Bath Spa - High tech modelling: Bringing 1947 into the 21st century. 3d printed scenery, cnc milled track, laser cut baseboards and computer control

[Rabs]

I keep this first post up to date with a summary of where I am so far.  The layout design starts below, the final trackplan is on page 4 and the build starts in earnest on page 5.

 

 

This thread shows the design and building of my model of Bath GWR Station (Now called Bath Spa) in ~1947 pre-nationalisation.  

 

I chose Bath because:

• I wanted a mainline station in a short length and Bath, due to it's location on a bend in the Avon is naturally a very condensed station and so I don't need to apply much compression. (Thanks to Mike for his excellent suggestion for the station)
• I love the elevated trackwork on the arches

This view captures most of the stretch that I would like to model (albeit in its modern form):

 

There is a good plan of the trackwork c1925 here.  To the best of my knowledge the trackwork didn't change between then and the period I am modelling.

 

Map showing the major buildings and the strip that I am modelling from the Skew bridge at the western end of the station to the tunnel under Bathwick Hill:

 

The layout is in N and built on 8 modules, each 800mm by 400mm.  The most recent layout design is here:

 

And the trackplan (excluding staging area traversers) is:

 

I'm an engineer and my other hobby is building cnc machines, 3d printers, laser cutters and the like.   I am using these tools to help to build the layout and this means that there is a different flavour of construction to many layouts.  I am including features such as:

• Detailed layout design in CAD 
• Laser cut plywood baseboards which give all of the major contours, point motor mounts and module assembly
• 3D printed scenery and structures
• Wagon shunting with an under-board robotic arm and magnet
• CNC milled track bases for custom pointwork, designed in templot and assembled using fiNetrax N gauge code 40 components
• Stepper motor driven traverser in the staging area

The most recent photo of the first part of the layout is:

 
 

 

 
 

Edited November 26, 2013 by Rabs

[Fat Controller]

Would the wagon turntables still be in the post-WW2 period?

[Rabs]

Good question, I'd like to know the answer to that as well.  They are shown in the 1951 OS map and not on the 1968 OS map, so I believe that they would have been present in 1947.  To be honest I can't see how they could have anything else in the confined space and still have handled goods traffic.

 

Here are a couple of pictures of the proposed track layout and a satellite view of the line as it is today.

 

As you can see, to get continuous running I have had to 'bend' the eastern end of the station around on a tighter curve than in reality and then wrap the section immediately East of the river around before straightening up again towards the tunnel.  On the upside I can get about 90% of the real platform length in.  The station buildings and platform look short and fat in the last diagram, but it's just a result of warping the images to fit the curve, I do have space to model them almost to scale.

 

At this point I have a few decisions to make, and any input would be welcome:

 

• I can model the western goods area and the coal loading stages in full OR I can truncate it slightly and include a representation of Dorchester St and the tramway to the North station building - I don't have space for both.
• Because of the relatively tight curve I need over the river at the east end of the station I have had to move the point which gives access to the bay platform to the other side of the trailing crossover on the approach to the station. (Compare my plan with the official track plan linked above).  This means that local trains now have an unprototypical route to get to the westbound line.  So if anyone knows what this platform was used for I can make a choice on whether I can live with it or not.
• The tunnel makes an easy scenic break for the eastern end (top left on my plan) but does anyone have any bright ideas for how to dissappear into the fiddle yard at or near Skew bridge at the western end of the station (bottom left on my plan)?

 

 

 

Edited October 19, 2013 by Rabs

[Gruffalo]

I lived in Bath in the mid 60's and travelled to Plymouth regularly between 1966 - 1968. I do not remember any of the turntables being present at that time. This location has a lot of lovely modelling potential and, with the OP's chosen period, I look forward to seeing it progress. Regrettably, my size XXL paws preclude any attempt at less than 00 gauge so I envy anyone who can do N and a scale 800' station!

 

As for the western end and doing a disappearing trick, could you bring forward the eastern portal of Twerton tunnel - another Brunel inspired facade?

Edited June 2, 2013 by Gruffalo

[Fat Controller]

Good question, I'd like to know the answer to that as well.  They are shown in the 1951 OS map and not on the 1968 OS map, so I believe that they would have been present in 1947.  To be honest I can't see how they could have anything else in the confined space and still have handled goods traffic.

Wasn't the goods depot moved to a site west of the station on the Down side, possibly on the back of Government loans in the 1930s? In the 1970s, I recollect there being some facilities where the waste containers were loaded in more recent times.

[Peter Kazmierczak]

I remember seeing a picture of the "engine shed" at Bath Spa - it housed the horse that did the shunting there. Got a feeling the turntables were still used post-WW2.

[buffalo]

Wasn't the goods depot moved to a site west of the station on the Down side, possibly on the back of Government loans in the 1930s? In the 1970s, I recollect there being some facilities where the waste containers were loaded in more recent times.

The goods station to the west was opened in 1877 and the original engine shed was also moved from the station to this new site a few years later.

 

Would the wagon turntables still be in the post-WW2 period?

Both platforms were extended in 1960. The down side was extended to the east and the short turntable siding and it's three related sidings were removed at this time. Similarly, the up platform was extended to the west. The siding into the old goods shed/yard area and the curved section of platform were also removed to enable this. Whether the two tuntables at this end were still present, I'm not sure. There were further modifications to the track plan involving the centre lines and one of the crossovers a couple of years later.

 

Nick

[Tim V]

The trams ceased running in 1939, so most likely the rails were recovered shortly after.

[HillsideDepot]

The trams ceased running in 1939, so most likely the rails were recovered shortly after.

 

Maybe, maybe not. It wasn't until the road on Wellsway was completely rebuilt a few years ago (5 - 10 years at a guess) the tram lines were uncovered and removed from there (I am aware of one short length being rescued).

 

Very interesting layout concept. RA Cooke has January 1960 as the date of removal of the sidings (Up and Down) in his track layout diagrams book.

 

The BBC archive has this programme available from 1962 which has several minutes of Bath Spa about 13 minutes in but you'll probably want to watch it all as there are numerous wonderful shots from elsewhere on the Western http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p0120330/In_View_Men_of_Steam/

 

Looking forward to seeing this layout develop!

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Any ideas what the second to last coach on the departing train in the title sequence is? Is it one of Stanier's from the LMS Coronation Scot"?

[Rabs]

Maybe, maybe not. It wasn't until the road on Wellsway was completely rebuilt a few years ago (5 - 10 years at a guess) the tram lines were uncovered and removed from there (I am aware of one short length being rescued).

 

Very interesting layout concept. RA Cooke has January 1960 as the date of removal of the sidings (Up and Down) in his track layout diagrams book.

 

The BBC archive has this programme available from 1962 which has several minutes of Bath Spa about 13 minutes in but you'll probably want to watch it all as there are numerous wonderful shots from elsewhere on the Western http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p0120330/In_View_Men_of_Steam/

 

Looking forward to seeing this layout develop!

 

Thank you, those are both useful references.  

 

I'm allowing myself a little licence and will model the tramway as active, if I include it.  I know that it definitely wasn't running in 1947, but I'd like to have them and it's not so much of a stretch to think that the service might have restarted post war for a while.  As you say, I can almost certainly get away with laying the track - I just might have to only run the trams when nobody's looking!

Edited June 2, 2013 by Rabs

[Joseph_Pestell]

Good question, I'd like to know the answer to that as well.  They are shown in the 1951 OS map and not on the 1968 OS map, so I believe that they would have been present in 1947.  To be honest I can't see how they could have anything else in the confined space and still have handled goods traffic.

As per a thread that I started a few weeks back, be very careful about OS maps. For the lesser details, e.g. wagon turntables, they did not revise thoroughly. A 1930s map of Beattock still had the loco turntable in its pre 1912 position. So the 1951 map might well reflect the situation back in the 20s.

What date is the track diagram in Potts (OPC Historical Survey of GW Stations)?

[Joseph_Pestell]

As per a thread that I started a few weeks back, be very careful about OS maps. For the lesser details, e.g. wagon turntables, they did not revise thoroughly. A 1930s map of Beattock still had the loco turntable in its pre 1912 position. So the 1951 map might well reflect the situation back in the 20s.

What date is the track diagram in Potts (OPC Historical Survey of GW Stations)?

Just found that Bath is in Vol 4. But it is a 1925 trackplan.

[Rabs]

As per a thread that I started a few weeks back, be very careful about OS maps. For the lesser details, e.g. wagon turntables, they did not revise thoroughly. A 1930s map of Beattock still had the loco turntable in its pre 1912 position. So the 1951 map might well reflect the situation back in the 20s.

What date is the track diagram in Potts (OPC Historical Survey of GW Stations)?

 

A fair warning, thank you.  Now that I reread the thread I see that buffalo has already answered this specific point:

 

The goods station to the west was opened in 1877 and the original engine shed was also moved from the station to this new site a few years later.

 

Both platforms were extended in 1960. The down side was extended to the east and the short turntable siding and it's three related sidings were removed at this time. Similarly, the up platform was extended to the west. The siding into the old goods shed/yard area and the curved section of platform were also removed to enable this. Whether the two tuntables at this end were still present, I'm not sure. There were further modifications to the track plan involving the centre lines and one of the crossovers a couple of years later.

 

Nick

 

So it appears that the OS did get it right this time and that the sidings and turntables were removed in 1960.  Good to know - the station is much less interesting to model without them.  Not sure how I'm going to manage working horse shunting in N gauge though!

[Coach bogie]

Would the wagon turntables still be in the post-WW2 period?

A shunting horse was used until retired in 1959. It was used to shunt the wagons in the confined spaces at each end of Bath Spa Station. Locomotives could not easily do the job as there was only wagon turntables, not points to feed the unloading area. One of the duties was to shunt coal wagons to drop shutes, on the London bound side, which had a a small 50 cm-gauge wagon tramway system on the low level. The horse, named 'Prince' had his own "shed" which was demolished along with the removal of the turntables when the platforms were extended at each end in the 1960's.

 

An excellent shot of 'Prince' on shed, appears in Steam around Bath, Picture no. 4, Ivo Peters/Mike Arlett.

 

Contrary to above, from Global Rail News, the tramway was open until 1953. A wagon was discovered a few years back inside one of the archway storage areas.

 

http://www.globalrailnews.com/2011/06/06/network-rail-seeks-home-for-rare-german-wagon-from-bath-spa-station/

 

Bath's horse along with horse shunting in general was discussed here

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/56035-was-this-common/page-2

 

I look forward to seeing all those ex works engines on running in turns stabled in the middle roads.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[Rabs]

Thank you - I've just ordered Arlett and Peters' book.  

And good news on the tramway - that answers my choice of whether to shrink the goods shed a little to fit it in.

Edited June 4, 2013 by Rabs

[Rabs]

Does anyone know if and where I can get a surveyor's map or photos of the station area in the period 1920 to 1959?  I'm struggling to find out the heights of the various levels.  Particularly:

• track level
• level of the station approach and courtyard
• the gradient of Devonshire road
• Levels and gradients of the ramps around the goods areas on both the north and south sides

Most of the above I can get by visiting and measuring as the roads to the north don't seem to have changed, but the goods areas and all the land between the south station building and the river have changed completely and, apart from the OS maps (contours too far apart) and the town plans (no topography), I've not been able to find references to work from. With luck some of Ivo Peters' photos will help but does anyone have any other recommendations?

Edited June 4, 2013 by Rabs

[Fat Controller]

The relevant County Archive (Somerset?) may have something, as might the archives at the National Railway Museum.

[Tim V]

Look at Oldmaps, you should be able to get spot heights from the OS maps. Also somewhere on the net is a list of trig points and heights, when you put in your grid references, it'll give you the nearest heights.

[Gordon A]

Ask English Heritage at Swindon what information and aerial photos (RAF) that they hold.

 

Gordon A

Bristol

[Rabs]

Thank you both.  I have been using oldmaps (that's where my OS maps and town plans come from) but the topographical detail isn't anywhere close to what I need for the land immediately around the station because the contours are too far apart and the don't put spot heights in urban areas.  

An aerial photo from the time would be very useful - I'll look into that.

[Tim V]

Plenty of Bench Marks (not trig points - my mistake!).

 

Are you talking about this area? Picture dates from about 1971, shortly before these buildings were demolished. Don't ask me for any other pictures - I didn't take any others!

[Philip52LC]

Try the Titfield Thunderbolt bookshop on the outskirts of Bath, tel. no. 01225 700601. Its run by a local enthusiast and could well have some books or maps of the area. They may well have the local knowledge as well. Sadly I only moved into the area in 1984 so only know the station as it is now. They have a good website as well though a phone call might bring results.

 

Regards

 

Philip

[Tim V]

Just spotted on your plan that you are going to cross Pultney Road, here is the bridge (other pictures of the bridge are on the Bathintime site) taken just before it was demolished circa 1972. Top lock was a destination, as there were trips along the canal, I enjoyed one trip circa 1964. I was invited into the engine compartment of the Charlotte Dundas to start the engine - very thrilling for a nine year old.

[seahorse]

A bit before your period, but here is an aerial view from 1920

http://www.britainfromabove.org.uk/image/epw001161?search=bath&ref=1

Follow the "back to search" to see other views of Bath ( plus Matlock Bath and The British Bath Company!!)