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Seacow, Dogfish,........or both?!


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The wagon at Bescot is a 16 tonner. I'm wondering if it was used for spoil, though, because if it was there would be slots in the sides a little over half-way up. I understand that this was done to prevent overloading, which had led to accidents in the past.

 

Chris

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The wagon at Bescot is a 16 tonner. I'm wondering if it was used for spoil, though, because if it was there would be slots in the sides a little over half-way up. I understand that this was done to prevent overloading, which had led to accidents in the past.

Chris

If the pic had been dated much earlier I would have said that the slots were still to be cut in that wagon but with a 1999 date (if correct - and it probably is) that clearly wouldn't be an explanation. So possibly it was used for other jobs but it's not easy to puzzle out what other than to say it could easily be overloaded if in use for spent ballast or spoil without the slots.

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The ZKV is a 27T Iron Ore Tippler. There were 1000 of these built and they were often used for stone traffic, and finally for spoil. They didn't have holes cut in like the 16T wagons for spoil use as they were much stronger

 

Can I have half a point for knowing about the spoil holes?!

 

Chris

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  • 3 weeks later...

Very handy thread this (again) can anyone provide other examples of formations? I take it spoil trains were loaded with a excavator, were they brought to the work site by road or rail? If by rail was it on a lowmac wagon? Just looking for ideas for short/more unusual variants on a ballast train

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In the example you offer the brake force created by the 37 and seacows would be plenty to stop the train under normal circumstances,

but in the event of a broken coupling in the dogfish portion there would be nothing to stop the dogfish running away as they would be unbraked.

For the train to be correctly formed the last 3 vehicles must have working brakes controllable from the loco, the above formation would be illegal.

 

cheers

All it needs is a brake van to be marshalled at the rear, there is no requirement for "the last 3 vehicles must have working brakes controllable from the loco", can you poiint me to this rule please because I have never heard of it, there is also no requirement for a brake van in the middle.

Can you explain how the last 3 vehicles would be braked from the loco on a partially fitted freight?

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Guest stuartp

All it needs is a brake van to be marshalled at the rear, there is no requirement for "the last 3 vehicles must have working brakes controllable from the loco", can you poiint me to this rule please because I have never heard of it, there is also no requirement for a brake van in the middle.

Can you explain how the last 3 vehicles would be braked from the loco on a partially fitted freight?

 

I think there are a couple of wires crossed here - the fact that the Dogfish would need a brake van at the rear is, I think, what Rivercider was getting at. The 'last three braked' rule applies on a fully fitted freight where one or more vehicles is piped or has the brakes isolated on that wagon. The brake must be continuous from loco to last vehicle, but not necessarily operating on every vehicle, provided it is operating on the last three. There must, however, be enough brake force available on the remaining vehicles. Engineers trains booked as Class 7 (45mph ?) but actually operating as Class 8s (35mph) were quite common on the ER around the time I took my pics, usually because one or more vehicles were piped or isolated.

 

The Shark in the middle wasn't an operating department requirement, it was done for the Engineers' convenience.

Edited by stuartp
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I have a rake of 7 dogfish, 3 seacows, 1 sealion and a shark in 7mm, plus a few ex boplates with a load of 4 wheeled wagons for another engineers train.

 

Ian G

post-3081-0-87330000-1331459554_thumb.jpg

post-3081-0-70436300-1331459665.jpg

Edited by Ian G
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I'm not the only one increasing knowlegde from this thread now then? I'd like to say i have the wagons to go with my 37 and Shark now to show you but having rather major cash flow issues at the moment.... watch this space and i'll get them one day, honest!

 

Cheers again for all the good info and pics guys.

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Update - they have no new stock and wont for the foreseeable future

 

Shame, as it's not a bad kit to build once you suss out how to keep it from riding high on the bogies.

 

Cue silly ebay prices......

 

Cheers,

Mick

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  • 2 weeks later...

I have some sandwich garnish! Picked up 2 secondhand ZKA 'Limpet' wagons today which can be hooked up after the shark. Just had a quick read back over the thread and found they're air braked so i'll probably now just look at a selection of Sealions to fill the sandwich and keep it simple without the seperate brake van.

 

What are the downsides (there's bound to be down sides!) with the old Lima model? With our household budget the way it is I have to look at the cheaper options than the brand new Sealions available. I'm more of a watching trains go by fan than a rivet counter anyway.

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There is nothing dramatically wrong with the Lima Sealion. The internal baffle plate is too big, it should only go half height and there should be mesh canopies over the handwheels that operate the chutes. Depending on era, there may have been issues with bogies but I certainly used them after fitting canopies and ballast loads. They can be made to look good if you paint / weather the chutes (metal silver with a light rust wash) and the inside of the hopper.

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There is nothing dramatically wrong with the Lima Sealion. The internal baffle plate is too big, it should only go half height and there should be mesh canopies over the handwheels that operate the chutes. Depending on era, there may have been issues with bogies but I certainly used them after fitting canopies and ballast loads. They can be made to look good if you paint / weather the chutes (metal silver with a light rust wash) and the inside of the hopper.

 

Thanks B&DB. To Ebay!

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  • 8 months later...

There is nothing dramatically wrong with the Lima Sealion. The internal baffle plate is too big, it should only go half height and there should be mesh canopies over the handwheels that operate the chutes. Depending on era, there may have been issues with bogies but I certainly used them after fitting canopies and ballast loads. They can be made to look good if you paint / weather the chutes (metal silver with a light rust wash) and the inside of the hopper.

I've got a few Lima sea cows that I've weathered and they look ok.

Great thread this, learning loads.

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