edcayton Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 2 questions struck me in relation to any re-opening of the route into Tavistock :- Why was the Gunnislake spur given preference over a direct Tavistock link in Beeching days ? and given the distance from Gunnislake to Tavistock (4 miles) , does Gunnislake give a viable commuter link to Plymouth for the Tavistock community already ? As I understand it , it was due to the difficult crossing of the Tamsr, the only road bridge is single track. Sorry, don't know about the commuting situation, although if it was me then once in the car I'd stay in it and drive into Plymouth. Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwin_m Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 I am guessing this is an example of the Beeching-era thinking where they assumed that buses would replace local trains wherever possible. Tavistock has a direct road link to Plymouth, which wasn't congested at the time, so it was considered that the bus would be an adequate public transport provision. Due to the lack of road bridges over the estuaries, a bus service to Gunnislake (or indeed Bere Alston and Bere Ferrers) would have been very difficult. I rather doubt anybody would drive from Tavistock to Gunnislake to catch a train, since it is almost setting out in the wrong direction and the train journey from Gunnislake back to Bere Alston is slow. Even with the traffic jams it is probably better to head straight for Plymouth. However a train service to Tavistock might divert some people from the area between the two stations to park there rather than at Gunnislake, especially if the Tavistock service was significantly faster or more frequent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R A Watson Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 There should be no theoretical reason to stop the rebuilding of the line between Bere Alston and Okehampton excepting the replacement of a couple of bridges, but, the one at Tavi that passed over the main Gunnislake road was a very low height and obstructed the passage of large vehicles, this fact lead to it's removal many years ago. Any reopening would entail raising the track level many feet to give the required clearance, given that one end is on an embankment and the other is in a cutting this would be an engineering challenge (and don't forget the viaduct just a few hundred yards back down the line). This is the reason that the regularly re-appearing proposals to rebuild the line always put the new station on the Plymouth side of the former bridge. A line following the Southern route from the former junction at Lydford to Launceston is feasable excepting that it would have to pass through the A30 at right angles just outside Launceston and also the demolition of the creamery at Lifton leading to a world shortage of Ambrosia Creamed Rice! Any further expansion into North Corwall will entail the removal of the Launceston Stean Railway which is still expanding and is the only tourist attraction in the area. The line from Lydford to Okehanpton is a simple matter until you get to Meldon, the cost of strengthening the viaduct was one of the main reasons for the orginal line closure. A further problem is that this is not a single viaduct but two interlaced structures (up and down lines) which is/are a listed structure with no space available to build a replacement alongside, even if you were able to get permission, remember to allow for a listed structure in a National Park with the immediate valley being a registered Area Of Outstanding Natural Beauty in your applcation to the planners. Sorry, but yet again the enthusiasm of the press is raising expectations rather too high. Wally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted February 26, 2011 Share Posted February 26, 2011 leading to a world shortage of Ambrosia Creamed Rice! That's it the plans are off - but any chance we can run one through the middle of the Ginsters factory instead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Captain Kernow Posted February 26, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 26, 2011 That's it the plans are off - but any chance we can run one through the middle of the Ginsters factory instead? What, and lead to a world shortage of alleged Cornish pasties as well??!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R A Watson Posted February 26, 2011 Share Posted February 26, 2011 What, and lead to a world shortage of alleged Cornish pasties as well??!! Well under the E U ruling announced this week the things are made in Cornwall (at one of the Callington factories) and conform to the physical specifications. But, I did once, as an agency worker, spend a night in their Launceston factory packing "Yorkshire Puddings". It's strange world! Wally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 Also, don't forget that Meldon Viaduct was singled in the last few years of operation, due to concerns about the structure, and a 20 mph speed restriction imposed for the same reason. Its also a scheduled monument so nobody is going to be running trains over it in a hurry - you'd have to find an alternative way across. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edcayton Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 Its also a scheduled monument so nobody is going to be running trains over it in a hurry - you'd have to find an alternative way across. Why not? Isn't Ribblehead a scheduled monument too? Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 Why not? Isn't Ribblehead a scheduled monument too? Ed It's now a footpath, and it would require significant modification to carry modern trains (especially as a diversionary route Cornwall rather than just sprinters)). Ribblehead on the other hand is in constant use as a rail bridge so nboody has to argue about putting trains back on it. I wouldn't be surprised if a modern concrete horror wasn't cheaper or indeed a modified route. Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torn-on-the-platform Posted March 2, 2011 Share Posted March 2, 2011 It would be a shame, in my opinion, (and opinion is all it is!) to lose the heritage aspect of Oakhampton-Meldon. I'd love to watch regular steam cross that Viaduct in the future! I suppose however that the most likely way to see something like a Bulleid cross the viaduct would be on a mainline tour after reinstatement, rather than a heritage line slowly rebuilding the line and borrowing stock for short periods of time as it does now. I have just destroyed my own arguement and am now in favour of this devlopment! Now to restore Heathfield-Moretonhampstead - I could then get from Sheffield to Moretonhampstead in a few hours with only one change and no need for a bus or a lift at either end! I can dream can't I? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JohnR Posted March 2, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 2, 2011 Moretonhampstead was always a marginal closure in any case - I beleive David St. John Thomas made a good case for retaining it (and the Helston branch). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted March 2, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 2, 2011 One of the issues to running trains over Meldon viaduct would be sustrans, due to the cycle route. They don't seem to be very train friendly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R A Watson Posted March 2, 2011 Share Posted March 2, 2011 Further to my previous ramble about the problems of rebuilding Meldon viaduct can we also consider the fact that it is of a metal construction. mainly wrought iron I believe, but I open to correction on this, and it was the main reason why the Merchant Navies never came past Exeter. They were considered too heavy from their introduction and therefore banned from the line. I advise anyone advocating strengthening to look at the pictures of the undersde of the structure and then work out a scheme to reinforce it. Wally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Captain Kernow Posted March 2, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 2, 2011 We should at least, I suppose, be grateful that Meldon Viaduct is still with us, when you consider other metal viaducts we've lost, such as Belah on the Stainmore line, or Crumlin, Walnut Tree etc.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted January 31, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 31, 2013 New update here http://www.devon.gov.uk/index/transportroads/devon_local_transport_plan/tavistock-bere-alston-railway.htm thanks to Gateman 49 for posting it in the Devon railways section. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gateman49 Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 I've just sent in my questionnaire response by e mail (strongly in favour of course) so find a reason for supporting the proposal and join me! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Captain Kernow Posted January 31, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 31, 2013 (edited) I've long felt with this project that it's just a matter of 'when', not 'if'..... work continues in the background outside of this public consultation... Edited January 31, 2013 by Captain Kernow 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 "The layout at Bere Alston will be changed to facilitate the Tavistock service while maintaining service levels to Gunnislake. Upgrades may include alterations to the platforms, rail infrastructure and parking." Well, they DO neeed to do something about the parking at Bere Alston station; it's a strange pork chop of a shape, that fills up with parents dropping off and picking up the kids.. and strange orange-overalled types who sit on the bench on the platform and radio back to HQ that the clock is working... The layout at Bere Alston will be changed... Theirs, or mine? I'm sticking with P4:) How about a passing loop at Bere Ferrers Rail infrastructure; I think they'll need to reinstall a footbridge. A water tank and coal stage would be good My main concern is not to do with the railway at all (apart from the fact that the completion date is about 7 years off...), but the fact that the Plan also identifies that "... as many as 200 people may travel from Tavistock to Plymouth on the train between 8am and 9am". As many as that? To my mind, and my experience of loadings here in BA, for an additional 750 houses (they will call them homes... they're houses - the inhabitants make them their homes...), that's a tad optimistic, especially when they're being being serviced by "a simple shelter". Especially with Tavistock being a very wet place. And especially if you're planning to cascade the 142's down to us . Another thing is the cost... it's fine if you work in Plymouth (or Devonport..) but if you have to get the train and the bus to work, the car will always be the cheaper option... Still, it's a good thing. HURRY UP, CK! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 I've just sent in my questionnaire response by e mail (strongly in favour of course) so find a reason for supporting the proposal and join me! I shall be responding as soon as I can. Once the demands of the wage packet give me some free time.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted January 31, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 31, 2013 Got to say the use of the pacer as an image of modern rail transport made me grimace somewhat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Captain Kernow Posted January 31, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 31, 2013 Can't see Pacers being used on the Tavistock line, to be honest..... And yes, I'm being as quick as I can, Jan, it's the others....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmsforever Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 If you realy want to stir things up down in the darkest west why not suggest that HS3 is coming their way,HS2 is causing all sorts of probs up here.But are the houses being built in the near future and have NR got in focus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 And yes, I'm being as quick as I can, Jan, it's the others....... It always is, Captain... it always is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 (edited) If you realy want to stir things up down in the darkest west why not suggest that HS3 is coming their way,HS2 is causing all sorts of probs up here.But are the houses being built in the near future and have NR got in focus? We don't want to stir things up. We do want a regular rail connection to Plymouth (and points beyond). Apart from the gert lump of new houses (it appears that this is 50% of the total outlined in the current Local Plan) - which will probably need to be built within the timeframe of the railway (i.e. completion in 2020), I think we can safely say (according to the exhibition bumf) that Yes: Network Rail are in the loop. There are two few loops on this line! Edited January 31, 2013 by Jan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted February 1, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 1, 2013 Obviously it's too early to contemplate detail as we don't even have any confirmation of a Tavistock re-opening yet. However the issues to my mind include building in adequate track capacity to offer an hourly Tavistock service when traffic picks up (compare Alloa as an example of what can happen), not disadvantaging in any way those who use Calstock and Gunnislake stations whether that means trains split and attach at Bere Alston or they retain their own trains additional to a Tavistock service, siting the future Tavistock station at an accessible and meaningful location in terms of the town geography and then sourcing rolling stock which I would hope to be nothing lesser in quality than a 150 sprinter. Whether a loop is built at Bere Ferrers or Bere Alston some sort of crossing facility is almost certainly going to be needed unless the timetable is so infrequent as to require only one train working; that will surely not be an attractive option for those in Tavistock who already have a car or up to three buses an hour as alternative options. In my view nothing should be done which will significantly impede any long-term future reawakening of Tavistock - Okehampton. There are already some substantial blockages to that route but my concern is that nothing stupid is done such as selling the land Tavistock Viaduct occupies to buy a station site for instance. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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