Torn-on-the-platform Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 I see both sides of the argument. The owner can paint their loco whatever colour they like, and it does look particularly powerful in black! As already pointed out, we already have a BR green Britannia out there! Cromwell was the first Brit I have seen (in steam at least) but I wouldn't have been disappointed if it were black at the time. As it is one of the engines flying the flag for steam preservation out on the mainline however and it has a name, it should really run with its name plates so as to catch the public's attention. In unlined black, you could say its just another BR standard. However, if a member of the public were to walk through Victoria station on their way home and see a steam engine, they would probably mention it to their friends later on in the pub regardless of whether or not it had a name. I like it, it looks good and its something a little different. But then, I'm one of those people who would prefer to see 4472 in apple green, even if it has German smoke deflectors and a double chimney or 323 in its lovely blue take on the SECR livery. Caledonian Blue Fairburns are maybe a step too far though... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
APOLLO Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 Joking aside, I prefer a Brit looking like this than in the unlined green that was their lot towards the end. The last one I saw in 1966 had painted on names. What a come down after such a short life. I remember seeing 70015 APOLLO at Stockport Edgeley around 1967. She was quite clean, probably bulled up for a special. No name, not even painted, no front numberplate or shedplate, unlined, but the strangest thing was the almost pea green paint she wore. Def NOT the standard brunswick green. Mind you I remember that all the remaining Kingmoor Brits thundering through Wigan at that time were as black as the ace of spades. Downright filthy. A shame for these magnificent machines. I remember lying awake at night, listening for the chime whistle of a northbound Brit leaving Wigan NW around 10.00pm in the late 60's. Haunting sound. Talking of Brits with their distinctive chime whistles, I'm sure one of the Talyllyn steam locos has a Brit whistle - sure sounds like one ! (cant remember the loco). Brit15 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed-farms Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 At the end of the day this is only a temporary livery, by the time she appears at Llangollen next year she will be BR Green (not sure of which crest). Lets be thankful for people like Jeremy Hoskins who allow the loco groups to choose liveries and even change them during the 10 year tickets (see 60019 Bittern/4492 Dominion of New Zealand for a classic example of this). Personally I prefer the Brit's in green but the black has made a nice change. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 I quite like her in black, suits all the standard designs in my opinion. She's been like that for a while now so how you couldn't know about it is a bit of a mystery. I know it's a bit of a let down not seeing a loco in your favourite guise, but if I was to spend 300 odd quid on a railtour, I would find out what loco is booked to haul it and what condition it was in if it was a deal breaker. I do look forward to seeing two green Brits side by side when the time comes! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
royaloak Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 Wait until they finish it, I mean they havent painted the cab sides orange yet! Off to hide now! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold colin penfold Posted October 10, 2011 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted October 10, 2011 I quite like her in black, suits all the standard designs in my opinion. She's been like that for a while now so how you couldn't know about it is a bit of a mystery. I know it's a bit of a let down not seeing a loco in your favourite guise, but if I was to spend 300 odd quid on a railtour, I would find out what loco is booked to haul it and what condition it was in if it was a deal breaker. I do look forward to seeing two green Brits side by side when the time comes! Wait until they finish it, I mean they havent painted the cab sides orange yet! Off to hide now! Royal Oak I love your style. I wondered what sort of response I could stir up with my post and I have had a lot of fun watching the debate, but your comment wins hands down! Monty - as to the comments about the cost of the railtour I was simply saying to those who thought I wasn't entitled to an opinion because I didn't restore the loco, that being a paying customer definitely entitled me to an opinion as it is paying custmers that effectively pay for the preservationinsts to indulge their hobby. As it happens, the date (my wedding anniversary) was the important thing for me not the loco or the route. In fact we travelled from Norwich to join the tour. I don't ride on or photograph many railtours these days and we don't get many down my way so there's plenty of locos I have not seen. As it happens I did get out lineside to see oliver cromwell on a tour from London and it looked great in green (which is where I came in........) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
royaloak Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 Thank you Colin, I actually like it and feel that other locos should be painted in other (prototypical) liveries even if those liveries were not popular at the time. Variety is the spice of life etc. Now who is up for buying Hercules and putting her back into large logo! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold colin penfold Posted October 10, 2011 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted October 10, 2011 if it's variety you like here's a few controversial ones to keep the discussion going King 6023 in BR Blue 2.7.11 Mid Norfolk Rly GW Mogul 5322 in desert sand at Didcot 20.6.09 34027 Taw Valley at Cropredy 2.12.89 (Loco is fine but spot the intercity liveried "ETHEL") Refurbished CEP 1515 in Jaffa Cake livery at Sevington 28.7.86 47803 in yellow infrastrucure livery at Bishops Stortford 17.4.93 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigwelsh Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 Monty - as to the comments about the cost of the railtour I was simply saying to those who thought I wasn't entitled to an opinion because I didn't restore the loco, that being a paying customer definitely entitled me to an opinion as it is paying custmers that effectively pay for the preservationinsts to indulge their hobby. Not completely the case with Britannia, its basically been Jeremy Hosking putting his own money in to restore it with the cost of the railtour mainly being to actually pay for the rail tour! A bit of money will have gone to the loco owner but its not normally enough to pay for the next restoration. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmsforever Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 Like it black,why not the rust colour they were wore at the end of there lives at Carlisle. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Hamblin Posted October 15, 2011 Share Posted October 15, 2011 Going away from the livery debate - 70000 put in a rather impressive performance on Wednesday standing in for the unavailable Tornado on a VSOE trip to Bristol and back. Regards, Dan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
neal Posted October 15, 2011 Share Posted October 15, 2011 From its stay at Arley siding, for those who prefer it in green! N Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
45669 Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 This is what they were thinking Colin : http://www.flickr.co...57626904549565/ Ron. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mow Posted October 22, 2011 Share Posted October 22, 2011 Put it behind a King and you don't worry about the livery. I thought it was tucked behind the GWR engine this morning when it left Bristol. However, the following engine was Oliver Cromwell not Britannia. I couldn't see it clearly enough... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted November 4, 2011 Share Posted November 4, 2011 Hello all, the livery is correct for when 70000 first came out of Crewe, she carried it for about 6 months, OK it may have been matt black but it is correct for this loco. IIRC. if Riddels (is that spelt correctly?) had had his way he would have had all the MT locos painted in the old L.N.W.R. livery, so the Brits and Clans would have been painted in lined black along with the 2, 3, 4, 5,MTs. so the only B.R. "standard" that would have carried green would have been 71000. If we had not had the strike at Swindon that made 92220 the last steam loco built, we may hay seen the last 9F built at Crewe and turned out in full Ex L.N.W.R. blackberry black livery? Now that could look nice! Who knows, he may have gone back to the days of the red and green of the L.N.W.R. for the last three along with the blackberry black. As an aside IIRC Riddels started his working life as an L.N.W.R. man. All the above is conjecture. OzzyO. PS. still like the Brit in black. PPS. the Brit is to go into lined green roundabout Xmas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted November 4, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 4, 2011 the livery is correct for when 70000 first came out of Crewe, she carried it for about 6 months, OK it may have been matt black but it is correct for this loco. snipped OzzyO. Ah but the livery doesn't match the mechanical condition - so it must be wrong But so what - I've not seen the loco 'in theh flesh' and it doesn't really worry me what colour it's painted (as long as it isn't any version of BR biue ) and if the bloke who paid for the work wanted it black that's his choice and the best of luck to him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted November 4, 2011 Share Posted November 4, 2011 Ah but the livery doesn't match the mechanical condition - But it does match the mechanical condition NOW. OzzyO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted November 4, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 4, 2011 But it does match the mechanical condition NOW. OzzyO. That is absolutely undeniable Ozzy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pacific231G Posted November 5, 2011 Share Posted November 5, 2011 This always strikes me as being a bit like the people who get very unhappy when someone does an unusual version of Shakespeare- as if nobody will ever be able to a traditional version. During the course of its hopefully long life Britannia will probably appear in several paint schemes. I saw 70000 at the MHR gala on Sunday and I didn't find the black livery unattractive though I tend to associate it with goods locos (by the same token I always thought that Evening Star looked wrong in green) I'll probably prefer it in green when it reverts because all the best railways painted their passenger locos green and at least we don't have to contend with Nord brown. We're actually incredibly fortunate in this country to have so much preserved main line steam that there actually are Britannias (and Kings) in different colour schemes. Most preserved SG lines elsewhere seem to have to content themselves with one or two industrial tank locos. Even Germany with a larger population and plenty of enthusiasts has well fewer than half our total of working locos. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catkins Posted November 5, 2011 Share Posted November 5, 2011 This is what they were thinking Colin : http://www.flickr.co...57626904549565/ Ron. That is a brilliant picture. I like the idea of a "Brit" in mixed traffic black, but then I would like to see 6013? Tornado in BR steam Blue! And IMO Large Logo Blue is the best Livery Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckjumper Posted November 5, 2011 Share Posted November 5, 2011 Proper engine painting was done with a brush. 14 coats, with a rub down by hand before each one. Pity the manufacturers give us 'pristine' models in satin finish paint, that only started to appear with the advent of airless spray putting it onto diesels and washing machines taking it off again the following week. Or alternatively as early as 1925 when 4472, prior to its departure for the British Empire Exhibition at Wembley, was exhibited at an open day in the paint shop to which members of staff and their families were invited. 4472's paintwork was finished to a high gloss, but on the order of Gresley was flattened down to an eggshell finish as he disliked multiple reflections produced by the mirror-like brilliance. And much as I like the lined green, I think this black livery is rather smart. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom J Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 On the basis that I am intending to re-spray and detail a Dapol 'Brit' into this condition (having swapped the tender with 70013 to give it a late crest), can I ask a modelling question? What black paint do people think I ought to use? I appreciate that the original 1951 finish was not the same, but I am intent on modelling the prototype as it appeared in 2011! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Max Stafford Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 I reckon plain black with full electric lighting, Rail Alphabet numbers on the cabsides, warning flashes and a double arrow on the tender. It would remind me of what I might not have missed had history been a little different! Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RedgateModels Posted September 10, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 10, 2012 I like the idea of a "Brit" in mixed traffic black Nearest I can do Photo copyright Chris Nevard used with permission Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mow Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Took this whilst it was still in black without name plates running near Bath. http://www.flickr.com/photos/16582147@N07/6215034380/in/set-72157627701315023 This one from the WSR Gala. http://www.flickr.com/photos/16582147@N07/5564076964/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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