S.A.C Martin Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 New Railroad A1 Flying Scotsman So one of Hornby's 2012 range has arrived. Looking at the photographs, I have some mixed feelings, but the valve gear is infinitely superior to that which went before. Moulded buffers ala Tornado too, mind. Sliding roof vents are a surprise. Not 100% sure of my thoughts on the tender yet. Looks better than the old one, but still looks odd though I can't put my finger on why. Overall it looks good for the budget range. A much better product than the previous Railroad Scotsman, especially with that surprisingly fine valve gear. I wonder how much of the previous Tornado tooling may have been reused here? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldgunner Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Well, an obvious candidate for some kitbashing eh? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Tender still looks like the old tender drive version, very bulky e.g brake pull rods, moulded coal Loco looks a bit better it is however a strange mix of old and new mouldings Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidw Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Interesting but not high on my to buy list Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Is this the Mi-Fi version? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
frobisher Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Not 100% sure of my thoughts on the tender yet. Looks better than the old one, but still looks odd though I can't put my finger on why. The simplified lining is really not doing it any favours, could that be it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 They are also missing the shading to the lettering and misslocated white lining on the tender (which looks overheavy as well). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohmisterporter Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Gap between engine and tender looks good, unless this is simply a posed shot. Also not easy to see in the photos is the split line along the top of the boiler. This is a big improvement on my old FS. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 New Railroad A1 Flying Scotsman So one of Hornby's 2012 range has arrived. Looking at the photographs, I have some mixed feelings, but the valve gear is infinitely superior to that which went before. Moulded buffers ala Tornado too, mind. Sliding roof vents are a surprise. Not 100% sure of my thoughts on the tender yet. Looks better than the old one, but still looks odd though I can't put my finger on why. Overall it looks good for the budget range. A much better product than the previous Railroad Scotsman, especially with that surprisingly fine valve gear. I wonder how much of the previous Tornado tooling may have been reused here? I have similar feelings. The valve gear is the nicest touch. The Tornado as illustrated in Hornby's catalogue appears to have similar, and together with nicer paintwork on the better version of Tornado, that's quite a nice model. Perhaps it is a problem the the high standards being reached by the best 00 RTR models leave the cheaper more robust models, which would have passed muster ten years ago, looking decidedly inferior. edit: One wonders if the cost of such as the latest Hornby Fowler 2P 4-4-0 in lined BR black or S & D J R is partly because of the fine paintwork, which is the main thing lacking on the new Railroad Scotsman. I have bought one of the S & D 2Ps to haul three Bachmann LMS coaches in the hope that the coaches represent what they hauled c1929-30. Rob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
exet1095 Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 A quick bump up the list. I got one of these for Christmas. It runs brilliantly, and except when next to the high-fi Scotsman, pretty much looks the part. Only the top white line on the tender grabs the eye and spoils the look. Is this a suitable basis for a quick repaint into something that might have been seen in 1948-50? I am not sure if it is an A1 or A3, and I know the unconverted A1s became A10s, but were all converted by 1948. Is there a huge visible difference? Ideally, I would just like to reline the tender and boiler bands line, pick-out the detail and and glaze the cab and apply BRITISH RAILWAYS to the tender, leaving the apple green livery pretty much as is. Is there a suitable candidate for this? All answers gratefully received... The locomotive was on the GC, turned right at Woodford and got stuck on the WR after arriving at Oxford. Many thanks and Happy New Year, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted January 3, 2013 Author Share Posted January 3, 2013 Hi Paul, The chimney would need replacing as I believe it depicts the taller GNR version, which was replaced in all cases. The cab roof is the correct height and shape though, however the cabsides have no curved turn in and are straight (which is wrong, but understandable for a budget A1). Same thing appears on the tender sides. The model depicts a 180lb boiler for an A1 (note also that there are no superheater headers on the smokebox, ala the A3s). The locomotive portion of the model could therefore not portray 4472 in 1948/9 as it had been converted to an A3 by this point. The tender looks to be intended to be one of the earlier corridor tenders, so again not suitable for the A1s or A3s in 1948/9 when (off the top of my head) they all had either the standard eight wheel, beaded non corridor tender, an A4 streamlined non-corridor tender (which you would need for 4472 in 1948 most definitely) or the GNR coal rail eight wheeled tender. One user on RMweb has modelled "Sir Visto" in its 1946/7 LNER form by adding a GNR eight wheeled tender, replacing the chimney and sorting the lining out. It was quite a surprising transformation as far as I recall, one that really looked the part in my view. I think the Railroad Scotsman has lots of potential but it would require careful sourcing of parts and application of proper lining out. Add the later chimney type, superheater headers, and replace the washout plugs on the boiler, replace the moulded handrails, along with a new tender and full lining out, and a very decent mid-fi A3 Pacific emerges. But then my thought would be that getting the top of the range A1s and A3s second hand, and mixing and matching tenders to suit the locomotive identities you want, would be less time consuming overall. No doubt it would be a very enjoyable project to modify one of these though. I seriously considered it myself earlier in the year for a whole host of Gresley A1 and A3 Pacifics, but the overall cost of the extra components put me off. I dare say as a one off it would be worth doing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
exet1095 Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Thanks for the information SImon ( I hope that's right). I think my changes will be more low-fi but I will need to add the headers and find a new tender or body at least. I will look out, and see what it looks like with my Tornado tender to start with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted January 3, 2013 Author Share Posted January 3, 2013 Thanks for the information SImon ( I hope that's right). I think my changes will be more low-fi but I will need to add the headers and find a new tender or body at least. I will look out, and see what it looks like with my Tornado tender to start with. Hi Paul, You will definitely need a whole new tender - the frames are not suitable without major modification for the non corridor variants. The Tornado tender isn't suitable either, being a roller bearing variant. Best bet with the tenders is to find a second hand tender body from the older Hornby range on eBay or similar, together with the older style tender frames. The older non corridor body is too wide, so it would need cutting and shutting to produce the correct width one. Failing that, I think Dave Alexander does all the correct types as whitemetal kits. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
will5210 Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Here is the Scotsman conversion: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/gallery/image/37884-lner-a10-sir-visto/ Very effective it is too in my opinion Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted January 3, 2013 Author Share Posted January 3, 2013 Here is the Scotsman conversion: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/gallery/image/37884-lner-a10-sir-visto/ Very effective it is too in my opinion Brilliant, thanks Will. I was despairing earlier as I couldn't for the life of me find it! The only caveat I have on that otherwise excellent conversion are the tender frames. Ideally the tender frames should have the correct pattern rear steps for a non corridor tender, these being different to the curved, wrap around ones on the corridor tender. But the model itself really is rather exquisite in my opinion, and shows what can be made of the model. EDIT: Here's the finished article as posted by Kingfisher in the Waverley Route Models thread. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Quite a nice loco. Needs Black Buffers? I doubt if BR would have repainted them Red? and some additional lining at the base of the Firebox and around the Mudholes too. I wonder why Hornby used a modelled bracket above the expansion link when the rest of the valve gear appears to be id with the superdetail version. Cant tell from photos what Tender it is pulling, but it should have a Streamlined Non Corridor version until 1954 . There is a nice photo of her in Yeadon volume . I have a Flying Fox A1 waiting for the same conversion at mo too, this will have a repainted Mallard Tender too pull. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
will5210 Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Quite a nice loco. Needs Black Buffers? I doubt if BR would have repainted them Red? and some additional lining at the base of the Firebox and around the Mudholes too. I wonder why Hornby used a modelled bracket above the expansion link when the rest of the valve gear appears to be id with the superdetail version. Cant tell from photos what Tender it is pulling, but it should have a Streamlined Non Corridor version until 1954 . There is a nice photo of her in Yeadon volume . I have a Flying Fox A1 waiting for the same conversion at mo too, this will have a repainted Mallard Tender too pull. Yes that is the Tender its pulling. Alexander models body on the Hornby frames i believe. http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/gallery/image/37823-lner-e68-sir-visto/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Thanks for link. Another blog I have missed !!. Looks much better in the additional photos on the blog!. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaron14xx Posted March 26, 2013 Share Posted March 26, 2013 I'm still not sold on the Railroad Scotsman, Iv'e had 3 destroy themselves either to valve gear becoming jammed and snapping, or the motor stuff Up. However, this newer one looks like a massive improvement, but the lettering in my opinion needs to be the proper LNER lettering (the one with the red behind the gold. Other cheap models have it, so why not a $150 model??? Also, on my Scotsman (2011 or 2012) the tender has seperatly fitted hand rails and sprung buffers, this has neither. Why? Surely a "new" model should have these features! Espically considering the price Hornby sell it for in Australia! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren01 Posted March 26, 2013 Share Posted March 26, 2013 Hi How many times are Hornby going to keep bring this loco out,it's had more rebuilds than the real one! Darren Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 Hi How many times are Hornby going to keep bring this loco out,it's had more rebuilds than the real one! Darren A bit unfair on Hornby. They are a business after all! If it sells, you keep putting the model out. It seems to have sold well enough to justify a whole new Railroad model, that probably indicates the level of demand 4472 still has as a model. I've had a closer look at the 2012 Railroad model now and I'm um'ing and ah'ing over it, as it fits a lot of the criteria I wanted for some 1948/49 A3s, although would need the above described modifications to bring it into line with the rest of my Pacifics. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium phil-b259 Posted March 27, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 27, 2013 I'm still not sold on the Railroad Scotsman, Iv'e had 3 destroy themselves either to valve gear becoming jammed and snapping, or the motor stuff Up. However, this newer one looks like a massive improvement, but the lettering in my opinion needs to be the proper LNER lettering (the one with the red behind the gold. Other cheap models have it, so why not a $150 model??? Also, on my Scotsman (2011 or 2012) the tender has seperatly fitted hand rails and sprung buffers, this has neither. Why? Surely a "new" model should have these features! Espically considering the price Hornby sell it for in Australia! The clue is in the name Railroad. Hornby are on record saying that this range is deliberately less detailed model (using a different tooling from the standard range) and uses a simplified livery to reduce costs. Tornado is the only exception where the Railroad tooling was also released as a slightly more upmarket model - still with plenty of moulded on detail but a rather better pain finish and a few extra details added. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 The clue is in the name Railroad. Hornby are on record saying that this range is deliberately less detailed model (using a different tooling from the standard range) and uses a simplified livery to reduce costs. Tornado is the only exception where the Railroad tooling was also released as a slightly more upmarket model - still with plenty of moulded on detail but a rather better pain finish and a few extra details added. You see, I take the point about being less detailed for the Railroad range, but not where robustness is concerned. Previous models in the Railroad range (and current ones, at that) have had sprung, metal buffers which are extremely robust. The models in the Railroad range are meant to be robust, I thought, given their intended market is much younger and likely to be more robust with their playtime? I'm not a particularly hamfisted modeller (until I have a scalpel in my hands anyway) but the first thing I noted about the Railroad Tornado when it first came out, was just how flimsy the plastic buffers were. One on my sample had actually been damaged in transit. If we accept the Railroad range as a significant point of entry for youngsters into the hobby, we have to also accept that these models should be fit for purpose, which is being played with at high speed, round train set circuits and occasionally crashed for good fun. The older tender drive model (which became the previous Railroad 4472 model), though clearly not up to the look of the modern era of railway modelling, was at the very least robust in all areas. I have my doubts about the new one in this area, and I don't buy the "cheapness must also equal not robust enough" adage frankly. This means at the top and the bottom end of the model scales, Hornby are producing models not robust enough to actually be played with. That's not right, surely? It's something of a planned obsolescence for the bodyshell within a few minutes of a child owning the model. The current Railroad Evening Star model gets the balance absolutely right. Robust, moulded detail, sprung buffers and an exquisite mechanism. In my view, that's what the Railroad range should embody if it's target market is, as I always thought it was, the younger generation of railway modellers. Still, gives us older hands something to modify for our own purposes, eh? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaron14xx Posted May 9, 2013 Share Posted May 9, 2013 The clue is in the name Railroad. Hornby are on record saying that this range is deliberately less detailed model (using a different tooling from the standard range) and uses a simplified livery to reduce costs. Tornado is the only exception where the Railroad tooling was also released as a slightly more upmarket model - still with plenty of moulded on detail but a rather better pain finish and a few extra details added. The Hornby Railroad J52 gets the offset red and gold lettering right, has plenty of separatlly fitted handrails and sprung buffers, and its a bargain at $50 AUD, so why not a model 3 times it's price? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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