DLT's NG Workbench - Back to The Hunslets

[DLT]

Interesting question Mr.Rockershovel, those are the quoted weights from Brown, Prideaux and Radcliffe?

Don Townsley's article quotes the Manning Wardles as 22.5 tons and the Baldwin as 20.5 tons in working order; and the Proposed 440 and 242 as 19 tons.

 

There has been discussion and modelling of the 2-4-2 design (in 4mm scale) over on the Narrow Gauge Online forum, but I don't recall seeing it on RMweb.

 

Cheers, Dave.

[PaulRhB]

Every history of the L&B I've read says the Baldwin was chosen because it could be delivered quickly compared to the other options.

The drawings make you realise how easily there could have been a completely different look to the prototype lines and how 'might have been' layouts and locos can create a real glimpse into alternative history of a known line too.

[DLT]

At long last, I've started building the new Hunslets, after years of talking about it!

 

First job, soldered four strips of brass together for the frames, marked outs and drilled/filed to shape.  Here they are layed over the drawing.

The axle slots have yet to be filed out.

 

 

Footplates have been cut from double-sided copperclad circuitboard (the fibreglass type)  These will form the basic structure of the model, with everything else attached.  

The boiler tube and smokebox I have had stored away for many years awaiting this project finding the light of day.

 

Likewise some of the boiler fittings.  The original plan had been to build four more of the L&B 4-4-0 proposal, but that never progressed. 

 

Cheers, Dave.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by DLT

[DLT]

Frames completed for now; axle slots filed out, plus rudimentary cutouts for the pony trucks.  These will be fully shaped later, when I've built the trucks...

May have to fire up the 75watt iron to separate the frames.

 

That's all for tonight,

Dave.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by DLT

[DLT]

All separated and cleaned up (that took a while) and one set of frames assembled for testing.

I can only assemble one at a time, coz I've only got one set of spacers.

 

Two 1/8" silver-steel rods fitted with bearing bushes and dropped into the axle slots for checking dimensions and parallel-ness.

All looking fine so far.

 

Next task, wheels & axles.

Cheers, Dave.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by DLT

[rockershovel]

Interesting question Mr.Rockershovel, those are the quoted weights from Brown, Prideaux and Radcliffe?

Don Townsley's article quotes the Manning Wardles as 22.5 tons and the Baldwin as 20.5 tons in working order; and the Proposed 440 and 242 as 19 tons.

 

There has been discussion and modelling of the 2-4-2 design (in 4mm scale) over on the Narrow Gauge Online forum, but I don't recall seeing it on RMweb.

 

Cheers, Dave.

Wikipedia describes the three original locomotives as 27.5 long tons, and Lyd as 25 long tons (= 25000 kg) (although other pages describe the Baldwin as 22 long tons, 25 short tons; which are the only figures I can find.

 

Given that Lyd and the Baldwin are both extant in reproduction form (the 762 Club page announces the delivery of the components for assembly, this very month) their weights must be accurately known. Perhaps someone with first hand knowledge of one or the other will be along presently to advise us?

Edited September 4, 2016 by rockershovel

[brack]

The cab corners they've removed on Lyd mustve been very heavy then!

Edited September 5, 2016 by brack

[DLT]

Next task, wheels & axles.

 

No, I tell a lie.  Spent a disproportionate amount of time cleaning out seized up Portescap RG4 gearboxes.

They've been in the drawer for years, and the lubricant was dried up.  Took a while to clean it all out and re-lubricate.

See:http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/78771-resurrecting-unused-portescaps/

Dave.

Edited September 5, 2016 by DLT

[rockershovel]

I've just had a quick glance at the "resurrecting old gearboxes" thread.

 

"Lifetime" in engineering terms means "design life", usually expressed in service hours. It may well carry the unstated corollary "will last as long as the rest of the unit" - Japanese motorcycles are often like this, when one part if it wears out, tne whole machine is worn out.

 

I usually treat claims of "lifetime sealed lubrication" as meaning "5 years regular use or 15 years intermittent or light use" or simply "until unit requires replacement due to wear of moving parts". The idea of items having indefinite serviceable lifetimes isn't really an engineering concept.

 

Same goes for the business about "lubricant turning to glue". I've had experience of racing motorcycles using methanol fuel and castor-based oil, and THAT will surely turn to jelly and worse quite quickly, if left in tne engine. They are much less common now, but OEM parts supplied to the US Army preserved in a wax compound (known as Cosmoline) still turn up good as new after many decades in storage. But, Cosmoline certainly isn't a lubricant, and the task of getting it off isn't for the faint-hearted.

 

Which is all a roundabout way of saying that when it comes to items left unused in ambient storage for many years, any original lubrication is pretty much irrelevant, except as a barrier layer

Edited September 5, 2016 by rockershovel

[DLT]

Having spent all that time on the portescaps, I can now continue.  Si here are some ingredients for the works:

Rejuvenated RG4, wheels from Alan Gibson (G484S, USA Dock Tank, 4'6" 11 spoke to be precise.  17.6mm diameter, a tad over 2'6" in 7mm)

Alan Gibson Outside Cranks & extended axle (steam, ref 5000)

 

Axles assembled, the brass tube on the non-driven axles is a bearing tube as the axle will rock slightly for compensation. (shock horror, yes I'm compensating a loco!)

 

 

Cheers, Dave.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by DLT

[DLT]

Cranks fitted to the leading axle using my trusty GW Models wheelpress, but I wanted to represent the counterweights on the rear axle.

I have a recipe for adding them using black plasticard, but I won't detail it until I'm satisfied with its durability.  The Gibson cranks are made of ABS, and I attached the plasticard with a solvent called Plastic Magic.  

It claims to bond Styrene, ABS, PVC, Plasticard etc, and it certainly seems to do "what it says on the tin".  

However, please can anyone advise on this question; will it permanently bond two DIFFERENT materials together, in this case Plasticard and ABS?

Many thanks Dave.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by DLT

[DLT]

The modified cranks went in the wheelpress without self-destructing, so I'm assuming they are a success.

 

Putting it on the track shows it down at the front end.  Measuring the axle slots showed that the front one was .3mm deeper than the rear.  Which fortunately is fine, as that's the rocking axle.

 

Sorry if this is getting a bit tedious and over-detailed, should be a bit simpler from now on.

Cheers, Dave.

Edited September 8, 2022 by DLT

[PaulRhB]

The modified cranks went in the wheelpress without self-destructing, so I'm assuming they are a success.

 

IMG_0412 small.jpg

 

Putting it on the track shows it down at the front end.  Measuring the axle slots showed that the front one was .3mm deeper than the rear.  Which fortunately is fine, as that's the rocking axle.

 

IMG_0403 small.jpg

 

Sorry if this is getting a bit tedious and over-detailed, should be a bit simpler from now on.

Cheers, Dave.

Dave, I may be far lazier than you, and avoid doing it myself unless absolutely unavoidable, but I do like seeing all this detail so post away

 

The rear counterweight looks spot on, if I hadn't read the detail I'd have thought it was part of the moulding!

[gz3xzf]

Dave, I may be far lazier than you, and avoid doing it myself unless absolutely unavoidable, but I do like seeing all this detail so post away

 

The rear counterweight looks spot on, if I hadn't read the detail I'd have thought it was part of the moulding!

 

Hear, hear, as someone getting back into the hobby over the last couple of years I for one am very interested in the detail.

[DLT]

Dave, I may be far lazier than you, and avoid doing it myself unless absolutely unavoidable, but I do like seeing all this detail so post away

 

The rear counterweight looks spot on, if I hadn't read the detail I'd have thought it was part of the moulding!

 

Lazy Paul?  You?  You've built more layouts than I have, and in a fraction of the time!

 

Hear, hear, as someone getting back into the hobby over the last couple of years I for one am very interested in the detail.

 

Thanks Bryan, always good to see someone "returning to the fold"

 

Many thanks for all the "likes" gents.

Dave.

[John M]

Nice to see a good step by step scratchbuild, I like the idea of PCB to strengthen the running board

[PaulRhB]

Lazy on the metalwork bits Dave my interests lie in other areas which I'll happily fiddle with for hours. Despite knowing how to do it and having a very good teacher I find chassis and track building too slow to retain focus Barrelling along with a pile of layout bits is more my style, or sitting down and just watching it with a drink

[DLT]

Nice to see a good step by step scratchbuild, I like the idea of PCB to strengthen the running board

 

Hi John,

The PCB isn't exactly strengthening the running board, it IS the running board!

It will be braced underneath to keep it flat, but everything else (cab, tanks, boiler, chassis) will be screwed to it.

at least, that's the plan at the moment....

Cheers, Dave.

[DLT]

Retaining the wheels in their slots requires some form of keeper plate, and the plan is to simplify matters by making this double-up as the pickup plate.

An "H" shaped piece of PCB was cut to fit between the frames, and retain the bearings.  

 

 

Later, the cosmetic springs will be mounted on the plate.

For frame spacers,I cut a strip of brass of the width that would just fit between the frames, making sure the edges were straight and the ends square.  "L" shaped spacers are very good, provided all angles are 90degrees they brace themselves and the frames in all direction.  So first job bend the end of the strip and cut off to length.

 

 

Then screwed to the pickup plate, ready to be fitted to the frames.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by DLT

[DLT]

The assembly was located in the chassis, and with the axles clamped in place, I tack-soldered the spacer to the frames and checked that everything was square and true.

 

Unfortunately when placed on the track (or a flat surface) the whole thing rocked!  Turned out that however careful I had been, some of the axle slots were of different depths.

Didn't take long to sort out (identifying the problem took a lot longer)  and once everything was square I added the compensation pivot, pickups and temporary wires to the motor terminals.

 

And believe it or not it works!  

Last night I took it to the Exeter Gauge 0 Group meeting, where it ran very nicely, all the way round our somewhat undulating test track, without stalling or falling off.  

 

Cheers, Dave.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by DLT

[DLT]

One of the problems with "make-it-up-as-you-go-along" modelling is that things you've already done can get in the way.

While this build has been designed in general, the detail has not.  I've found that the position I chose for the screwed spacers is in the way pf the permanent spacers, so I've had to move them before soldering.

Still, as this project is two supposedly identical locos, I can make the improvements for the second one.

Photos later.

 

Thanks for all the "likes" gents.

Cheers, Dave.

[DLT]

I've turned the motor round so that it now points backwards into the firebox.  The advantages of this is that the cutout under the boiler is hidden behind the sidetanks, and the front of the boiler can be filled with weight.

Obviously this takes the motor terminal a long way from the pickup plate, so a secondary piece of circuitboard is added to the rear framespacer, providing a mounting point for the "hardwires" to the motor terminals.

Two wires link this to the pickup plate, and it also adds a bit of "DCC Readiness", as it gives a location where a decoder can be added in to the circuit.

 

 

The motor is angled to just clear the inside of the boiler tube,  as can be seen in the last photos.

 

 

Cheers for now,

Dave.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by DLT

[DLT]

Apologies for lack of recent updates, but I've been sorting out a chassis for Darren01.

See here:  http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/64530-high-level-0-4-0-kit-and-the-virgin/page-4

[DLT]

I've started on the pony truck for the new Hunslet, not easy to design in isolating so its going to be a bit "trial & error" to begin with.  So I'm starting with a prototype that can be re-designed and refined.

First up, on of the trucks off Boadicea as a starting point, and two strips of brass marked out for bends and drilled to take pinpoint bearings.

 

Bent to shape with the bearings soldered in.

 

A bit of stiffening and a circuitboard pivot arm; and a trial fit to the chassis.  

The use of PCB makes it easy to cut, file, drill etc, and can be used for power transmission as I intend fitting some sort of pickup to the trucks.

 

 

Cheers for now

Dave.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by DLT

[DLT]

Chaos on the Workbench, there's a loco under construction in there somewhere!

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by DLT