Red Devil Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Slight correction, it's WWWLWDD. The last two were draws with late equalisers. Had Stoke and Sunderland held onto their leads, Utd would be 7 points clear today and not 5. I'd prefer us to have 2 wins in hand (6 points plus) than 1 win in hand, plus if Chelsea had held on to that 1-1 scoreline, Utd could have been 9 points clear by now. Still that can't be changed now, but Utd fans can hope the Arse will do us a favour this coming weekend. . To be honest I didn't check it, I just lifted it! I had City down to drop points against Arsenal, but I'm not 100% sure now, the one where I can't see them getting full points is Newcastle away, we'll see. I think if United beat QPR it really will heap the pressure on City and nothing less than a win will do for them. Question is is RVP playing for a contract next year? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobby Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 (edited) Strange to think that I'd be disappointed with the Runners Up spot this year, when only three years ago we'd be happy to finish in the top half! But I think it's United's to lose now... Having said that I was talking to a few neutrals earlier in the week and they recon we've been so intent on outdoing each other in the league that both of us have taken the eye off the ball... Just the league title / runners up and nothing else is nothing to write home about for either club... I think they have a fair point... Edited April 3, 2012 by Hobby Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 (edited) Strange to think that I'd be disappointed with the Runners Up spot this year, when only three years ago we'd be happy to finish in the top half! But I think it's United's to lose now... Having said that I was talking to a few neutrals earlier in the week and they recon we've been so intent on outdoing each other in the league that both of us have taken the eye off the ball... Just the league title / runners up and nothing else is nothing to write home about for either club... I think they have a fair point... Sorry, but that's utterly delusional, city have four (major) trophies in 44 years (league in 68,CWC in 70, League cup in 76 and FA Cup last year), United a few more, but to say that winning the league (if we do) is a bad year is a joke. I'll take a bad year every year then please. You set off at the beginning of the season with 4 main cups to go for, can't think of anyone ever doing all four, 3 has only been done a couple of times (and the real treble only once ) the double a few times and the league, well you've done it twice, us a few more, so where does the outdoing each other bit come into it? By your own admission, 1/2nd is a huge improvement over what you normally used to do. Winning the league is something to write home about, ask Liverpool/Everton/Chelsea/Arsenal/Spurs/Newcastle/Villa fans if they'd like to have a season where it's 'nothing to write home about'? Sorry but it does smack of delusions of grandeur. Edited April 3, 2012 by Red Devil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold gwrrob Posted April 3, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 3, 2012 When Liverpool won the CL in 2005 they weren't even the best team in Liverpool let alone Europe as they finished below Everton.I would bet they would swap it for the league title again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobby Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Sorry, but that's utterly delusional, Think its you who's being delusional, being knocked out of the Cups/Europe as early as both our teams were was very poor, ok so we're both at the top of the Prem but I'd have expected both teams to have done better elsewhere... Nowt to do with delusions of grandeur, its what most people would have expected of both teams... I'd have said that your reply smacked of excuses rather than facing up to the fact that, Prem aside, we both had a bad season.... Unless you are lowering your standards all of a sudden... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Think its you who's being delusional, being knocked out of the Cups/Europe as early as both our teams were was very poor, ok so we're both at the top of the Prem but I'd have expected both teams to have done better elsewhere... Nowt to do with delusions of grandeur, its what most people would have expected of both teams... I'd have said that your reply smacked of excuses rather than facing up to the fact that, Prem aside, we both had a bad season.... Unless you are lowering your standards all of a sudden... No, not really, no divine right to sucess. United have been poor in Europe, but they have in the past too. Similarly the FA Cup, beat city, got knocked out by Liverpool, yeah really terrible! League Cup, knocked out by Palace with a reserve team predominantly, as is often the case. City, one season in the Champions league and you're going to win it? C'mon. So if you win the league you'll still maintain it's a poor season, or has it just become that way seeing as you're no longer favourites, having seemingly won it in January according to a large majority of your support? I'll maintain, whoever wins the league has had a sucessful season, if that's City fair enough, then Utd will not have had the best of years, but it'll be no worse than many other. As to your point about excuses, I don't remember making any, simple facts are on the day we got beaten by better side(s), it happens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted April 5, 2012 Author Share Posted April 5, 2012 (edited) Moving on from the City/United sideshow that has plagued this whole season for me (personally)... I'm watching the Championship a bit more at the minute, mostly because I'm surprised at what is being said about Alladyce and West Ham - "the West Ham way of football" - what is it exactly, and what is Alladyce doing different to the last three or four managers? Edited April 5, 2012 by S.A.C Martin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonny777 Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 When Liverpool won the CL in 2005 they weren't even the best team in Liverpool let alone Europe as they finished below Everton.I would bet they would swap it for the league title again. No. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Moving on from the City/United sideshow that has plagued this whole season for me (personally)... Well, you're going to be in for a few years of being plagued Don't blame us provincials, perhaps if one of the London teams could get their act together.,........... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted April 5, 2012 Author Share Posted April 5, 2012 Well, you're going to be in for a few years of being plagued Don't blame us provincials, perhaps if one of the London teams could get their act together.,........... We have (I hope...) I am praying and hoping we pick up enough points for automatic promotion over the next six matches. I think Chris Powell has deserved it with the season he's had - he took on 19 new players at the start of the season and turned them into a working squad. I've been so proud of Charlton Athletic this year. Really played as a team for the first time in years, and with the passion for the club that the fans share. And now I pray the squad is rewarded for their efforts, and the fans for their constant "will they, won't they" heart in mouth moments all this year...! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobby Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 No, not really, no divine right to sucess. You like putting words in my mouth don't you! I never said I expected to win anything, a good run in Europe/Cups and runners up in the Prem should have been on the cards as it is we got the former but didn't get the latter.... But the the point I made is quite simple, both clubs would have expected more out of this season than we got, the fact is neither of us got far in any competition except the Prem, beating us in one round of a cup is hardly compensation for a p**s poor showing in the rest of that competition and the other cups... You may keep saying that you are happy with the season, if so I suspect you are the only United fan/player/manager that is, I suspect Fergie will have some harsh but constructive words to say in the closed season, same as Mancini. A season to put down to experience... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 You like putting words in my mouth don't you! I never said I expected to win anything, a good run in Europe/Cups and runners up in the Prem should have been on the cards as it is we got the former but didn't get the latter.... But the the point I made is quite simple, both clubs would have expected more out of this season than we got, the fact is neither of us got far in any competition except the Prem, beating us in one round of a cup is hardly compensation for a p**s poor showing in the rest of that competition and the other cups... You may keep saying that you are happy with the season, if so I suspect you are the only United fan/player/manager that is, I suspect Fergie will have some harsh but constructive words to say in the closed season, same as Mancini. A season to put down to experience... If you say so.................... You obviously know so much more about it than me............... It must be great knowing the thoughts of all the United fans out there............ Fergie will do what he does best, carry on reinventing the Utd team, have a look at the change in it since 2008, is it as good, no, not yet, but I think you'll find that there's the nucleus of a new younger Utd, De Gea, Smalling, Jones, Da Saliva twins, Wellbeck, Cleverly, Hernandez, Pogba, pretty much all introduced over the last year or two... I'd go as far to say we're in transition, but that might be seen as an excuse for having a bad season................. I wonder if Mancini will even get the chance......... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Claude_Dreyfus Posted April 5, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 5, 2012 A good season for Pompey would have been survival in the Championship...now it is just survival full stop! I know it is all relative, but Man Utd and Man City have not really achieved anything great this season...merely fulfilling expectations given their fan bases and financial resources. Their limitations in Europe have been painfully clear this season, and I am not 100% sure if just buying better players will work in the near future. Arsenal and Chelsea have had okay seasons, but nothing much to right home about. Liverpool have won a cup, more than the majority of the teams in the top four will do this season, but most Liverpool fans will consider it an average season, punctuated with that nagging concern that King Kenny has dragged them back into the 80s in terms of play and attitude. Tottenham have had a good season, but it would not be surprising if the miss out on the third place that looked an almost certainty a few weeks ago. Success this season in the premiership? Swansea and Norwich, but we will see if they can maintain their style of play next season. Team of the season? I would argue either Southampton (through gritted teeth) and Charlton. They have good teams with two managers who definitely have a big future ahead of them. Whilst I accept that Pompey will go down - barring a miracle - I do hope we keep Appleton who has done wonders to even keep us in with a chance of survival after a number of key players were moved on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Colin Posted April 5, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 5, 2012 Moving on from the City/United sideshow that has plagued this whole season for me (personally)... I'm watching the Championship a bit more at the minute, mostly because I'm surprised at what is being said about Alladyce and West Ham - "the West Ham way of football" - what is it exactly, and what is Alladyce doing different to the last three or four managers? The cynic in me recalls "The West Ham Way" as habitually losing to lower division teams in cup competitions and, in the league, going down 1-0 at home after dominating play for 80 mins. I am however starting to have my doubts about Allardyce now - the Hammers seem to be choking and falling away at precisely the wrong time (unless you're a Reading fan!) Team selections are becoming hard to fathom out and they're certainly not playing well! Big Sam has certainly injected some fight into West Ham - a bit too much maybe when you look at the disciplinary record...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobby Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 (edited) Thanks, CD, it seems that it takes some United fans a long time to admit to themselves that they are not quite up to scratch this season, but he finally got there! Anyhow I'll look forward to next season as I think both teams will have learnt something from this one which bodes well for them... Da Saliva twins BTW RD, I take it you meant Da Silva twins, not Da Saliva twins! (PS Mancini will still be there I reckon!) Edited April 5, 2012 by Hobby Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Thanks, CD, it seems that it takes some United fans a long time to admit to themselves that they are not quite up to scratch this season, but he finally got there! Anyhow I'll look forward to next season as I think both teams will have learnt something from this one which bodes well for them... BTW RD, I take it you meant Da Silva twins, not Da Saliva twins! (PS Mancini will be there I reckon!) Nope, there's a difference between not being as good and not having a good season, as you intimated. The United side of 2012 isn't as good as the 2008 one, nor is as good as numerous other Utd teams, in fact plenty of my mates think it's probably the poorest United side of the Premiership era, so to be at the top of the league with a fair chance of winning it makes it a pretty good season in my book. Says alot for everyone else though....City included. I'll go and edit my, oh so funny typo, but seeing as you got the gist of it......... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobby Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 lol! Best post I've read for years, keep it up RD! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Claude_Dreyfus Posted April 5, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 5, 2012 (edited) The United side of 2012 isn't as good as the 2008 one, nor is as good as numerous other Utd teams, in fact plenty of my mates think it's probably the poorest United side of the Premiership era, so to be at the top of the league with a fair chance of winning it makes it a pretty good season in my book. Says alot for everyone else though....City included. I'm afraid it does say a lot about the standard of the Premiership at present. I agree that the current crop at Man Utd is the weakest for many years, and by rights should not be at the top of the league on their individual merits. But somehow they are, and deservedly so. What this tells us that Man City cannot shake their inconsitency and a nasty tendancy to play as 11 individuals as opposed to a single team - which to me has always been United's strongest point; helped by a force of nature as a manager who the players are genuinely scared of letting down. City have had the best chance to overhaul United, with better individual players. As it stands at the moment they have blown it, and should United strengthen this summer - along with Arsenal and Chelsea - then their best opportunity for many years to win the league may well be lost. Arsenal were painfully naive in the summer transfer window and payed the price heavily. It is testament to them and Wenger that they are now where they are and not still languishing somewhere mid table. Chelsea have also improved hugely over the last few weeks, suggesting that had both teams been a little more organised in the early stages of the season then things woudl have been much closer up there - note to Abramovich; sacking Ancelotti has a big mistake. There does seem to be the pattern that so many teams are missing. You can spend millions of pounds on top-quality players; but it is organisation and consistancy that wins leagues. United have these in abundance, and are winning the league. Newcastle have these this season; they are challenging for Europe. Swansea and Norwich have these; they are safe. Arsenal raced up the table when they had these over the last few months; Spurs had these at the beginning of the season and had a fantastic run. They lost them in early 2012 and lost a significant lead over Arsenal. Edited April 5, 2012 by Claude_Dreyfus 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 lol! Best post I've read for years, keep it up RD! Is it? Well this'll be my last one with you for a while. It's rather pointless trying to debate anything with you as patently you have all the answers and even when given facts to show that your mistaken, like your transfer spend nightmare, yep of course you're right there......... I'll leave it to you, as I really don't want to get this thread locked, as there's where it'll go if I carry on with you. So on that point. I'll let you get back to your laser blue world... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 I'm afraid it does say a lot about the standard of the Premiership at present. I agree that the current crop at Man Utd is the weakest for many years, and by rights should not be at the top of the league on their individual merits. But somehow they are, and deservedly so. What this tells us that Man City cannot shake their inconsitency and a nasty tendancy to play as 11 individuals as opposed to a single team - which to me has always been United's strongest point; helped by a force of nature as a manager who the players are genuinely scared of letting down. City have had the best chance to overhaul United, with better individual players. As it stands at the moment they have blown it, and should United strengthen this summer - along with Arsenal and Chelsea - then their best opportunity for many years to win the league may well be lost. Arsenal were painfully naive in the summer transfer window and payed the price heavily. It is testament to them and Wenger that they are now where they are and not still languishing somewhere mid table. Chelsea have also improved hugely over the last few weeks, suggesting that had both teams been a little more organised in the early stages of the season then things woudl have been much closer up there - note to Abramovich; sacking Ancelotti has a big mistake. There does seem to be the pattern that so many teams are missing. You can spend millions of pounds on top-quality players; but it is organisation and consistancy that wins leagues. United have these in abundance, and are winning the league. Newcastle have these this season; they are challenging for Europe. Swansea and Norwich have these; they are safe. Arsenal raced up the table when they had these over the last few months; Spurs had these at the beginning of the season and had a fantastic run. They lost them in early 2012 and lost a significant lead over Arsenal. Great post, nail on head. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobby Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 (edited) I'd also agree with CD, however I'd also add that Rome wasn't built in a day, so all might not be lost at City, if you compare last season with this there is a considerable difference in "team spirit", though I'd agree there is still a long way to go... To RD I'd just say that as a City Fan I know that we are not, nor ever have been, perfect, and am prepared to admit that we have our faults More than most!), just like every other team in the world, but its seems sometimes that some Utd fans find it rather hard to take or make any criticism of their team. I have no wish to fall out with you, my Dad was a lifelong Utd fan (long before you or I were born!) and I had similar discussions with him but never fell out as he was prepared to admit they weren't always the bee's knees. And you'll be pleased to know that I'll leave it at that as well. (I suspect this is one of those scenarios where it would never have got like this if we were face to face in the Pub over a pint or two... How I hate the "black and white" nature of Forums sometimes! I'll buy you a pint if i ever see you, RD, to make up... http://www.bluemoonb...gcompany.co.uk/ or http://www.flickr.co...N05/6193555341/ ?) Edited April 5, 2012 by Hobby Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 As fans, we're all hopelessly blinkered and biased, of course. If I ignored this thread every time I read some contentious comment I didn't agree with, I'd never read it at all. From my distant vantage point as a fan of the 5th best team in the league, all this City/Utd bickering is faintly amusing. Yes, the current Man U team might not be the strongest ever (would the Saliva twins actually make it into any other top-4 side? Probably not), but they're the best of this season's bad lot, and justifiably top of the table. City might occasionally seem like they're about to implode, but they're a darned good side, and fully deserving of the results that have seen them push their rivals all the way this year. I can't be done with all the silly rivalry where it's more important to hate the other team than support your own. Take the positives, guys, and ignore the brickbats! As for me, I'm consoling myself that I support the only British team to have done anything useful in Europe this year, even if Barcelona might be the end of the road for now... 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60026to Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 As long as Newcastle beat Swansea this afternoon and can stay above Chelsea for the rest of the season a: I'll win a few quid of a geezer in work and b: What a superb season for the Toon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dseagull Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 And I'll chip in with a late candidate for 'oddest website of the season' http://nonleaguedogs.tumblr.com/ Does what it says on the tin 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium kevinlms Posted April 7, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 7, 2012 Southend United (my home town), really managed to implode yesterday - down to 8 players at the final whistle. League One seems to be slipping away. Nothing unusual - forever toggling between the lower 2 divisions. Kevin Martin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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