contact police ? lets see what happens as i will contact police if its not sorted. hugh Hugh, As a predominant buyer on ebay, the responses I have had from ebay are the same as yours. Ebay are NOT interested if there is an issue. If they can pussyfoot about for as long as they can...they will. Being overseas from the UK I have had a few items not arrive. There is a couple that I do not beleibve even posted them, with stories changing until the complaint time limit was up. Not that it is any help to you for this but I would suggest sign for, for all items in the future....that way you are covered and so is the buyer. As for your current predicament I would go through the system and not just pay up. Even if you have the postage receipt it would be a help. If you pay up without a fight, it looks like you didn't post in the first instance. Good luck Khris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Flynn Posted November 27, 2010 Author Share Posted November 27, 2010 hi when ebay recieve these complaints they must have records that the same buyer has done a few and we (the sellers) cant all be wrong. But all i get from e bay is a automated message basically saying .give him his money back. wish i had never sold to this modeller. I will contact e bay and actually talk to them as they have not responded to my e mail (all ebay want is money not the problems) Hugh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kandc_au Posted November 27, 2010 Share Posted November 27, 2010 Lodge another complaint!! You are right...re ebay, that all they want is money and NOT problems. I would certainly say go through the whole process and let ebay sort it rather than just giving their m oney back. Bring into question the reputation if need be....even from a buyers poijunt of view it is these cretons that stuff it up for the majority. Khris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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