GWR Kites Croft - Strawberry Line in P4

[The Fatadder]

I think you are right, the station building and goods shed will have to go the whole hog on the B&E barge boards which as you say will completely set the scene.

 

I still haven't decided on the level crossing, Ideally I would like to include it, but as with the bridge I was planning for the other end of the layout I think the baseboards would need another 3 inches in length to fit the crossing in.  The question then becomes do I keep it off scene or shift the signal box. 

 

I assume that with no level crossing the signal box would still be on the platform rather than a full size box further down the line?

 

______

 

I have now build the baseboards, not without problems as the non solvent no nails I was using had very little grip.  At one point the whole backscene fell on my head as I was shifting the board off the work bench to clear the space to do the other one.  Also ran out of glue on the final joint so hopefully it has enough (the joint between end and side on the backscene still needs gluing, but can use the normal no nails for that.

 

Its so cold outside that I think it will take an age to dry, so will do a mock exam for a few hours and then go and check.  Fingers crossed it will be dry enough to move inside and start tracklaying...

[The Fatadder]

Just gone outside and checked the boards

 

The first one seemed ok, but the second had gaps appearing in the joints.  So I decided to switch them around to get the 2nd board into a better position to dry.  Got half way to the house, and the first board fell apart (the two backsceen parts).

 

I blame the solvent free glue that was needed for the foam, taking the solvent out of anything always makes it rubbish!!!

 

Anyway, the solution...

Use a solvent based no nails on all the wood to wood joints.  Plus took the board inside the house so it should dry quicker.

The second board has also  been reglued, along with some weights put on top to push the backscene onto the foam.  This one is still in the garage until my fiancée gets home to stop the cats escaping as I take the board through the front door.  One chase around the building site to get them back in the house is more than enough for one day!

 

Fingers crossed this time they dry, and on Saturday I can get on with some track building.........

 

 

Learnings:

While in principle I still think the integral backscene was a good concept, however it makes building the baseboard much more difficult, along with adding a lot of extra weight (negating the advantage of the foam baseboard)

I think were I to do this again I would go back to a 4 piece frame and add the backscene afterwards.

 

In the corners I did not add reinforcement, wanting the legs to fit square into the corners.  I think next time I would pre glue some square offcuts into the corners to give a greater area to bond to.

 

Still, its the best baseboard I've built by a long way!

 

Next job, add the alignment dowels...

[RailWest]

I find that the 'exterior' grade of Unibond No Nails has much better/faster grip than the interior grade (tho' curiously for an exterior product it cautions against using in wet locations!), but I certainly would not rely on it alone for baseboard construction. Nothing beats a few good, strong screws in strategic places! I usually put in some short screws of a smaller gauge first as 'locators', then remove them, apply the glue, then use the full-length/gauge screws to secure it all together - plus a liberal application of sash-cramps where possible. Does make it all rather heavy and not likely to be moved for a while!

 

As regards the signal-box, whilst (like most railway things!) there are always exceptions, it would be located normally in a spot that would provide a good view for the signalman, be operationally best, and minimise the amount of rodding required. Given that it /might/ also be manned by a signalman/porter with 'other duties' during quiet periods, then IMHO on or near the sidings end of the platform would be most likely. Certainly at least for the 'original' box - any later GWR replacement box might been placed differently for various reasons (eg change in operational requirements etc over time).

[The Fatadder]

Re adding screws, with this type of construction there really isn't anything for screws to cut into as they just spin in the foam.  The first side I did with screws to hold in position while the glue set, after which is switched to nails which were about as good but a lot quicker!

After an hour in the house, its all solid now.  Off into Bristol for my final mock top CIMA exam tomorrow (before Tuesday's exam), so when I get home I will try both boards up against each other, and hopefully fit the alignment dowels and bolts.  After which I can start track laying.

 

Thanks for the info on the signal box, going to dig out the books later and come up with some ideas....

 

The next decision is going to be if I stick with steel or switch to C&L's HiNi nickel silver.  I already have a pair of A6 points with steel rail, which should be able to be cleaned up and reused.  which would leave me needing 2 B6 points to finish off. 

 

Of course C&L don't yet have the point kits available (and no idea if the HiNi version would come on sale at the same time as steel).  While I have all the track bases I need (I think) along with what I hope are GW chairs, I don't think I have any rail.  One option is going to be building point work from scratch, some costing is going to be needed and then an order with C&L

 

Finally a question, I have always built Exactosale track by threading chairs onto the rail, then gluing to the bases, before cutting the webbing out and gluing to the layout.

 

This time I was hoping to go down a different route, glue the bases down to the layout and then when dry remove the webbing.  Paint, ballast, and then fit the chairs and rail. 

 

The hope being that this route would give a better standard of ballasting with less effort (plus allows me to get cracking with the track over the weekend before ordering the rail etc from C&L next week

[The Fatadder]

Quick check this morning, boards look in one piece and solid!

Will set it up this evening and double check...

 

Did a quick check last night and all the chairs I have are 3 bolt, so accuracy or money is the question.....

 

Going to do a quick calc later and see how many more bases I will need on top of the 20 60ft panels I already have...

[The Fatadder]

Well the baseboards appear to be in good condition, planning to buy more timber over the weekend to make some legs for them, and shift up into the model room so I can start work on construction.

 

Now know what I need to finish the straight track, so tomorrows job is to work out what I need in terms of points. Having found a load of spare point chairs in my spares box, I think I just need check chairs and short chairs along with long plastic sleepers in order to make my own points.

 

Tempted to do so and save a bit more on cost...

 

 

The big question for tonight, what industry should be served by the wagon turn table....

[The Fatadder]

Today the baseboards were finally bolted together,

 

Following this I glued down the templates and started to glue down track base. As previously mentioned I am 10 bases short, so there are still a fair few still to glue down.

 

I have also found a packet of exactoscale timber point sleepers, the intention is to start cutting these and gluing down later this evening. 

 

I have also had a slight rethink on the plan, loosing the wagon turntable and placing the goods shed in its place (matching the sheds position at a couple of stations on the branch)

 

The right hand side is going to have a road bridge, based on the one at Wookey, one thought for the scenic break on the left hand side is to put the station masters house, or a couple of workers cottages as a brake.  As a result of the bridge, this station will not have the level crossing that the prototype has...

 

 

 

 

So the question now is what to do with the other two sidings,

Option 1 is to have something (creamery, factory, coal dealer etc) where the goods shed was originally planned to be, and cattle pens on the stub siding on the front right hand side.

 

Option 2 would be to have the cattle pen either on the headshunt (back right), (Although this would block the other siding when loading),

The lower left siding remains as option 1, and lower right would be a loop line going to fiddle yard.  In this case there would be a large stone yard off scene to the right (along the lines of Sandford)

 

The third option, would be to site the cattle pens on lower left, with the rest following option 2.

 

Signal box wise, the rebuilt boxes at Sandford and Axebridge look pretty close to the new Ratio brick built GW signal box, so my thinking is to use one of these for the time being (with the long term aim being to replace with an S&F box)

 

Welcome feedback as always.

[RailWest]

If the "new Ratio kit" to which you refer is the one based on Blue Anchor, then that was a Type 7B. Sandford & Banwell was the same, whilst Axbridge was a 7D (so some slight differences), so ought to be a reasonable match. BA has its original 17-lever 'stud' frame, so certainly would be big enough for your layout.

[The Fatadder]

Thanks for the confirmation,

Will certainly do the job for time being, and certainly looked rather nice in the railway modeler review.

 

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Last night made a start on the point timbers, which should be finished this morning. Just need to make sure I get at least a small bit of revision done as well, the exam is tomorrow afterall...

 

[The Fatadder]

More progress...

 

I have made a start on the terrain, using another sheet of foam board.

 

This has been roughly cut to size and glued to the baseboard, these will be carved to shape once the glue is dry.  Then will get a good coat of filler to give a good surface for applying grass.

At the moment it looks a mess of course!

 

This also gives the core onto which the road bridge will be built, this is looking like being the next major task to get stuck into while I wait for the track bits.

 

I have also come to a decision on the rail type, last night I dismantled a couple of slightly damaged P4TC points, removing the check rails, Vees and switch rails.  There is a bit of surface rust, and I think the outer rails on the switch blades are slightly bent out of shape.

The thought is to strip theses down, probably unsolder the outer rails on the switch, and I have 2 points worth of components (cutting down on the cost of the track order).  I also found a couple of yards of unused steel rail, further reducing the cost!

 

[The Fatadder]

A little more work

 

First up the sleepers,

Before heading into Bristol on Tuesday for my Top CIMA exam, I made a start on painting the sleepers.  Starting with the plastic ones, I dry brushed a coat of phoenix sleeper grime brown. 

The wooden sleepers were a bit more involved, the first step being a coat of brown.

 

This afternoon I have started on phase 2, dry brushing a second coat of NSE dark grey to tone down the brown (and add a bit of shading to the wooden sleepers.)

 

Once that was dry, it was onto the pink foam embankment.  Onto the foam core that can be seen in the last photo set I roughly carved to shape, and then used the leftovers to extend the width a little further and get a shallower angle.

It now just needs some sanding, and it will be ready to start adding the filler. 

The final job of the day was cutting the opening in the Right (Cheddar) end, along with the design of the bridge. 

 

Now going away for the weekend (and will be away next weekend as well), so I suspect pace will now slowdown.  Really need to get that track ordered in the week, and to get some 2inch square timber to build a set of legs (and will finally be able to reclaim my dining room table.)  Which will please Helen no end (and will mean I can get the work bench back out and do some stock building again...)

 

[The Fatadder]

So its time to start ballasting.

 

Its been a while since I last ballasted a layout, however the plan was always that the next time I do some ballasting I would use the Klear method.

 

The big question is going to be what to use.

 

Looking at photos, there is a large size of ballast on the running lines, with very fine material between them.  In one photo it is very light ballast, the other very dark.  Aesthetically I much prefer the latter, so will be going with that using the C&L product.  With a fine woodland scenics ballast between the lines in light grey.  

 

The other question is going to be what to use for the yard, would this be ash or normal ballast? 

[The Fatadder]

Having laid the ballast earlier in the week, the need to reclaim the dining room table for entertaining tonight gave me the kick up the backside needed to get the ballasting started.

 

On Tuesday I made covered the first 3ft or so of track in Carrs ballast (believe its described as 4mm fine), I know some prefer to go with the finer N gauge stuff to get closer to the stone size of the prototype.  But to my eyes the slightly larger size of the Carrs product just looks more right.  The other reason is that between the tracks calls for a very fine ballast (for which I will likely be using Woodland Scenics N gauge).  If I was to go for the finer ballast for the running lines, not sure how I would get that contrast...

 

Moving on...

 

Once the ballast had been laid, the sleepers were carefully cleaned with a paint brush (baring in mind that I haven't fitted the rail yet, its even more important not to get ballast over the area to which the chair needs to be glued!)

 

I then sprayed with the usual mix of water with a dash of washing up liquid to dampen the track and hold it all in place, had a bit of an issue here with drying.  As by the time I got to the far side, there was a lot of dry areas (and I didn't want to respray and risk getting water over the bits that had already been stuck.

 

After wettening, once again I had to do another pass with the paint brush cleaning up, this was probably a key contributor to the drying as it did take a few minutes longer than I expected.

 

Finally, with a syringe I applied neet Johnsons Klear (the good stuff, not the new rebranded).  I have a 2lt glass bottle along with 2 plastic bottles of the stuff, to do this 3ft of track took half a cap full!  Will have plenty in stock to last me years!

After gluing, there was yet another clean of the sleepers.  This was a bit of a rush job as it was getting late and my patients was wearing thin!  

 

Now just have the rest of the layout to do...

[The Fatadder]

I've been doing a bit of thinking about the background to the layout, in particular thinking about the overall track plan (including the off scene), and given the now large difference between the layout and Draycott, I think I need a different name... 

 

I have come up with the off scene track work

 

The background: a first draft which will be improved...

 

When built by the Bristol & Exeter opening in 1869, the station at "zyx" simply had a through line with one siding serving the goods shed built in the B&E house style. 

The station was built in a similar style to that at Axebridge, and was built to a much greater size and stature than a small station would require as a result of the demands of local land owner the 3rd Baron Chuffnell, who insisted that if a station was to be built in the ancestral grounds it would dammed well look impressive.

 

After the line had been absorbed into the Great Western, the village had seen significant growth in traffic.  With the opening of a new branch and exchange sidings serving the Baron's quarrying interests to the south west of the village.  As a result, a loop line was added giving access to the exchange sidings, whilst adding an additional siding to serve the local villages freight needs...

Given its increased size and complexity, a signal box was added built to the standard GWR style of the time.

 

Anyway, enough nonsense.  The intention is to have something a little more fleshed out to go with the layout giving it a bit of history and background to explain a few of the oddities (in part why the alignment of the two lines is so much closer together than the norm on the Strawberry line, and the reason behind to over large station and the gw signal box)

 

My first question is the name,

I have found 4 village names near to the line which could be used.  Rodney Stoke, Hale Coppice, Kites Croft and Haybridge. Would welcome feedback on which to go for

 

My other question is on the signal box interior, Ive attached a very rough track plan below (can add pretty much anything to it if it would help assist making the signal box more plausible)

Would be interested to know what leavers I will need, and in what order.

[RailWest]

Not exactly a "loop", as you can't run a train in at one end and out the other!

Where do you propose to site the signal-box now?

In a simple form, probably about 16-20 levers, could be more if you have the RH end worked  by the SB.

Depending upon the imagined traffic levels, you could have the off-scene connection at the RH end worked from a local ground-frame. This might be necessary anyway, depending upon how far away you imagine it to be and the location of your SB.

How are disguising the 'exits' at each end?

[ullypug]

Given the larger villages near there are Rodney Stoke and Westbury-sub-Mendip, I'd go for one of those.

Alternatively, how about Nyland Hill or Wedmore Road?

[RailWest]

I have a vague recollection of once reading somewhere that Lodge Hill station was so called 'cos it was felt that calling it Westbury-sub-Mendip might lead to it being confused with Westbury (in Wilts). So maybe you should avoid that as well

[BG John]

I have a vague recollection of once reading somewhere that Lodge Hill station was so called 'cos it was felt that calling it Westbury-sub-Mendip might lead to it being confused with Westbury (in Wilts). So maybe you should avoid that as well

I have that vague recollection too. In fact I'm pretty sure I've read it somewhere!

[The Fatadder]

I had seen that re lodge / westbury in the cheddar books

 

I think Rodney Stoke looks to be the leader at the moment

[RailWest]

You sure it wouldn't make your layout sound like something out of "Only Fools & Horses" ????? 

[The Fatadder]

Now you say that I think I am going to have to change my mind, I wont be able to read the name in the same light...

[The Fatadder]

Today I passed my final CIMA exam, so after drinking probably more Champaign than I should Ive spent a good hour working on the layout while Helen cooked a celebratory meal.

 

The aim was to tackle the rest of the ground works, finishing off the shaping of the banks either side of the layout, along with the mound running along the back (this will have a hedge to further blend the gap between the layout and backscene)

 

On the right hand side there is a scrub area between the head shunt and the running line, I have lowered this area by about 10mm (at the lowest point) to give a gentle dip adding another feature to the terrain.

 

Everything was then given a coat of polyfiller to blend it all in,

 

The next decision to make is going to be what surface to have in the yard.  Along with the all important decision as to what the purpose of the lower siding will be, another idle thought the other day was to include a small creamery.  (liking the play on Strawberries & Cream)

 

Tomorrow I hope to finally buy a jar of GWR dark stone, so I can finish the painting on the signal box windows / woodwork. 

 

The purchase of the new car has knocked the modelling budget for six, putting another delay in getting the rest of the track bits.  Really need the rest of those track bases along with more ballast before I can make much more progress.  The remaining 8th of a jar of ballast I currently have is being kept to be mixed with the new stuff to get a good transition in colour between the ballast that has already been laid and the newly bought stuff...

 

 

[The Fatadder]

A little more work over the weekend, I popped across to the model shop in Yate yesterday with the aim of buying some paint (GW light and dark stone) to finish off the signal box.  Unfortunately their Phoenix range was very depleted (even worse than the last time I went there earlier in the year), and they didn't have the required colours.  So the signal box is now back on hold, probably until the Thornbury show in early May as I cant see myself making an order to a seller of paints before then...

 

However, what they did have was Carrs ballast.  So I snapped up a jar and have been able to get on with ballasting the remaining track.  This highlighted a couple of sleepers under which the paper templates had risen which would have resulted in uneven track.  The ballast was brushed out from between the sleepers and they have been carefully lifted and relaid before ballasting

As with the previous track, the ballast was poored over the track, before smooving off with a spare length of sleeper timber.  it was then brushed down to remove any loos parts from the sleeper tops. before carefully dropping on the Klear. 

 

 

 

The other job for the day was a little more work on the grass areas, these were given a quick coat of green paint from a tester pot found in the back of the garage.  The idea being to get an idea as to how the grass areas will look, and give a better base for applying the static grass later on.

A fair portion of this green area at the back of the layout is due to be covered in trees.  the priority here is to get the road bridge built and painted, after which the grass can start to be laid.

 

The other bit of work that's rising in importance now is the platform, the aim is to build a plywood core clad in SEF random stone, with a top surface from Wills slabs.

 

[The Fatadder]

Structural modelling time,

 

As previously mentioned there are two bits of railway civil engineering that need to be finished off in the initial stages of the layout, the bridge and the platform.

 

While I still haven't quite worked out how I will build the platform, I have made a start on the bridge.

 

For a prototype, I have used photos of a couple of structures including the bridge at Wookey.  Along with drawings from the OPC book "Bridges for Modellers" which has given the core dimensions, adjusting the look to add the details specific to the prototype.

 

It has a core of plasticard, clad in SouthEast Finecast embossed stone.

 

The arch supporting the roadway was added using embossed brick, the complexity of the bridge shape has caused a slight issue in that the fit of the brick infill is not perfect. (its at a slight angle making all the parts odd sized)  I think this can be fixed by filling the gap with squadron white filler, and then scribing on some more stone blocks to blend it into the existing plastic.   

 

Missing in the below photos is the stones which form the arch.  these were individually cut from plasticard and glued into place. 

 

What next?

The first job is going to be adding the curb, and any other road details.  Once finished and painted, it will be glued to the layout and I can sculpt the rest of the road to blend it into the curve of the bridge deck. 

 

It still needs the support building for the left hand side, this will have to wait until I order more embossed plastic.  Dammed annoying as I had been hoping to start painting. As it is I may well paint the bricks so at least I can get started.

 

Once I get it painted and fitted to the layout, work can commence on the grass. 

[tender]

Hi Rich,

Going back to post #32 you say you glued the templates and then the track base. Is that how it sounds, glue paper template to baseboard then timber tracks to template? If so what glue do you use. Presumably you then make up the trackwork in situ with rail and plastic chairs.

 

Ray.