Crewlisle Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 I had the correspondence below with Hornby Customer Care & Simon Kohler in early February. I think we should all wait until the definitive model appears in the shops or at an exhibition close to release before we start to criticise. My letter to Hornby Customer Care: I am delighted that you are introducing Duke of Gloucester (R3191) and intend to buy one. I accept that you are trying to cut costs from both a sales point of view and how much modellers are prepared to pay. However, looking at the front of your 2013 catalogue with a head on view of Duke of Gloucester I notice that the smoke deflector handrails are moulded, will be very noticeable and will spoil the overall looks of this impressive loco. I find it acceptable to mould pipework under the footplate and cab but I am sure you will get a lot of adverse publicity and reviews in the model press about the moulded smoke deflector hand rails. I would certainly expect wire handrails (even having to fit them myself) on the R3191, especially as there is a £40 price difference between the R3168 and R3191. Customer Care Reply: While the Duke of Gloucester has not yet been produced, I will certainly pass your feedback through to our Development team. While I cannot guarantee any changes will be made I am sure your feedback will be taken into consideration. Kind regards, Adam Jones Customer Care From Simon Kohler, Hornby Marketing Manager: Please let me assure you that the smoke deflectors on the Duke of Gloucester will be wire. The simple fact is that the model was received and I was so very pleased with the stage of development that I scrapped the original 2013 front cover and commissioned one which featured the “Duke.” The model photographed is the one that will be as per the RailRoad version so apologies for the mis-understanding. Whatever the case the “Duke of Gloucester” will be a terrific model and capable of hauling some pretty impressive length trains. Thanks for contacting me and I will speak to Adam accordingly. Kindest personal regards Simon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torn-on-the-platform Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 Very good of Simon to contact you personally with a clear and to the point answer! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 I agree, it is a relief that the better version models will have wire deflector handrails. Meanwhile I am still enjoying the outstanding various other models produced by Hornby and Bachmann, and look forward to seeing Hornby's new models, having just opened a TMC-weathered Hornby B1 ... and am amazed by the standard of modelling. Photo to come in appropriate B1 thread soon. Rob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldgunner Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 Can always swap out the railroad ones with a spare set of super detailed deflectors I guess. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldgunner Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 http://71000dukeofgloucester.blogspot.co.uk/2013/04/Hornby-and-oo-scale-models-following.html#links expected w/c 7th July. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Boar Fell Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 Hello Everyone, Having seen the prototypes in the flesh, I can confirm that it has got an adjustable tender draw bar system similar to the arrangement used on some Bachmann steam locos such as the Super D. The whole thing does look superb too, even the RailRoad one! Regards, Wild Boar Fell Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Multiple identity account 2 Posted May 1, 2013 Author Share Posted May 1, 2013 Hello Everyone, Having seen the prototypes in the flesh, I can confirm that it has got an adjustable tender draw bar system similar to the arrangement used on some Bachmann steam locos such as the Super D. The whole thing does look superb too, even the RailRoad one! Regards, Wild Boar Fell Ahhh wish you took a few pics of it!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted May 1, 2013 Share Posted May 1, 2013 If I was Hornby, the announcement would have been along the lines of, "As Duke of Gloucester was a one-off BR loco with potentially limited sales, it is being produced as part of our Railroad range only. It will have wire handrails on the boiler". The term 'Clever Design' would have been thrown out at the boardroom stage and replaced with 'Sensible Design'. With that out of the way, railway modellers would do what they normally do and super detail it themselves if they really wanted an innexpensive RTR model as a basis to work on rather than build a DJH loco kit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted May 1, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 1, 2013 If I was Hornby, the announcement would have been along the lines of, "As Duke of Gloucester was a one-off BR loco with potentially limited sales, it is being produced as part of our Railroad range only. It will have wire handrails on the boiler". The term 'Clever Design' would have been thrown out at the boardroom stage and replaced with 'Sensible Design'. With that out of the way, railway modellers would do what they normally do and super detail it themselves if they really wanted an innexpensive RTR model as a basis to work on rather than build a DJH loco kit. Spot on Coach - I'm afraid that in some circles the term 'design clever' could backfire on Hornby although it might be a different story at the toyshop level where gimmick terminology and buzzwords could be all the rage for all we know. This loco will I suppose be the one that provides the first test of whether or not the extra detail version is deemed by the market to be worth the extra cost but having in past years thrown away moulded smoke deflectors on LM locos going through a spot of titivating and replacing them with the etched variety I can't really see too much 'added value' in going only partway unless the thing comes with suitably thin deflectors in that version. Overall it will be interesting to see how it does sell but some retailers I know haven't rushed to Hornby with big orders for either this loco or the P2 because their customers haven't been knocking on their doors (but those same retailers could probably sell all the GW 8-coupled tanks or 2 BILs that they could lay their hands on - if they could get them). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
locoholic Posted May 1, 2013 Share Posted May 1, 2013 Is the Hornby model "as preserved", and if so, what would it take to backdate the model to (say) 1960? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RedgateModels Posted May 1, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 1, 2013 1960 would mean the BR1J tender - Golden Arrow do a resin version that fits a Hornby tender chassis. You'd struggle to match the paint finish though .... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted May 1, 2013 Share Posted May 1, 2013 .... The term 'Clever Design' would have been thrown out at the boardroom stage and replaced with 'Sensible Design'. With that out of the way, railway modellers would do what they normally do and super detail it themselves.... ...assuming, of course they could get the detailing bits specific to 71000, which would be a challenge in itself if you don't know where to look..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
miles73128 Posted May 1, 2013 Share Posted May 1, 2013 Spot on Coach - I'm afraid that in some circles the term 'design clever' could backfire on Hornby although it might be a different story at the toyshop level where gimmick terminology and buzzwords could be all the rage for all we know. This loco will I suppose be the one that provides the first test of whether or not the extra detail version is deemed by the market to be worth the extra cost but having in past years thrown away moulded smoke deflectors on LM locos going through a spot of titivating and replacing them with the etched variety I can't really see too much 'added value' in going only partway unless the thing comes with suitably thin deflectors in that version. Overall it will be interesting to see how it does sell but some retailers I know haven't rushed to Hornby with big orders for either this loco or the P2 because their customers haven't been knocking on their doors (but those same retailers could probably sell all the GW 8-coupled tanks or 2 BILs that they could lay their hands on - if they could get them). I went to Pre-order my D.O.G. a few days ago, from a large specialist retailer. I got one of the last they have available, having seen their advanced orders, I can tell you it's very popular at this store! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Lamb Posted May 1, 2013 Share Posted May 1, 2013 I went to Pre-order my D.O.G. a few days ago, from a large specialist retailer. I got one of the last they have available, having seen their advanced orders, I can tell you it's very popular at this store! They must have a rather good crystal ball. I seem to remember several retailers having their orders cut back on certain recent releases. Are you party to how many they have sold, and are aware that it is a large number, or are just saying that they have almost sold out of their allocation? Bernard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted May 1, 2013 Share Posted May 1, 2013 http://71000dukeofgloucester.blogspot.co.uk/2013/04/Hornby-and-oo-scale-models-following.html#links expected w/c 7th July. Warming to the Railroad Duke as it looks like a nice exercise for detailing and adding lining. The plastic buffers would definitely have to go though. They are horrible. They look thicker and more durable than the Tornado or Railroad Scotsman models though. Will be interesting to see the chassis and whether it follows previous models with brass bushes or the recent 42xx and 72xx without them. Not convinced by the super detail one yet, and won't be until I see the final spec model. Has been good to hear it'll have separate metal handrails on the deflectors however. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
miles73128 Posted May 1, 2013 Share Posted May 1, 2013 They must have a rather good crystal ball. I seem to remember several retailers having their orders cut back on certain recent releases. Are you party to how many they have sold, and are aware that it is a large number, or are just saying that they have almost sold out of their allocation? Bernard Hi Barnard. I saw the list of pre orders. It was long! I just squeezed in at the bottom. I'm guessing they know how manythey are getting! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted May 2, 2013 Share Posted May 2, 2013 Warming to the Railroad Duke as it looks like a nice exercise for detailing and adding lining. The plastic buffers would definitely have to go though. They are horrible. They look thicker and more durable than the Tornado or Railroad Scotsman models though. Will be interesting to see the chassis and whether it follows previous models with brass bushes or the recent 42xx and 72xx without them. Not convinced by the super detail one yet, and won't be until I see the final spec model. Has been good to hear it'll have separate metal handrails on the deflectors however. I wonder if the Duke will have a whistle as fragile and as nicely made as the Britannias? Design clever can probably get close, but it's a high bar... the Britannias are such good models. apologies this is also in a couple of other threads, but I like it.. Rob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted May 3, 2013 Share Posted May 3, 2013 Your picture above Rob, reminds me of one of George Heiron's paintings of a "Brit" at full chat. Very well done. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaymzHatstand Posted May 21, 2013 Share Posted May 21, 2013 For those who wish to know, I've just had an email from Hattons saying that they have a provisional delivery date of Monday 15th July. This is of course subject to change as all things are, but I thought it may be of interest to some of you! Cheers J Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
miles73128 Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 According to Hattons R3191 is now 07/10/13! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted May 31, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 31, 2013 According to Hattons R3191 is now 07/10/13! I presume that date is not in the US format? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
miles73128 Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 I presume that date is not in the US format? Sadly not! Thats UK 7th of October! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaymzHatstand Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 Yup, I got that email too. I thought the July date was a little optimistic! I'm in no great rush for it, I'd rather it took longer to arrive if its due to various tweaks to the finished product than it be rushed and be wrong/faulty! Cheers J Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
multivac Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 The moulded smoke box door central fixing looks even worse than usual. Bernard Wouldn't it be cheaper to produce a smokebox door with just a hole so we can fit the separate handles ourselves? The same could be said about the other moulded fittings too. Have a bag of bits for the modeller (remember those?) to fit.This design clever idea is just the 1980s all over again. Where did I put that chisel blade and the markits catalogue? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike tugsandsheds Posted June 10, 2013 Share Posted June 10, 2013 Well I've pre-ordered mine. Realy looking forward to it. Happy to wait till October, gives me some brearthing space financially. Only other purchases this year will be Arriva Trains Wales Class 67 x 2 and DBS 60 Will also allow me to get on with layout building !! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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